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Beckwith

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Sorry, that is absolutely moronic. Wait, everything you read on the interwebz is true? Wikipedia is true also?
 

VaderDave

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I don't even have anything to put in a roof box. Just seems like something that should be done.
It seems like a relatively easy thing to put on and take off. No reason not to get one if you like them and think that it might be useful sometimes.
 

A Y

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More like Penquin caskets. Didn’t even consider this until now. Yeah I’ll stick with oil changes please.

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/06/20/tesla-car-battery-production-releases-as-much-co2-as-8-years-of-gasoline-driving/
You need to compare apples to apples. On the ICE side, consider the CO2 emissions from manufacturing the engine, and then running and fueling it for a similar period of time and mileage. Analyses done on that, even for states like West Virginia which derive most of their electricity from non-renewables, have hybrids and BEVs handily beating ICE cars in less than 8 years.
 

TheFoo

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Sorry, that is absolutely moronic. Wait, everything you read on the interwebz is true? Wikipedia is true also?
Well, it is not controversial to state that both increased battery production and electrical infrastructure expansion generate significant additional greenhouse gas emissions. You have to take those into account when measuring the net emissions benefit of electric cars. Most people simply cover their ears.
 

OtterMeanGreen

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Sorry, that is absolutely moronic. Wait, everything you read on the interwebz is true? Wikipedia is true also?
Is it moronic to think that the mining and battery disposal of Lithium-ion is harmful to the environment? It seems those are based on facts:

1561488255215.png
 

Beckwith

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Not worth going through the fact that Elon Musk and the CTO of Tesla, have already stated recycling programs at gigfactories are already in place and growing. I can post countless articles on this, I for one feel good about not burning fossil fuels, but I have stated before that I did not buy the car for the environmentally friendly aspects. Do you really want to get into the fact that the fluids from your ICE car are really not being recycled, or that many municipalities are no longer recycling as it is becoming cost prohibitive and as you have stated the heat and force needed to process those materials aren't really doing great things for the environment. Hate on Tesla like most "car" people do, go after Volkswagen cause aren't they doing the same thing?
 

TheFoo

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Not worth going through the fact that Elon Musk and the CTO of Tesla, have already stated recycling programs at gigfactories are already in place and growing. I can post countless articles on this, I for one feel good about not burning fossil fuels, but I have stated before that I did not buy the car for the environmentally friendly aspects. Do you really want to get into the fact that the fluids from your ICE car are really not being recycled, or that many municipalities are no longer recycling as it is becoming cost prohibitive and as you have stated the heat and force needed to process those materials aren't really doing great things for the environment. Hate on Tesla like most "car" people do, go after Volkswagen cause aren't they doing the same thing?
I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't "hate on" Tesla. In fact, I'm very impressed by what the company has accomplished. I just think that the full environmental benefit/detriment of electric cars is under-explored. Unfortunately, Elon Musk is hardly an unbiased or reliable authority on the matter. We each have to do our own diligence.

Separately, aside from the environment and climate change, I'm not interested in Tesla for other reasons. Perhaps it is clear by now that some of us like mechanical, analog things--efficiency, convenience, and comfort don't really fit into the equation.
 

Beckwith

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Foo, I agree about the environmental impact, wasn't the deciding factor is me buying the car. What was is the technology and updates provided in the car. I was tired of leasing cars where the technology was outdated the day I picked it up. I don't need a bigger screen than I have, I do appreciate the over the air updates that make the car faster both in speed and computer processing. I don't have a long commute at 6 miles each way so getting in the car and having everything sync before I can shift to reverse is appealing to me. In my wife's XC90, the backup camera usually comes on after I have pulled out of the driveway, that annoys me.
 

Beckwith

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I get the hypocrisy, burning those fuels to charge the car. I am aware that is how power is supplied to NY, Indian point wasn't cutting it.

If you live in New York and think you aren't burning fossil fuels to fill up your Tesla I got news for you...
 

OtterMeanGreen

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Not worth going through the fact that Elon Musk and the CTO of Tesla, have already stated recycling programs at gigfactories are already in place and growing. I can post countless articles on this, I for one feel good about not burning fossil fuels, but I have stated before that I did not buy the car for the environmentally friendly aspects. Do you really want to get into the fact that the fluids from your ICE car are really not being recycled, or that many municipalities are no longer recycling as it is becoming cost prohibitive and as you have stated the heat and force needed to process those materials aren't really doing great things for the environment. Hate on Tesla like most "car" people do, go after Volkswagen cause aren't they doing the same thing?
I'm not hating on Tesla, where in any of my posts did you extrapolate that? You might say that you feel good about not burning fossil fuels by driving a Tesla, but in order to make the many components of that Tesla, it was at the expense of many fossil fuels. Take the car mirrors as an example of the dirty fuels needed to run the plants and mines.

Also there's this:

 

TheFoo

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Foo, I agree about the environmental impact, wasn't the deciding factor is me buying the car. What was is the technology and updates provided in the car. I was tired of leasing cars where the technology was outdated the day I picked it up. I don't need a bigger screen than I have, I do appreciate the over the air updates that make the car faster both in speed and computer processing. I don't have a long commute at 6 miles each way so getting in the car and having everything sync before I can shift to reverse is appealing to me. In my wife's XC90, the backup camera usually comes on after I have pulled out of the driveway, that annoys me.
Tesla has certainly moved the ball forward on this front, in a big, meaningful way.

Hilariously, I'm personally going the exact other direction. I did everything to eliminate as much "technology" as possible from my car when I spec'ed it. Next steps are to delete the nav system, backup camera, and cruise control. All that shit gets in the way and will inevitably break down or go obsolete. Rather than keep pace, I'd rather run my own race.

No doubt, I'd think differently about a car used for daily transportation.
 
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OtterMeanGreen

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Tesla has certainly moved the ball forward on this front, in a big, meaningful way.

Hilariously, I'm personally going the exact other direction. I did everything possible to eliminate as much "technology" as possible from my car when I spec'ed it. Next steps are to delete the nav system, backup camera, and cruise control. All that shit gets in the way and will inevitably break down or go obsolete. Rather than keep pace, I'd rather run my own race.

No doubt, I'd think differently about a car used for daily transportation.
How long are you planning on keeping this car, for life? My cruise control still works flawlessly and I have used it every day for 11 years. I couldn't imagine not having it for a long road trip, especially for a 3 pedal car.
 

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