Crockett & Jones - Whats the big deal?

[leapyourbar]

I never liked Crockett and Jones so I understand your contention, but I certainly prefer a welted shoe to Ferragamo. To each their own, however.

 

[Watchman1]

Hello Gentlemen,

I am very blessed to be able to own great shoes by many differing manufacturers.

Alden and Carmina particularly.

I recently scored a pair of RL Marlow's off ebay for $500 with free shipping and I must confess they are possibly my finest pair.

I immediately sold my cordovan McNeils because the C&J trumped them so hard.

I wear shell almost exclusively and am looking to eventually do a GMTO in whiskey cordovan......something very formal.......Handgrade......

The Weymouth perhaps.........

Enough fantasizing this was just my 2 cents......

 

[Xiaogou]

Cordovan and oxfords are not a good combo. When the cordovan folds, it takes away from the overall aesthetic of the oxford. Especially a wholecut.

 

[mebiuspower]

I have Alden/AE/Vass/C&J... Vass is definitely a grade up in quality since they're hand welt and requireu no break-in. However I still love my Peal & Co Cordovan Boot with their storm welt and dannite sole. Trouble with Vass as well is they have size variations so it's best to buy in person in Budapest which was what I did.

 

[Xiaogou]



I have Alden/AE/Vass/C&J... Vass is definitely a grade up in quality since they're hand welt and requireu no break-in. However I still love my Peal & Co Cordovan Boot with their storm welt and dannite sole. Trouble with Vass as well is they have size variations so it's best to buy in person in Budapest which was what I did.

I disagree with Vass not needing to be broke in. To some degree, all RTW shoes need to be broke in. I agree that Vass is better in quality than others mentioned.

 

[archetypal_yuppie]



I disagree with Vass not needing to be broke in. To some degree, all RTW shoes need to be broke in. I agree that Vass is better in quality than others mentioned.

While bespoke shoes magically do not?

 

[Bmcgraw49]

Question for you guys... why all the fuss over Crockett and Jones? I've been a fairly loyal Ferragamos and Bruno Magli devotee. I'm in my mid to late 20's and I like that they are a bit younger and sexier than their English counterparts... but I've always heard about the legends of C&J and in fact see people on SF affirming C&J as some of the best shoes you can buy without shelling out $1,500-2,000.

I did my research and it seemed like C&J was a no brainer. I went ahead and bought a pair of Merton loafers... cost was $600 for the shoes, $115 for the shoe trees, and $40 for flush metal toe taps... all-in it was a little over $800 with taxes... so certainly more expensive than the Ferragamo and Maglis I've gotten in the past.

After having worn them for a few months... I can't help but feel like they're over-hyped. Sure, its a nice shoe and it feels very well constructed... I do still feel partial to the more stylish designs and the shoe itself doesn't feel particularly different to me.

This is the first goodyear welted shoe I've brought... so it did take some getting used to (blisters and sore arches while breaking in)... is the allure of C&J purely the longevity associated with having the luxury of re-soling these shoes again and again?

After having experienced the regular line, I certainly can't see myself shelling out an additional $1,000 on top the this base price for the handgrade or for John Lobbs.... what is it exactly that makes the difference for you guys to warrant dropping that sort of coin on these shoes?

You should look into Carlos Santos shoes. You can find them on sites like Skoaktiebogalet, Pediwear, and a Finepairofshoes right under or around the $300 range. The quality exceeds the price with Carlos Santos. I like them alot. They are much more affordable and from what I’ve researched are between the benchgrade and handgrade Crockett & Jones lines. I have a pair of Carlos Santos Chelseas and they are very comfortable. Already clocked in nearly 10 miles in them and they are both beautiful and great to walk in. The value and high quality of Carlos Santos shoes really shines. Löf & Tung has a line that looks to be just as good as Carlos Santos, but I haven’t got any first hand experience with that brand yet. Take a look at the pictures of the adelaides in coimbra patina at the end of the Carlos Santos appreciation postings (put up 8/1/2018). You’ll see what I mean. I don’t feel like I’m sacrificing quality for quantity at all in choosing this brand. I actually feel like I am getting a better quality shoe in many respects at that price point than I could with alternative higher costing brands.

 

[Wingtip77]

You should look into Carlos Santos shoes. You can find them on sites like Skoaktiebogalet, Pediwear, and a Finepairofshoes right under or around the $300 range. The quality exceeds the price with Carlos Santos. I like them alot. They are much more affordable and from what I’ve researched are between the benchgrade and handgrade Crockett & Jones lines. I have a pair of Carlos Santos Chelseas and they are very comfortable. Already clocked in nearly 10 miles in them and they are both beautiful and great to walk in. The value and high quality of Carlos Santos shoes really shines. Löf & Tung has a line that looks to be just as good as Carlos Santos, but I haven’t got any first hand experience with that brand yet. Take a look at the pictures of the adelaides in coimbra patina at the end of the Carlos Santos appreciation postings (put up 8/1/2018). You’ll see what I mean. I don’t feel like I’m sacrificing quality for quantity at all in choosing this brand. I actually feel like I am getting a better quality shoe in many respects at that price point than I could with alternative higher costing brands.

Carlos Santos are nice, but they are simply not at the Crockett & Jones standard.

 

[Bmcgraw49]

Carlos Santos are nice, but they are simply not at the Crockett & Jones standard.

I disagree. From everything I’ve read, it depends which line you are talking about. Carlos Santos are not the same as Crockett & Jones handgrade, I’m not arguing for that, but I’ve read reviews from reputable critics which say they are above Crockett and Jones’ benchgrade line in quality and value. Carefully looking at Crockett & Jones’ benchgrade offerings, I’d have to agree with that sentiment. The value is much higher with Carlos Santos. This of course is my opinion. Much is derived from my personal sense of aesthetics as well. Crockett & Jones, while elegant, tends to elongate the toe box a little too much in my opinion. Carlos Santos is a bit more reserved there, creating a more balanced symmetry. No one can disagree that Crockett & Jones is not one of the global Icons and standards of luxury footwear. But, the value ratio is higher with Carlos Santos, especially in comparison with C&J benchgrade, and especially when looking at the overall appeal and allure of the shoe. I can argue that the appeal and allure of Carlos Santos shoes surpasses even C&J handgrade for me. That is purely aesthetics. Like I said though, this is partly subjective. I for one may get a C&J one day. Though, I am not sold on it as of yet. There are other shoes at that price point that have me much more interested. Thank you very much for your comment! I really appreciate your perspective!

 

[Wingtip77]

I disagree. From everything I’ve read, it depends which line you are talking about. Carlos Santos are not the same as Crockett & Jones handgrade, I’m not arguing for that, but I’ve read reviews from reputable critics which say they are above Crockett and Jones’ benchgrade line in quality and value. Carefully looking at Crockett & Jones’ benchgrade offerings, I’d have to agree with that sentiment. The value is much higher with Carlos Santos. This of course is my opinion. Much is derived from my personal sense of aesthetics as well. Crockett & Jones, while elegant, tends to elongate the toe box a little too much in my opinion. Carlos Santos is a bit more reserved there, creating a more balanced symmetry. No one can disagree that Crockett & Jones is not one of the global Icons and standards of luxury footwear. But, the value ratio is higher with Carlos Santos, especially in comparison with C&J benchgrade, and especially when looking at the overall appeal and allure of the shoe. I can argue that the appeal and allure of Carlos Santos shoes surpasses even C&J handgrade for me. That is purely aesthetics. Like I said though, this is partly subjective. I for one may get a C&J one day. Though, I am not sold on it as of yet. There are other shoes at that price point that have me much more interested. Thank you very much for your comment! I really appreciate your perspective!

I think you need to look at the entire range of Crockett and Jones. Some are very conservative, some are a bit more modern with elongated lasts.

Carlos Santos are more affordable, that is true.

 

[Bmcgraw49]

I think you need to look at the entire range of Crockett and Jones. Some are very conservative, some are a bit more modern with elongated lasts.

Carlos Santos are more affordable, that is true.

That’s always a good thing to do. I haven’t seen everything offered by them. Just what’s currently available. I can and always want to learn about shoes. The leathers C&J uses for their chelseas are beautiful. I’ve always and immediately keyed into and loved that. The colors on their chelseas’ finishes are amazing. Some look like they are edible desserts, they are so smooth and rich in appearance. Especially the caramel like colors. Haha! I’d like a shoe with that leather.

 

[useless_username]

I think you need to look at the entire range of Crockett and Jones. Some are very conservative, some are a bit more modern with elongated lasts.

Not sure if resurrecting this old thread is worth it, but I have to agree with Wingtip77. C&J has quite an extensive range. For example, in Oxfords, the traditional rounded 236 (Connaught) is a very different shoe from the elongated and square 348 (Hallam).

I have a few of their more traditional shoes, which I really like. I find that a lot of their shoes are too pointy or elongated for my taste.

 

[Bmcgraw49]

Not sure if resurrecting this old thread is worth it, but I have to agree with Wingtip77. C&J has quite an extensive range. For example, in Oxfords, the traditional rounded 236 (Connaught) is a very different shoe from the elongated and square 348 (Hallam).

I have a few of their more traditional shoes, which I really like. I find that a lot of their shoes are too pointy or elongated for my taste.

I’m with you on that. A little elongated, just the slighest bit can go a long ways and add to the design. Taking it too far and it starts to feel like you’re wearing clown shoes. I had to return a pair of chelseas from a different brand, a very good, well-known, and respected English brand (not C&Js), because of this. Everything else about the boots were beautiful. The construction, craftsmanship, leather and finish were all immaculate. Just those two extra inches of pointy air past my toes. Made me feel like I was going to trip over my own feet. Also made me feel like I had to wear a huge gawdy belt buckle and 10 gallon hat to balance out the aesthetics of the boots and make the proportions work better. These were chelseas. Not cowboy boots. I researched the best I could prior to buying. There wasn’t anything that gave any scale, nor much literature that I could find on that style. I hate returning things, but those boots were a walking hazzard and accident waiting to happen. But everybody likes their own thing. Those would look very good on the right person. That’s what makes this all so great. If not, it’d all be pretty boring.

 

[Bmcgraw49]




I think that this nails it in the head IMO. Outside of strong branding power, trust is the key reason why people keep coming back and why newbies want to take a stab in the first place. If you are about to invest an amount of money that matters to you, you need to know that your purchase is going to be worth the investment.

C&J has done a good job at simply making well made shoes that can stand the test of time. They are not too fancy, nor are they too boring. They are simply a good shoe for the money and look the part. Clearly this statement makes more sense in Europe than it does in the US, as the translation does make it expensive in USD.....but either way, customers buy them because they know that they are getting a good shoe that also looks good in a classical sense

That is a very insightful and indepth point you’ve made. In the US, where I’m at, we need to get away from fast fashion and the idea of disposable clothes and footwear all together. The vast majority here wouldn’t think about investing in shoes, nor the personal upkeep required in taking care of them to maximize their life cycle. I personally am not a huge fan of C&J just yet, but am of Carlos Santos where I feel you get quality and craftsmanship for an affordable price. I’m still learning about shoes and am not yet sure which way to go other than Carlos Santos. I am very happy there with the aesthetics of his collection. I feel I can trust his products implicitly. In the future, I will have to do much more research to see where else I can confidently invest in shoes and boots.

 

[Humpty_Dumpty_Rises]

All well said in the original post. And to also account for the fact that Crockett and Jones increased prices in early 2022. And have done the same again now in March 2023. The price increase this time is between 12% to 20% across their range. Steep slope.