• Hi, I am the owner and main administrator of Styleforum. If you find the forum useful and fun, please help support it by buying through the posted links on the forum. Our main, very popular sales thread, where the latest and best sales are listed, are posted HERE

    Purchases made through some of our links earns a commission for the forum and allows us to do the work of maintaining and improving it. Finally, thanks for being a part of this community. We realize that there are many choices today on the internet, and we have all of you to thank for making Styleforum the foremost destination for discussions of menswear.
  • This site contains affiliate links for which Styleforum may be compensated.
  • We would like to welcome House of Huntington as an official Affiliate Vendor. Shop past season Drake's, Nigel Cabourn, Private White V.C. and other menswear luxury brands at exceptional prices below retail. Please visit the Houise of Huntington thread and welcome them to the forum.

  • STYLE. COMMUNITY. GREAT CLOTHING.

    Bored of counting likes on social networks? At Styleforum, you’ll find rousing discussions that go beyond strings of emojis.

    Click Here to join Styleforum's thousands of style enthusiasts today!

    Styleforum is supported in part by commission earning affiliate links sitewide. Please support us by using them. You may learn more here.

Customizing my Tuxedo

Joined
May 31, 2011
Messages
5
Reaction score
0
Hello all,

I have posted on here before, but it's been a while and I couldn't for the life of me remember my info, so I just signed up again.

I have a black tie wedding (I'm a guest, not in it) coming up at the end of June. My Tuxedo is a M2M Zegna, single breasted, one button, peak lapel that I wear with a waistcoat and wing collar. For this wedding however I would like to be cooler (temperature-wise) and have a more modern look, while spending as little money as possible.

Would it be acceptable to do the following:

- Ditch the waistcoat and wear it without a cummerbund (I have never liked them)
- Wear a (very nice) french cuff dress shirt instead of the wing collar tuxedo shirt to avoid buying a new tuxedo shirt without the wing collar.

If I did either of the above, should I:

- Wear a regular black tie instead of the usual black bow tie?
- Wear my usual dress shoes, which are formal slip ons?

Thanks for the help. Let me know if I need to clarify anything.
 

Sanguis Mortuum

Distinguished Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
5,024
Reaction score
141
Originally Posted by J. Tobias Beard
- Ditch the waistcoat and wear it without a cummerbund (I have never liked them)

You can certainly wear a cummerbund instead if you want, though I expect a backless formal waistcoat will not be much hotter, so if you don't like cummerbunds I'd say stick to the waistcoat.

Originally Posted by J. Tobias Beard
- Wear a (very nice) french cuff dress shirt instead of the wing collar tuxedo shirt to avoid buying a new tuxedo shirt without the wing collar.

A turn-down collar is acceptable but you need a proper tuxedo shirt with a pleated or pique front, and preferably one which takes studs instead of using buttons.

Originally Posted by J. Tobias Beard
- Wear a regular black tie instead of the usual black bow tie?

No, you must never do this.

Originally Posted by J. Tobias Beard
- Wear my usual dress shoes, which are formal slip ons?

Some highly polished cap-toes may be acceptable instead of the usual patent, but unless these 'formal slip-ons' are opera pumps they are not an option. If they are some form of loafer than they are not 'formal' slip-ons because there is no such thing as a formal loafer.
 
Joined
May 31, 2011
Messages
5
Reaction score
0
Thanks for the reply. To clarify:

I was hoping to skip both the waistcoat and the cummerbund.

The shoes are opera pumps.
 

Roger Everett

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2010
Messages
220
Reaction score
11
Skipping the waistcoat and cummerbund is a more modern look ( see: Daniel Craig {James Bond }in Casino ), as well as skipping the the studs ( although you would need to since they come in sets of 4, and 5th button is covered by waistcoat or cummerbund ). Although if I were you, I would get a tux shirt with lay down collar, a well pressed " good " dress shirt would go ( esp. if it has MOP buttons. A std. tie is wearable if in same type material as lapel on tux, though I would stick to Bow, as a std. tie is generally worn with a waistcoat , to tuck in to. For the shoes -- since you are toneing down from hi med. formal, I think a pair of lace up pattens , a plain toe, or cap toe would fit in better ( highly polished ) is more in order. It is a wedding and not the opening night of the opera or a state dinner.
 

Mac

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2010
Messages
412
Reaction score
3
Originally Posted by Roger Everett
Skipping the waistcoat and cummerbund is a more modern look ( see: Daniel Craig {James Bond }in Casino ), as well as skipping the the studs ( although you would need to since they come in sets of 4, and 5th button is covered by waistcoat or cummerbund ). Although if I were you, I would get a tux shirt with lay down collar, a well pressed " good " dress shirt would go ( esp. if it has MOP buttons. A std. tie is wearable if in same type material as lapel on tux, though I would stick to Bow, as a std. tie is generally worn with a waistcoat , to tuck in to. For the shoes -- since you are toneing down from hi med. formal, I think a pair of lace up pattens , a plain toe, or cap toe would fit in better ( highly polished ) is more in order. It is a wedding and not the opening night of the opera or a state dinner.

ffffuuuu.gif
facepalm.gif
 

mingus2112

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2009
Messages
238
Reaction score
19
New poster here! I'll chime in with some observations. Please know that my "opinions" aren't necessarily what I would do in the situation. When I go "black tie," I always wear cummerbund, bowtie, studs, etc.

I think the real questions might be "who's throwing the black tie event?" and "who's invited?" I was invited to a black tie wedding not too long ago. Not black tie OPTIONAL. . .BLACK TIE. At least half of the guests were wearing normal dark suits, 3/4 of the tuxedo wearing bunch were rentals, 3/4 of the rentals were wearing high buttoned and/or non-black vests and only 5 or so out of the remaining people were dressed proper "black tie." The bridal party was wearing notched lapel rentals, plain white single cuffed (but with cufflinks) shirts, no studs, long black ties and clip on suspenders. It seemed that, in this case, "black tie" was only meant to make sure people were wearing jackets. If this is the kind of even you're going to, I think you'd look great in whatever you choose. If you're sure the holders of the event know what black tie means, you should really stick to traditional. Change ONE thing to stand out if you must. (cummerbund, tie, etc. Just one)

And lastly, opera pumps are your "usual dress shoes?"

-James
 
Joined
May 31, 2011
Messages
5
Reaction score
0
I realize that this forum trends towards the traditional, as do I actually, so I assumed that the "more modern look" would be frowned upon. I would rather wear a bow tie, actually, and as I have a beautiful stud set, I prefer a real tuxedo shirt.

But, I really don't want to buy a new tux shirt right now. Also, I have never liked cummerbunds for some reason, and was wondering if going with nothing was ever considered acceptable outside of GQ.

However, it seems that the best option is to buy a cummerbund and go with the wing collar and bow tie. The only pair of good formal shoes I have are the pumps.
 
Joined
May 31, 2011
Messages
5
Reaction score
0
Originally Posted by mingus2112
New poster here! I'll chime in with some observations. Please know that my "opinions" aren't necessarily what I would do in the situation. When I go "black tie," I always wear cummerbund, bowtie, studs, etc.

I think the real questions might be "who's throwing the black tie event?" and "who's invited?" I was invited to a black tie wedding not too long ago. Not black tie OPTIONAL. . .BLACK TIE. At least half of the guests were wearing normal dark suits, 3/4 of the tuxedo wearing bunch were rentals, 3/4 of the rentals were wearing high buttoned and/or non-black vests and only 5 or so out of the remaining people were dressed proper "black tie." The bridal party was wearing notched lapel rentals, plain white single cuffed (but with cufflinks) shirts, no studs, long black ties and clip on suspenders. It seemed that, in this case, "black tie" was only meant to make sure people were wearing jackets. If this is the kind of even you're going to, I think you'd look great in whatever you choose. If you're sure the holders of the event know what black tie means, you should really stick to traditional. Change ONE thing to stand out if you must. (cummerbund, tie, etc. Just one)

And lastly, opera pumps are your "usual dress shoes?"

-James


The wedding is Black Tie optional, but I don't think there will be many rental tuxs present. It's a pretty well to do family. I'm not looking to stand out, just reduce the formality and increase the comfort of my tux in the easiest way possible.

The opera pumps are not my usual dress shoes, they are what I wear with the tux. But, the only pair of black dress shoes I have are pretty terrible.
 

mingus2112

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2009
Messages
238
Reaction score
19
From what I understand, black tie OPTIONAL changes EVERYTHING. I would go with what you're comfortable in. Perhaps it's possible to get a regular white shirt that you could put studs in and forget about the cummerbund?

As for traditional, from what i've read [on this forum] that mostly holds true for formalwear, and for good reason. Black-tie has a specific meaning for menswear. If you don't follow the rules (even if you look good), you're not technically following black tie. The "optional" part of that opens it up to breaking more rules. I would say as long as you look good, you look good.

-James
 

mingus2112

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2009
Messages
238
Reaction score
19
Originally Posted by J. Tobias Beard
The opera pumps are not my usual dress shoes, they are what I wear with the tux. But, the only pair of black dress shoes I have are pretty terrible.

I know you don't want to make a lot (or any) extra purchases, but how about looking for a nice pair of cap toed oxfords? I don't know if you have any Nordstrom Rack stores by you (or stores like it), but I picked up a really nice pair of Bostonian cap toe oxfords for about $35 (they're about $95 in the Bostonian store). If you don't have a nice looking pair of dress shoes, they might be a good investment.

-James
 
Joined
May 31, 2011
Messages
5
Reaction score
0
Originally Posted by mingus2112
I know you don't want to make a lot (or any) extra purchases, but how about looking for a nice pair of cap toed oxfords? I don't know if you have any Nordstrom Rack stores by you (or stores like it), but I picked up a really nice pair of Bostonian cap toe oxfords for about $35 (they're about $95 in the Bostonian store). If you don't have a nice looking pair of dress shoes, they might be a good investment.

-James


True. I do have a pair of black Bostonians actually, (are they patent? I don't know. They are shiny), but they are not cap toes.

Would lace ups be better in this case?

Also, I apologize for these brief, non-detailed responses. I'm getting ready for work as I post.
 

cptjeff

Distinguished Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2010
Messages
4,637
Reaction score
329
Originally Posted by J. Tobias Beard
True. I do have a pair of black Bostonians actually, (are they patent? I don't know. They are shiny), but they are not cap toes.


They would be corrected grain. Ie, crappy leather, but it wouldn't look out of place at a black tie event, precisely because it's so shiny.
 

y3ahind0

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2011
Messages
125
Reaction score
0
Originally Posted by J. Tobias Beard

- Ditch the waistcoat and wear it without a cummerbund (I have never liked them)
- Wear a (very nice) french cuff dress shirt instead of the wing collar tuxedo shirt to avoid buying a new tuxedo shirt without the wing collar.
- Wear a regular black tie instead of the usual black bow tie?
- Wear my usual dress shoes, which are formal slip ons?


Dress shoes: patent leather or buffed dress shoes. but, opera pump is fine (not for every one though)

Wing Collar shirt is a classic traditional look. It can be substituted by white french cuff bottom collar shirt.
 

Featured Sponsor

How important is full vs half canvas to you for heavier sport jackets?

  • Definitely full canvas only

    Votes: 55 35.3%
  • Half canvas is fine

    Votes: 61 39.1%
  • Really don't care

    Votes: 17 10.9%
  • Depends on fabric

    Votes: 27 17.3%
  • Depends on price

    Votes: 28 17.9%

Forum statistics

Threads
505,207
Messages
10,579,348
Members
223,892
Latest member
cprice
Top