Distance between buttons and cloth's edge on a sport coat

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by .Kurtz., Feb 8, 2012.

  1. .Kurtz.

    .Kurtz. Senior member

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    I've been researching for a while on this subject, but I can't find a specific rule; albeit I suspect there must be something (if it does, sure you boys know).
    The thing is that I own a sport coat which fits me really fine, but I'd be utterly happy if I could make it be just a little bit more taylored at the torso (when buttoned, I mean). I thought I could just move buttons 3/4 (inches) to the right (from 3/4 to 1 1/2). I've already moved the middle button just to try and the fit is perfect that way. Am I breaking any rule? The sport coat is rather "casual" (sort of moderate saharan jacket).

    Thank you very much.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2012


  2. greger

    greger Senior member

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    Yes the buttons can be moved somewhat. Sometimes if the person gains a little weight the shank on the button is sewn longer.
    Sometimes the side-seams are taken in or let out, but that is a lot more work.
     


  3. Sanguis Mortuum

    Sanguis Mortuum Senior member

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    Bear in mind that moving the buttons will technically make the front of the coat slightly asymmetrical, because you can't also move the corresponding buttons the same amount. You can probably get away with moving them a little bit but I'm not sure how much.
     


  4. .Kurtz.

    .Kurtz. Senior member

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    Thank you guys for your comments.



    That's right. Fortunately, pockets and darts remain symmetrical no matter what you do with the buttons. Main assymetrical object is the button itself (with regard to the natural axis of the garment), which is hardly noticeable since only one button is to be fastened.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012


  5. Sanguis Mortuum

    Sanguis Mortuum Senior member

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    The entire front will be asymmetrical because the center-front is being pulled off-center.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012


  6. .Kurtz.

    .Kurtz. Senior member

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    Actually, I don't think so. I simulated the movement in a drawing (I know, I know...; more nerd bonus points) and button is the only asymmetric thing in the final layout. Overall set rebalances itself (V on the neck, pockets, darts...), only with a slight more (sort of) "double-breast effect".

    [​IMG]


    Or, going realistic, considering shoulders as an immutable measure...

    [​IMG]
     


  7. Artking3

    Artking3 Senior member

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    It's going to turn out wrong, but it's your jacket. Ignore everyones advice and go for it.
     


  8. .Kurtz.

    .Kurtz. Senior member

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    Advice was being rather permissive up to then...:



    ...when you came. But you weren't then, when I posted the post you quote. And you're not "everyone" for sure (albeit you represent 33%, I admit; 25% if counting me):




    Debating isn't ignoring, btw (actually, I'd say it's just the opposite).
     


  9. Edge89

    Edge89 Active Member

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    You're right. The only thing that will be off center is the button. the center front lines on each piece of the jacket (the left and right front pieces) will each be pulled an equal amount in opposite directions and everything else will remain symmetrical. It might be a little weird looking, depending on how much you move the button, but if it looks fine to you, just do it. I doubt anybody will notice.
     


  10. Steve Smith

    Steve Smith Senior member

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    ^ I disagree. The asymmetry may be so subtle that no one will notice, but it will be there. I come to this conclusion by visualizing moving the button a foot in either direction (imagining that there is material there to widen by one foot). It would throw the jacket horribly out of whack. If this is true for a large movement of the button then it is true for a small movement. The only difference is a matter of degree.

    In order to maintain symmetry, the buttonhole would have to be moved in coordination with the button.

    Anyway, interesting exercise and if someone wants to refute what I wrote here I would be interested to hear where I went wrong.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2012


  11. Artking3

    Artking3 Senior member

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    This is all theory anyway. We should have the OP go ahead with the alterations as a practical exercise.
     


  12. .Kurtz.

    .Kurtz. Senior member

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    IMO, key factor is what elements are to consider when evaluating symmetry. Pockets, seams and V on the neck vertex are always symmetric. We must have into account that the axis is in the middle of the shoulders; and pockets are in a fixed location with regard to its corresponding shoulder's vertex. This way, when you overlap (even a foot), shoulders approach to each other but so are pockets and sides. This happens regardless buttonhole not being moved.
    On the other hand, considering other elements as button and overlapped fabric, asymmetry do increase progressively as we displace button; indeed. Consensus about button is clear, but... what happens with overlapped material? Obviously, it does enlarge; yes. The thing is that all jackets are asymmetric at that point, so it doesn't materializes when moving button; it just increases. That's why I referred to it as "double breast effect" (because, since every single buttonable garment is asymmetric at the overlaped portion, double breasted jackets are the maximum expression of it). Of course, it would look rather weird in a regular jacket, as double breasted jackets are a completely different animal.
     


  13. .Kurtz.

    .Kurtz. Senior member

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    Oh, I did it as a trial (as mentioned in the first post). Symmetry (except for buttons) and fit are OK. Only weird issues are buttons' symmetry and distance between them and cloth's edge.

    Finally, I must admit that I'll probably go back to its original condition. Button asymmetry is not that noticeable, but neither is fit improvement. So, I think I'll feel better (peace of mind wise) knowing everything's perfectly aligned.
     


  14. Steve Smith

    Steve Smith Senior member

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    It's not theoretical at all. I just laid out a 38S 1818 Fitz suit jacket and moved the buttonhole to where it would be if the button were moved 6 inches across the jacket. Now the left side of the jacket overlaps the right front pocket. Worn like this the right front panel of the jacket is about six inches wide (to the side seam) while the left panel is 12 inches wide. If put on a body, the left side seam would be coming around onto the front of the jacket as worn. Don't be confused by the fact that a double breasted jacket has overlap in the front. This is not symmetrical.
     


  15. GBR

    GBR Senior member

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    If you are happy to wear it, then all these drawings are totally unnecessary.

    Others can laugh it the issues at their choice.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2012


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