1. Hi, I'm the owner and main administrator of Styleforum. If you find the forum useful and fun, please help support it by buying through the posted links on the forum. Our main, very popular sales thread, where the latest and best sales are listed, are posted HERE

    Purchases made through some of our links earns a commission for the forum and allows us to do the work of maintaining and improving it. Finally, thanks for being a part of this community. We realize that there are many choices today on the internet, and we have all of you to thank for making Styleforum the foremost destination for discussions of menswear.

Cars We Drive!

Discussion in 'Fine Living, Home, Design & Auto' started by Bert1568, Jul 18, 2006.

  1. TheFoo

    TheFoo THE FOO Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    21,773
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Key differences: (1) V12/front engine combo is not unique to Ferrari, though it is certainly historically significant for them, and (2) the 911 continues to outperform competitors and win in racing.

    Look, I'm not saying I don't get the allure of a big V12 Ferrari. I'm saying that going bigger and more powerful is not necessarily better. In this case more power does not make the 812 Superfast a better grand tourer and it does not make it competitive around a track or in racing. So, what does it do? Why is it "better"?
     

  2. TheFoo

    TheFoo THE FOO Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    21,773
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    I believe 7:18 was observed of the factory effort, but the factory never officially disclosed it. It is disappointing compared to competing Porsches and Lambos. And with the Pista, you can't say "it's a GT car."

    EDIT: Another source says 6:52, which is more like it!!!
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019

  3. HRoi

    HRoi Stylish Dinosaur

    Messages:
    18,570
    Likes Received:
    6,539
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2008
    not my definition, but i think Ferrari's answer is "better = more power". i understand the argument that you are making - it ultimately comes down to their unwillingness to compromise ride comfort and "GT-ness" that makes the additional hp wasted (because the self-imposed design limitations makes it impossible to put the power down over a certain level).

    but each new generation HAS to have more power or the market thinks it's shit.
     

  4. OtterMeanGreen

    OtterMeanGreen Distinguished Member

    Messages:
    2,548
    Likes Received:
    895
    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Location:
    New Jersey
    I thought so, had my paws on one as well as the Aperta (ugly car) and plenty of GTO’s, which I liked the most. Man that exhaust was wood inducing...I mean mood inducing :lol:
     

  5. Texasmade

    Texasmade Distinguished Member

    Messages:
    5,548
    Likes Received:
    1,604
    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2008
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    MORE POWER BRO!!!!

    Agree that after a certain point MORE POWER!!! is useless for road cars other than bragging rights.
     

  6. HRoi

    HRoi Stylish Dinosaur

    Messages:
    18,570
    Likes Received:
    6,539
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2008
    the 599 was the first one that wasn't drop dead gorgeous IMO, so "peak Ferrari GT" for me is the 575M
     

  7. TheFoo

    TheFoo THE FOO Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    21,773
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    100%. Downhill from there.

    What’s your favorite modern mid-engine Ferrari? My vote goes to the F430/430 Scuderia.
     

  8. bawlin

    bawlin Distinguished Member

    Messages:
    3,087
    Likes Received:
    946
    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2008
    One of my favourite cars of all time.

    [​IMG]
     

  9. TheFoo

    TheFoo THE FOO Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    21,773
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Right. I fully endorse the idea of a comfortable grand touring car that doesn’t need to be fast around the track. But achieving that goal is better accomplished with less power and less weight. The Superfast’s added power only makes sense in the context of track performance—and so I think critiquing its ‘Ring time is perfectly appropriate.

    Yes, before anyone says it again: track records are academic for most of us (certainly for me). But assessing intended function is core to assessing design. Superfluous attributes or features (like more power than can be used) are a bad. I will never race my car around the Nurburgring, but that it has been optimized to be best in its class and is among the overall fastest regardless of price is a big selling point when one cares about design, function, and the whole versus the parts.

    This is the big stupid.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019

  10. TheFoo

    TheFoo THE FOO Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    21,773
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Another way to look at it: all individual performance metrics (horsepower numbers, 0-60 times, etc.) are academic and meaningless without context, but Nurburgring times may be the least imperfect of them all, as they account for the full sum of a car’s perfomance assets.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019

  11. HRoi

    HRoi Stylish Dinosaur

    Messages:
    18,570
    Likes Received:
    6,539
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2008
    i believe i've told this story somewhere in the last 2,000 pages but my father and i had this friendly challenge going where i told him that in our lifetimes, i'd buy and let him ride/drive my 4 favorite cars:
    - Toyota Mk2 MR2
    - BMW M3
    - Porsche 911
    - Ferrari F355

    we got through the first three before he got sick and passed somewhat suddenly. i never did get around to buying that F355...i certainly can afford it now but the motivation is less and i still don't like the prospect of maintaining it.

    but it's still my favorite and the answer to your question.
     

  12. gnatty8

    gnatty8 Distinguished Member

    Messages:
    9,733
    Likes Received:
    1,811
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2006
    Location:
    Philadelphia
    Total derail, but did you do undergrad in finance? I thought you were a lawyer also, but the mists grow thick in my brain as I age and drink copious amounts of bourbon to fill the hours
     

  13. TheFoo

    TheFoo THE FOO Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    21,773
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Nope. Philosophy major.
     

  14. TheFoo

    TheFoo THE FOO Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    21,773
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    That is an awfully sweet and sad story about your father. It is nice that you shared a passion together.

    F355 is a good choice. For me, hard to pick between that and the F430.
     

  15. gnatty8

    gnatty8 Distinguished Member

    Messages:
    9,733
    Likes Received:
    1,811
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2006
    Location:
    Philadelphia
    Got it, thx.. I spent far too long in finance, mainly quantitative finance and risk management, so always curious when people make the leap from one path into this one..
     

Share This Page

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.