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Cars We Drive!

Discussion in 'Fine Living, Home, Design & Auto' started by Bert1568, Jul 18, 2006.

  1. Thrift Vader

    Thrift Vader Forum Mechanic

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  2. UnFacconable

    UnFacconable Distinguished Member

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    I've opticoated my last few cars and love the results. In addition to making them much easier to wash (when I get around to it every 6-9 months or so), it does almost entirely eliminate swirls and has protected my car in an accident. I mentioned this a few months ago but my car was sideswiped by the tires on a lifted Jeep. It looked pretty bad (and was bad enough in a few areas to dent my panels) but I took it to a shop and they were able to get out 100% of the tire ruboff without any damage to my clearcoat. The panel is a bit wavy from the impact damage but still entirely swirl free. Needless to say, I'm a firm believer in the coatings.

    I am curious as to the combination of ceramic coating and full wrap. I imagine the extra cost of ceramic coating falls away when you are also getting PPF, but what is the benefit of the coating when the much more protective film is on the outside? Anything that makes it through the PPF will make it through the coating. Is the thought to reduce any potential issues with the removal of the PPF damaging your clearcoat? I didn't think that was an issue nowadays.

    I will also concur that automotive paint quality is worse than it used to be. I've heard from the detailer who did my first opticoat (pretty well known guy who has done more Teslas than anyone - and does Tesla's prototypes and show cars, etc.) that Tesla's in particular are poor due to California environmental regs, but in general the move to water-based paint has been a negative for the industry. My beat up old American SUV has more durable paint than any of the cars I've purchased new in the last 10 years. The SUV has no paint chips after 110k+ miles but each of my newer cars has been inflicted with numerous paint chips - even with opticoat installed.

    Come on, Hroi. Do you really need to include the "if" here? To put things in perspective, Foo is losing sleep over the color of his steering wheel stripe. Imagine dat first paint chip. He should get a full custom wrap for his car and then get a full custom wrap for his custom wrap.
     

  3. Dino944

    Dino944 Distinguished Member

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    The cost of the ceramic coating isn't that significant relative to the cost of the PPF. IIRC, the ceramic coating is applied over the PPF. Also, applying the ceramic coating means one doesn't have to apply wax or sealant to the car for many years. I believe the only issues with the removal of PPF and damaging the paint, is if a part of the car was repainted and not allowed enough time to properly cure. When the Cayman was about a year or so old, I took a bad stone to hood, and it left a nasty mark in the PPF. I had the PPF on the hood replaced and there was no problem with paint being pulled up or damaging the clear coat. PPF has come a long way since the stories of removing it pulling up paint. My car used whatever the highest quality Xpel was and the literature talks about a release layer or something like that. There are probably more advanced films these days as that was back in 2014.

    Yes, a lot of early Tesla's had terrible paint. I guy I know who is a partner in a detail shop, said when they got in some early Teslas, the paint sloughed off the front bumpers during paint correction process. He said it was a huge pain dealing with those cars. Hopefully they have improved?
     

  4. otc

    otc Stylish Dinosaur

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    Do you still wax over a full wrap PPF? I know people wax over ceramic coatings to get a deeper shine (should be OK as long as you use a pure wax without any cleaning or polishing agents).

    Does it look as good as a properly polished and waxed paint job? A full wrap in clear (not changing color or going to a matte finish) seems to me like it would be a bit like putting plastic on your furniture. Sure it protects it...but do you really want a coat of plastic over your pristine paint? I understand putting it on the high damage areas, but in other spots?

    On the other hand, I could see a really nice clear layer of plastic working like an even-better clear coat. With high clarity and perfect installation, it would be like an extra clear layer, or a really thick layer of wax.
     

  5. brokencycle

    brokencycle Stylish Dinosaur Moderator

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    Another noob question: what wraps are you guys talking about? Are you just talking about the PPF? My mind immediately goes to the terrible looking vinyl wraps.
     

  6. otc

    otc Stylish Dinosaur

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    Of course, I'm far too poor for this. If I decide to pay for a car (or really, more like if I decide I want to pay for parking in my building), my thought has been to just do clear PPF on the front and rear bumpers to protect a bit from shitty parallel parkers. Maybe hood too depending on cost and how much other owners report the hood being a problem.
     

  7. Beckwith

    Beckwith Senior Member

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    I would think you would ceramic coat the paint directly, then add the PPF, it doesn't seem to make sense to add the ceramic coat to the PPF. The coatings have gotten much better since they debuted several years back. There were early issues with flashing and uneven applications, but those have been simplified making it easier for the hobbyist to apply. To me there is still something therapeutic about claying, prepping and waxing a car, but time is the key ingredient there, so putting on a coating that will last a few years is the ideal route. Then wash and maintain with some spray coatings.
     

  8. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    The ceramic coating goes on top of the PPF. As others have noted, it takes the place of wax, except it lasts much longer.

    Don't see what the point would be of doing it under the PPF.
     

  9. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    Dunno--seems like everyone getting a GT3 is doing a full wrap. $10K on a ~$200K car seems like a relatively incremental cost for 100% comprehensive protection.
     

  10. Texasmade

    Texasmade Distinguished Member

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    So go with the full wrap. No point in trying to save a few $k on a $200k car at that price. I would if I could afford a GT3.
     

  11. Dino944

    Dino944 Distinguished Member

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    Its a personal choice. I know 2 guys with 991 Turbo S and Turbo S Cabriolets...both just did the full front and rockers. One guy already sold his car though for a manual GT3...he tends to change cars every 2-3 years. If you are a stickler for condition do the full wrap. Why compromise ...as I pointed out if you do a partial, with those wide hips on a GT3 you could still get chips on the top sides of the fenders...something I learned with the Cayman.
     

  12. Dino944

    Dino944 Distinguished Member

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    We are talking about PPF which is clear...not those silly colored wraps people do to change colors or having silly patterns on a car. Its to protect the paint from stone chips and light impacts.
     

  13. Dino944

    Dino944 Distinguished Member

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    If its a very high quality and installed by pro's with a ceramic coating it is nearly as shiny and clear looking as paint. The new PPFs are far better than the old ones from 5-10 years ago. None of the "Orange peel" that was common in the old stuff.

    I've had guys look at my cars and they are shocked to learn they have PPF on them. It's definitely worth the expense for people that are into preserving the factory original paint and keeping a car looking its best.
     

  14. HRoi

    HRoi Stylish Dinosaur

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    You correct the paint first, then PPF it, then ceramic coat. All factory paints since I’ve been involved in cars have needed work from day 1. Orange peel on high end German cars was a well known joke in the 90’s, and all these “hand built” RR’s, Astons and Ferraris has notoriously shitty paints, especially when they were still using lacquers and/or single stage paint.

    The PPF has to go after the paint correction because who wants to preserve imperfections in film? And the coating has to go over the PPF because PPF won’t stick to the CC
     

  15. jcman311

    jcman311 Distinguished Member

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    Was gonna say this, but didn't want to dive into the "factory paint sucks" aspect of it especially when dealing with expensive cars. Yes, it is nicer than a honda paint job but it is still machine applied (in most cases).
     

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