Custom White's Boots ... Thoughts?

[The Nid Hog]

I wanted to thank you guys for the great information you've been building up here. It's been a big help to me. A week or so ago, I got the pair of Bounty Hunters that I ordered in the Father's Day sale. They're 6" Lace-to-toe in Dry Elk Tan--essentially the same look as 350 Cutters. I've been all over them, inside and out, and the quality control is fine. I've also been wearing them a lot, and they are breaking in nicely. I've given them a couple of coats of Saphir neutral cream and buffed them to a good daily shine. I couldn't be happier with them.

 

[hoppy_IPA]

This is probably as close I’ll get to my “grail” boot with the caveat of it being Horween or perhaps Horween Shell. 99% sure I’ll be snapping up a pair of these on the 50/50 last or SD.

 

[chicagoan2016]

This is probably as close I’ll get to my “grail” boot with the caveat of it being Horween or perhaps Horween Shell. 99% sure I’ll be snapping up a pair of these on the 50/50 last or SD.

View attachment 1705668

Is this a different leather than you can currently order from Bakershoe.com?

 

[DownUndaBlunda]

excited to have Brian make me a

This is probably as close I’ll get to my “grail” boot with the caveat of it being Horween or perhaps Horween Shell. 99% sure I’ll be snapping up a pair of these on the 50/50 last or SD.

View attachment 1705668

Is this a different leather than you can currently order from Bakershoe.com?

When I ordered back in March, I assumed Kyle would be sourcing Horween Horsehide.

I'm fairly sure this is what I got instead (Maryam). I say this based on the colour and how it differs slightly from the limited pictures I can find online of other natural Horween HH.

Also the creasing so far is super tight, like calf or even kind of rolling (fairly certain the shell is removed so not possible).
Its great stuff where the Horween Horse has creasing like regular cxl and that ugly grainbreak people fear.

Unless I'm way off about horween horse cxl, I think this is a better product.

Even though the MP's are like a month old, the natural stevans has me drooling. I reeeeally want a 5050 boot.

 

[Widening Gyre]

Very happy with my Horween HH MPs, which hace very few creases, but those MPs and Stevens look delicious. Might tempt me to change my order…

 

[ThatDudeOrion]

When I ordered back in March, I assumed Kyle would be sourcing Horween Horsehide.

I'm fairly sure this is what I got instead (Maryam). I say this based on the colour and how it differs slightly from the limited pictures I can find online of other natural Horween HH.

Also the creasing so far is super tight, like calf or even kind of rolling (fairly certain the shell is removed so not possible).
Its great stuff where the Horween Horse has creasing like regular cxl and that ugly grainbreak people fear.

Unless I'm way off about horween horse cxl, I think this is a better product.

I haven't handled the Maryam personally, but I agree 100% with your assessment of Horween Horsehide CXL. I have put some good wear into some Mister Lou's from the original run in black Horween Horse (before they also switched to "Italian" black horsehide , ironically, probably Maryam) and to be honest it really just seems like expensive Steerhide CXL with all of the drawbacks associated regarding "loose" grain break etc. and not really any tangible benefits that I can tell. In some ways I wish I had waited to order my custom LTT Bounty Hunters (father's day sale last year) until they switched to Maryam, but I can't seem to get any decent offers on them, and the build times have exploded since that order was placed/received, so I'm most likely just going to keep them. IDK if the Horween Horsehide that various bootmakers are using is the same as the Horween Front Quarter Horsehide that the various jacket makers like Aero are using, but in any case, I've been a lot more impressed by the jackets, there seems to be visible and tangible benefits to the upcharge versus the same jacket in steerhide.

 

[chicagoan2016]

I haven't handled the Maryam personally, but I agree 100% with your assessment of Horween Horsehide CXL. I have put some good wear into some Mister Lou's from the original run in black Horween Horse (before they also switched to "Italian" black horsehide , ironically, probably Maryam) and to be honest it really just seems like expensive Steerhide CXL with all of the drawbacks associated regarding "loose" grain break etc. and not really any tangible benefits that I can tell. In some ways I wish I had waited to order my custom LTT Bounty Hunters (father's day sale last year) until they switched to Maryam, but I can't seem to get any decent offers on them, and the build times have exploded since that order was placed/received, so I'm most likely just going to keep them. IDK if the Horween Horsehide that various bootmakers are using is the same as the Horween Front Quarter Horsehide that the various jacket makers like Aero are using, but in any case, I've been a lot more impressed by the jackets, there seems to be visible and tangible benefits to the upcharge versus the same jacket in steerhide.

Explains why my latest HH has creased worse than British Tan CXL!

 

[Alaskaking]

Explains why my latest HH has creased worse than British Tan CXL!

I just can’t see this in the pictures you showed. You just can’t expect leather to not crease outside of maybe shell???(“that’s not leather Alaska, it’s a membrane “)

The “break” on my brown HH pair is as bad as any HH I’ve seen pictures of, still, I wouldn’t trade them for bovine CXL, even if you promised an absence of break.
the black HH pair is perfect (from a leather standpoint so far?) there are creases of course, due to the fact that it is leather and I’m flexing it in my foot, but no break. It seems to be a touch thicker as well.
I’m not defending the HH used in whites boots unequivocally, but if you are going to complain about that Burgundy pair again, show mesome more pictures of what you’re talking about, I’d have to search, but I recall some normal creasing on the inner upper shaft of one boot around your ankle- I don’t remember seeing any other pictures out side of that one view. There may be more obvious uglies on them Chicago, I’m only relying in one picture for evidence, please forgive me if I’m incorrect——and then show me some pictures of it before I order some in natural! ?

 

[chicagoan2016]

I just can’t see this in the pictures you showed. You just can’t expect leather to not crease outside of maybe shell???(“that’s not leather Alaska, it’s a membrane “)

The “break” on my brown HH pair is as bad as any HH I’ve seen pictures of, still, I wouldn’t trade them for bovine CXL, even if you promised an absence of break.
the black HH pair is perfect (from a leather standpoint so far?) there are creases of course, due to the fact that it is leather and I’m flexing it in my foot, but no break. It seems to be a touch thicker as well.
I’m not defending the HH used in whites boots unequivocally, but if you are going to complain about that Burgundy pair again, show mesome more pictures of what you’re talking about, I’d have to search, but I recall some normal creasing on the inner upper shaft of one boot around your ankle- I don’t remember seeing any other pictures out side of that one view. There may be more obvious uglies on them Chicago, I’m only relying in one picture for evidence, please forgive me if I’m incorrect——and then show me some pictures of it before I order some in natural! ?

I will share more pics later (had to come to the office today)
I was expecting HH to crease less than cxl ( you could see that in the pics I shared some time ago).
The creases are worse in the shafts but also present in the Vamp and toe areas. Unfortunately the only comparison I can make is with British tan cxl, also consider the fact that the British tan is five/six months old while Burgundy HH is a little over two months. I guess my point is HH is aging worse than the infamous CXL ( my tough luck lol).
BTW I did order Natural HH a month ago or so ago.

 

[chicagoan2016]

@Alaskaking
Some pics

I will share british tan later for comparison

 

[Jimk4003]

@Alaskaking
Some pics
View attachment 1705941
View attachment 1705942
I will share british tan later for comparison

Usually when people bemoan 'bad break' in leather, it's because of unsightly heavy creasing in areas that shouldn't really be showing creasing; right up on the toe box, on the heel counter, etc. Yours just looks like they're creasing where your foot flexes, which is absolutely fine.

No two pieces of leather will ever crease exactly the same, and any difference between your two pairs will just be the result of leather being a natural material with inherent variances. You could order the same two pairs of boots again and have the reverse experience.

I think those look great, to be honest.

 

[Phalanx]

There's a part of me that feels White's Stevens boot might be the meta boot for importing. Firstly, it's a great competitor to Viberg; it's cheaper and more customizable and I'm pretty sure it's the same last as the MP boots.

But the second critical part is that it's goodyearwelted instead of handwelted. You don't necessarily have to send it back to Baker / White's to get it resoled in the future.

Maybe there's room for a MP boot (with the all leather construction), but with a GYW instead of hand welt. Steven doesn't have all leather construction IIRC (it's oak filling and a shank?)

 

[Alaskaking]

I think those look great, to be honest.

this has been my impression from the pictures I’ve seen as well @chicagoan2016, I’m just not seeing what’s abnormal.

 

[Jimk4003]

But the second critical part is that it's goodyearwelted instead of handwelted. You don't necessarily have to send it back to Baker / White's to get it resoled in the future.

Just for clarity, you'd only need to send your boots back to White's if they needed to be rebuilt or re-welted (and a good cobbler could probably re-welt them anyway). A standard re-sole could be done by any competent cobbler using the same outsole stitcher they'd use to re-sole any other footwear.

 

[chicagoan2016]

But the second critical part is that it's goodyearwelted instead of handwelted.

Steven doesn't have all leather construction IIRC (it's oak filling and a shank?)

I don't see this on White's website!
Did you happen to get this info from White's over the phone/email?