Desperately Need some legal advice re: My Credit Report/Score

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by FStyles, Apr 21, 2010.

  1. Duff_Man

    Duff_Man Senior member

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    Wait, this is originally due to a T-Mobile fuck up? Can't you sue them for credit libel if that is the case?
     


  2. Tarmac

    Tarmac Senior member

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    sue a multinational corporation for "libel" because a phone jock forgot to push cancel on your account? no.
     


  3. Eason

    Eason Bicurious Racist

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    I like how everyone here is trying to push this as the OP's fault as if he legitimately owes them the money. StyleForum is THE MAN!
     


  4. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior member

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    Alright, this is what you could do:

    Write the bastard t-mobile corporation a letter and include these contents:

    Tell them that you are happy to pay the lawfully owed financial obligations upon receipt of these three items in your mail.

    1. validation of the owed debt (actual accounting figures)
    2. verification of their claim against you (a sworn affidavit or a signed true invoice)
    3. a full disclosure copy of the contract binding both parties.

    If they cannot provide these documents then you have no true obligation to pay.

    And if these corporate thugs sick their 3rd party collection agencies and/or lawyers on you, you are not obligated to reply them, unless you are being served..which is a different matter. They have nothing to do with you and t-mobile and have NO jurisdiction over you, period, if they do try to contact you, you make sure you let them know they have nothing to do with 'the person in question'.

    I urge you to learn your 'common law rights' and 'contract law' as they will help you in incidents like these where these doucheb's are trying to take advantage of good people, if you want some more info, you can PM me.



    No offence, but this sounds suspiciously like some "freeman on the land" stuff.

    FStyles would have been given a copy of the contract binding both parties when he signed the initial contract several years ago - y'know, when he signed up to a phone plan? And he's been advised of the amount that he owes, in telephone bills. He acknowledges that.

    And what does "actual accounting figures" mean, anyway? A copy of the company's profit and loss statements? The amount that it actually cost them to provide him with a service? They're under no obligation to provide those figures to him. When you go to buy your groceries, do you go up to the checkout operator and say to him/her, "You've charged me $10 for this big sack of potatoes. Before I pay for it, can you please show me the actual cost that you incurred in obtaining these potatoes and in stocking them so that I can purchase them? Also, when you present me with the invoice for my groceries, can you please sign the invoice, otherwise I do not consider it to be a valid invoice and I will not consider that I need to pay you."?

    I think that FStyles is looking for some useful, practical advice, not something that will have him running around in circles engaged in a fruitless and frustrating exchange of paper with a large company.
     


  5. FStyles

    FStyles Senior member

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    FIRST off, thanks to EVERYONE who is responding, positive or negative. I knew I'd get a mixed bag, and most of this is helpful.

    I repeat again: Its not the money. I'd pay tripe or 5x the amount to get it wiped NOW.


    Not legal advice and do not rely on the following, anybody:

    I seem to recall reading some unreliable sources (and can not comment whether they are correct)that say with respect to your credit score, you may do more harm than good paying old debts off. Something to do with making it current again.


    Yep, exactly what I've heard. They don't have a carrot to dangle in front of me to actually pay it.


    If you pay it, the default credit report entry becomes current as of the date of making the payment and will stay with you for the next 7 years.

    Yep, exactly what I've heard.


    This.
    Get everything in writing....stay off the phone! Do you have proof of your negotiation at the time of cancellation 2 years ago? Do NOT pay them right now. Whether paid or unpaid, it has the same negative affect on your report. It will drop off 7 years from the date of your last delinquency and, as Steve says, the older it is the less affect it has on your score.
    Is this in the collection segment or installment/credit section. That has a huge bearing on how to approach the situation as well. Is it on all 4 or what combination thereof (TransUnion, Experian, Equifax, Innovis)?


    I wrote a series of about a dozen letters. I can;'t get those fuckers to pick up the phone let alone write me back.

    I can echo this sentiment. Pay it off in full in exchange for a full delete. Hopefully you're still just dealing with the company itself and not a CA as well, otherwise you might have multiple listings on your report for the same thing.

    Wish it was easy as that. I've been asking for this for the past 8 months. I've talked to the agent' s boss, her boss, her boss's boss, and all the way up to the chief legal officer at the law firm who's currently fucking me.


    It's called pique, or perhaps stubborn self-interest. You can even call it a matter of principle if you wish. But it's not civil disobedience and bears no resemblance to it whatsoever. The very essence of civil disobedience is a willing acceptance and embracing of the consequences of one's actions.


    [​IMG] Gawd you're perfect. [​IMG]


    I wouldn't pay the pieces of shit, I was in a similiar situation with comcast, I told them I already cancelled and they refunded my money because I threatened to fuck their bitches.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] But I need to figure out what to do cause not paying it isn't working anymore.

    I think all they do is negotiate a repayment in exchange for taking it off the report, but I'm not sure.

    tried that.........guess I need to keep pushing this fact

    It's called rapid rescoring and is mainly used by mortgage brokers to tweak minor errors for a 10-20 point score bump. It's good for getting yourself in to a low APR. They're not going to remove legitimate debts like the one the OP has

    naaaa, My credit report looks like this: example:
    January: they hadn't reported it for 3 months, score goes to a healthy 762
    March: they report it again and INSTANTLY drops to 662ish.
    [​IMG] [​IMG]


    The saddest part is that I otherwise have spotless credit. [​IMG]

    Alright, this is what you could do:

    Write the bastard t-mobile corporation a letter and include these contents:

    Tell them that you are happy to pay the lawfully owed financial obligations upon receipt of these three items in your mail.

    1. validation of the owed debt (actual accounting figures)
    2. verification of their claim against you (a sworn affidavit or a signed true invoice)
    3. a full disclosure copy of the contract binding both parties.

    If they cannot provide these documents then you have no true obligation to pay.

    And if these corporate thugs sick their 3rd party collection agencies and/or lawyers on you, you are not obligated to reply them, unless you are being served..which is a different matter. They have nothing to do with you and t-mobile and have NO jurisdiction over you, period, if they do try to contact you, you make sure you let them know they have nothing to do with 'the person in question'.

    I urge you to learn your 'common law rights' and 'contract law' as they will help you in incidents like these where these doucheb's are trying to take advantage of good people, if you want some more info, you can PM me.



    Thanks mate, I really do appreciate the advice. thing is, I've written too many fuckign letters to date, and playing hardball is jut not working.

    I don't mind paying someone else double, triple, 10x or whatever it takes to get rid of this, rather pay those cock sucking bullies off.

    What would it look like if I DID pay it off at this point?

    Oh, this stupid kid couldn't pay a bill he incurred for 4+ years and now he finally "mans up"

    fuck those fuckers in their fuckholes.

    Unfortunately this is partly what a credit score is for. They would like to know whether you are the type to settle/handle/correct/clarify your bills in a reasonable amount of time, or the type to just say "fuck it, you aren't getting my moneyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!!" and ignore them, aka someone who receives a monthly bill for 9 months and doesn't realize it. Maybe you forgot to set up mail forwarding or whatever, but they don't care about why.

    ok.

    Wait, this is originally due to a T-Mobile fuck up? Can't you sue them for credit libel if that is the case?

    Suing t-Mobile for $800 would be like sewing my own asshole shut and stuffing my face with Linguine and clam sauce.

    I like how everyone here is trying to push this as the OP's fault as if he legitimately owes them the money. StyleForum is THE MAN!

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    I' know I did my part to fuck this up, but I'm really surprised at the amount of people basically insinuating that they'd roll over in the face of this type of adversity and pay those fuckers.

    THEY fucked up, bullied me into owing them $800 and I'm supposed to tuck my tail and break bread?

    F-that. I need to figure out a way to get this done W/O paying the bill.
     


  6. JohnGalt

    JohnGalt Senior member

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    Aug. 2006:
    I moved back to San Francisco from college thus separating (geographically) from my GF. She had T-Mobile at the time as well and the only smart thing to do at the time was to purchase a "mobile to mobile" plan at a cost of apprx ~$8/month. (AT&T includes this, T-m does not)

    I called and made the switch. The CS rep on the other end of the line was very helpful and got it swapped for me.

    Feb 2007:
    I never paid the bill and the canceled my line, adding yet another $175 plus 4+ months of service to the bill so now I'm at $800 or so with late fees and whatnot.

    Its now in the hands of T-Mobile's attorney and all over my fucking report. My credit is otherwise spotless and this has dropped my score about 100 goddamn POINTS!

    Can I use payment as leverage for them to take action to rid me of this blemish? (or major breakout, rather)

    Every time they call, I tell the lady on the line ":if you can provide me in writing that you'll notify the credit reporting agencies that there was a mistake on my CR, I'll pay the fucking bullshit bill. Otherwise you can come arrest me":


    My ultimate goal: to make it go away on my credit report/score. I don't even care about the $ anymore. (even less than I did back them)

    I just want to get on with my life! Please help out guys!
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]


    Ok, I didn't read the reponses but here is my advice.

    First off - do not call T-Mobile's regular customer serviec agents anymore. They can't do anything, do not bother talking to them. Also, nobody is going to arrest you. If they ever threatened that, it is a violation of the FDCPA.

    You said it is "all over your report" - is more than one tradeline reporting to the bureaus from this original account? Get paper copies of your credit reports from all three bureaus. Don't base your action on reports you are viewing online or from third party services. If so, where are they from? Is it T-Mobile only or has it been sold off to collection agencies.

    You said it is with T-Mobile's attorney - is this in-house counsel or a debt collection agency? Debt collectors are sometimes "law firms" and they will try and use that to intimidate you.

    You need to find out who owns the debt - does Tmo still own it or has it been sold off? If Tmo owns it, then only work with them and not any collection agency.

    If Tmo owns the debt:
    - Send an email to their executive customer service. Carpet bomb their US executives. A list may be somewhere or on Consumerist. Their email format is [email protected]
    - Be polite and to the point explaining the situation. Explain the mistakes and your desired outcome. That being, you think your bill should be $XX based on the following calculation....and that you would be glad to pay it if they will agree to remove any negative tradelines from your credit reports. Your calculation of what you owe should take into account what you had agreed to on the phone with their rep and any cancellation fee - don't offer to pay any additional penalties. GET IT IN WRITING
    - Do not pay a dime unless you have the above in writing.

    If a debt collector owns the debt:
    - Do not talk to them on the phone, ever.
    - Send them a letter CMRRR disputing the debt and demanding that they validate the debt (see creditboards.com for examples)
    - They likely will not be able to. If they do, then try to arrange a pay for delete. Do not agree to automatic withdrawls from your checking account - never give them your bank information. If you have a pay for delete agreement GET IT IN WRITING before sending anything.

    Keep a meticulous paper trail of everything.

    If you need any more help, feel free to PM me.
     


  7. JohnGalt

    JohnGalt Senior member

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    I notice some people said pay them ASAP. DO NOT DO THAT. That can have a worse effect on your credit score. What would happen is the collection account would report as paid with a date of last activity being April 2010. It will then stay on your report for 7 years from now. As it stands, the date of last activity is 2006 or 2007. After about 2 years collection accounts affect your score less than a new one.

    You want to get it completely off of your reports.
     


  8. JohnGalt

    JohnGalt Senior member

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    No offence, but this sounds suspiciously like some "freeman on the land" stuff.

    FStyles would have been given a copy of the contract binding both parties when he signed the initial contract several years ago - y'know, when he signed up to a phone plan? And he's been advised of the amount that he owes, in telephone bills. He acknowledges that.

    And what does "actual accounting figures" mean, anyway? A copy of the company's profit and loss statements? The amount that it actually cost them to provide him with a service? They're under no obligation to provide those figures to him. When you go to buy your groceries, do you go up to the checkout operator and say to him/her, "You've charged me $10 for this big sack of potatoes. Before I pay for it, can you please show me the actual cost that you incurred in obtaining these potatoes and in stocking them so that I can purchase them? Also, when you present me with the invoice for my groceries, can you please sign the invoice, otherwise I do not consider it to be a valid invoice and I will not consider that I need to pay you."?

    I think that FStyles is looking for some useful, practical advice, not something that will have him running around in circles engaged in a fruitless and frustrating exchange of paper with a large company.



    Obviously you know nothing about US debt collection laws. Please at least read the FDCPA and FCRA before posting back in this thread. The advice that you criticize above is very valid.

    "Actual accounting figures" means copies of his account and how they derived the numbers they did. They have to show it is valid and that they didn't pull it out of thin air. They can say he owes anything, that doesn't mean it is correct.
     


  9. FStyles

    FStyles Senior member

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    Ok, I didn't read the reponses but here is my advice.

    First off - do not call T-Mobile's regular customer serviec agents anymore. They can't do anything, do not bother talking to them. Also, nobody is going to arrest you. If they ever threatened that, it is a violation of the FDCPA.

    You said it is "all over your report" - is more than one tradeline reporting to the bureaus from this original account? If so, where are they from? Is it T-Mobile only or has it been sold off to collection agencies.

    You said it is with T-Mobile's attorney - is this in-house counsel or a debt collection agency? Debt collectors are sometimes "law firms" and they will try and use that to intimidate you.

    You need to find out who owns the debt - does Tmo still own it or has it been sold off? If Tmo owns it, then only work with them and not any collection agency.

    If Tmo owns the debt:
    - Send an email to their executive customer service. Carpet bomb their US executives. A list may be somewhere or on Consumerist. Their email format is [email protected]
    - Be polite and to the point explaining the situation. Explain the mistakes and your desired outcome. That being, you think your bill should be $XX based on the following calculation....and that you would be glad to pay it if they will agree to remove any negative tradelines from your credit reports. Your calculation of what you owe should take into account what you had agreed to on the phone with their rep and any cancellation fee - don't offer to pay any additional penalties. GET IT IN WRITING
    - Do not pay a dime unless you have the above in writing.

    If a debt collector owns the debt:
    - Do not talk to them on the phone, ever.
    - Send them a letter CMRRR disputing the debt and demanding that they validate the debt (see creditboards.com for examples)
    - They likely will not be able to. If they do, then try to arrange a pay for delete. Do not agree to automatic withdrawls from your checking account - never give them your bank information. If you have a pay for delete agreement GET IT IN WRITING before sending anything.

    Keep a meticulous paper trail of everything.


    This is great advice. IIRC, a 3rd party attorney is calling me, so i imagine they own the debt now?

    I haven't heard from t-mobile in years and its always been other companies ie. pinnacle financial, etc.

    I'm actually not intimidated at all and not scared of what they say they'll do (which is still minimal cause I basically said "you guys can't do shit to me so fuck off")


    I think the next letter I'll draf t will be to this law office. Lae offices of Mitchell K IIRC. out of NY NY

    I notice some people said pay them ASAP. DO NOT DO THAT. That can have a worse effect on your credit score. What would happen is the collection account would report as paid with a date of last activity being April 2010. It will then stay on your report for 7 years from now. As it stands, the date of last activity is 2006 or 2007. After about 2 years collection accounts affect your score less than a new one.

    You want to get it completely off of your reports.


    Fuck that. Ive already decided that I'm NOT going to pay those fuckers for the exact reasons listed.

    this is why i'm so surprised that the brainiacs in the 1st few poasts would suggest tucking my tail and paying it. [​IMG]

    ijits.
     


  10. FStyles

    FStyles Senior member

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    Hey, I was wondering if there are any engineers out there who could give me some advice? I own a large, historical building in Italy. When I purchased it, I didn't notice any problems and I didn't get it fully inspected like I should have (considering its historical value). Anyway, it turns out that the whole damn building is leaning due to a faulty foundation.

    Could any engineers come take a look and tell me what I need to do to fix it?



    P.S. If there are any doctors out there, I keep coughing up blood and was wondering whether any of you could give me a quick checkup?


    [​IMG] [​IMG] I just saw this lol

    lick my testicles.
     


  11. JohnGalt

    JohnGalt Senior member

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    This is great advice. IIRC, a 3rd party attorney is calling me, so i imagine they own the debt now?

    I haven't heard from t-mobile in years and its always been other companies ie. pinnacle financial, etc.

    I'm actually not intimidated at all and not scared of what they say they'll do (which is still minimal cause I basically said "you guys can't do shit to me so fuck off")


    I think the next letter I'll draf t will be to this law office. Lae offices of Mitchell K IIRC. out of NY NY



    Fuck that. Ive already decided that I'm NOT going to pay those fuckers for the exact reasons listed.

    this is why i'm so surprised that the brainiacs in the 1st few poasts would suggest tucking my tail and paying it. [​IMG]

    ijits.


    Ok, you are dealing with Mitchell K - they are a collection agency. What have they said they will do? Threats are FDCPA violations.

    1) Tell them to stop calling you.
    2) Mail them a limited cease and decist letter (CMRRR) saying that all communication must be via USPS - no telephone. If they call you after receiving the letter, log it (and record it if you can).
    3) Mail them a debt validation letter (CMRRR). You don't know that they actually own the debt and that they can collect on it. They have to prove it. I can give you a sample letter if you like.

    If they respond to your DV letter you will find out if they actually own the debt or not. There is also the chance that they won't respond within 30 days. If they don't then you can contact the credit bureaus and have the tradeline removed. If they don't validate then it has to be removed. Win!
     


  12. Monaco

    Monaco Senior member

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    No offence, but this sounds suspiciously like some "freeman on the land" stuff.

    FStyles would have been given a copy of the contract binding both parties when he signed the initial contract several years ago - y'know, when he signed up to a phone plan? And he's been advised of the amount that he owes, in telephone bills. He acknowledges that.

    And what does "actual accounting figures" mean, anyway? A copy of the company's profit and loss statements? The amount that it actually cost them to provide him with a service? They're under no obligation to provide those figures to him. When you go to buy your groceries, do you go up to the checkout operator and say to him/her, "You've charged me $10 for this big sack of potatoes. Before I pay for it, can you please show me the actual cost that you incurred in obtaining these potatoes and in stocking them so that I can purchase them? Also, when you present me with the invoice for my groceries, can you please sign the invoice, otherwise I do not consider it to be a valid invoice and I will not consider that I need to pay you."?

    I think that FStyles is looking for some useful, practical advice, not something that will have him running around in circles engaged in a fruitless and frustrating exchange of paper with a large company.


    So...no offense but...

    You can't be serious, this is some of most practical advice he can get in this thread, something tangible he can do, writing letters and asking for signed documents is the best thing he can do, calling the company, being switched from dept. to dept., manager to supervisor, to automation is the most fruitless and frustrating part of it all. The funniest and also saddest part of it all is that they cannot produce a unfavorable response to him.

    And what might your response to him be? Pay the money like a good-obedient-lazy-little-American? Why does he have to pay for something he didn't want? How is that the least bit logical? This is exactly what corporations and government want us to do, they bombard us with complicated contracts, threats, & financial frustration so that we don't want to deal with it all and just pay all of the fines that are issued to us. Knowledge is power, people-come on, everybody knows that.

    JohnGalt seems to have some great first hand experience in this, and..for goodness sake, don't talk to the collection agencies, they have nothing to do with you, they have no clout over you. Listen to him and his advice shall set you free, or you can take my route...either way...it'll work.

    Do you know I receive the same call everyday from the same automated message, they don't even use my name and say "This is Mr. Linch and this call is regarding a business financial matter that is time sensitive, please call us back at 1800*******)" What the? Why should I even return the call if they don't even mention my name? it is pretty ludicrous.
     


  13. lawyerdad

    lawyerdad Senior member

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    [​IMG] Gawd you're perfect. [​IMG]

    Hah, fair enough. Just a particular (mis)usage that's a pet peeve of mine.
     


  14. FStyles

    FStyles Senior member

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    HA!

    So I just got off the phone with those bastaaaads. Sneaky little buggers used a LOCAL phone number this time! (I'm in CA, they're in NY)

    I politely laid into her explaining the situation and gave her a virtual "throwing up of the arms." "I'm not going to pay it unless I have soemthing in writing stating that you'll delete this from my report"

    her rebuttal: Impossible, but I'll lower your total amount due to $140 if you pay it now. (instead of $950 or so)

    I told her I'd rather take another vocabulary lesson from lawyerdad than pay her $140 and to stop calling me unlesss its to tell me the cops are being dispatched to my house so I can have time to tie my lobbs and properly fold my pocket square up for the car ride over. (I'd prolly choose to go with a full puff in that instance)
     


  15. HEWSINATOR

    HEWSINATOR Senior member

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    I do not know anything about this stuff. Sounds like forcing the verification and getting into that process may be the route to go. Would a limitations period not be up so that they can not collect on the debt?
     


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