Carlos Santos Shoes - Feedback & Appreciation

[visigoth]

Gentlemen, meet the new Adelaides in Alentejo. Love this last (358), and am surprised to say that I love the color. I knew I'd like it, but photographs lie, and this patina looks different in every second photo on the web. Some photos make it look a touch pink, which it isn't. This is pretty close to accurate. (Bought them from Quality Shop, who are, along with Skoaktiebolaget -- where I purchased my last pair of CS -- wonderful to deal with.)

 

[MST]

Hi all,
1st post from a new member, with 2 questions.

I'm looking for a pair of brogue boots, and the Carlos Santos ones look pretty good (https://www.afinepairofshoes.co.uk/.../carlos-santos-brogue-boot-in-guimaraes-grain).

I'm also considering the Barker Calder (https://www.barker-shoes.co.uk/calder/), and Loake Bosworth (https://www.loake.co.uk/bosworth.html), although I don't really like 2 tone boots so it depends how they look in real life. I've not had a chance to try to Loakes or Barkers on yet as no-one stocks them near me so I'll have to pop to Jermyn street when I'm next in London. I thought the Grenson Fred looked nice online, but when I tracked a pair down in a shop I didn't like the way they looked at all, and they didn't feel very high quality (more like Loake lifestyle than 1880).

Question 1:
How do the Carlos Santos compare quality-wise to Barker and Loake?

Question 2:
Size-wise I'm a 7.5, and have a pair of Loake Downings and Loake Pimlico Suede (both capital last) in UK7.5 that fit me pretty well, though I get quite a bit of creasing on top as I think I have a low instep (think I'm interpreting 'low instep' correctly). These are the only 2 pairs of formal shoes I own - I work in 'tech' so my Adidas Stan Smiths are relatively formal for my office! I've tried on a pair of Loake Cornwall (on the narrow Duke last) that fit me perfectly - unfortunately they only seem to make 1 shoe in this last and I don't like the colour.

If I went for the Carlos Santos brogues (333 last), should I stick with a UK7.5, or drop to a 7 do you think?

Thanks for any thoughts!

Mike

 

[dangerous]

Welcome.

I'll start with question 1: CS/Loake 1880s/Barker are basically the same quality, even if I think Barker is a tiny bit better.



My size 11 UK pair in the Capital last works with an insole but is roomy. I have not tried the 333 in CS, but I'd say it's a bit roomier at the same size as the Capital. I'd try to drop down half a size if you think the capital last is a bit on the tighter side than the looser, but I'm not experienced enough in these two lasts.

 

[Schweino]

Welcome.

I'll start with question 1: CS/Loake 1880s/Barker are basically the same quality, even if I think Barker is a tiny bit better.

I have to disagree here, CS is definitely a few steps up from both Loake 1880 and Barker (made in England). Where Barker is the lowest grade of the three of them in my opinion. Barker leather quality is hit and miss and Loake's 1880 leathers are better but stiff as hell and tough to break in. CS leather quality is comparable to Loake in my opinion but not as stiff and easy to break in.

@MST : Grenson Fred if from their G two range and made in India, indeed sub-par quality. When buying Grenson go for their made in England lines (G one of G zero)

 

[dangerous]

I have to disagree here, CS is definitely a few steps up from both Loake 1880 and Barker (made in England). Where Barker is the lowest grade of the three of them in my opinion. Barker leather quality is hit and miss and Loake's 1880 leathers are better but stiff as hell and tough to break in. CS leather quality is comparable to Loake in my opinion but not as stiff and easy to break in.

I must have confused Barker with something else then, I should have made sure that the "I think" meant that I was unsure if it was the company I was thinking about instead of making it sound like that I think it is better.

Is CS really a few steps up from Loakes 1880? I feel like CS is good and all, but there's quite a bit of difference. CS uses a lot of crust leather and patina, which I'm not very fond of, while Loakes lasts are generally less refined. I never had an issue with Loake 1880s, but they might have gotten worse over the few years since I last bought a pair?

I got way too many pairs of CS though and recently switched away from them.

 

[WilYa]

I have to disagree here, CS is definitely a few steps up from both Loake 1880 and Barker (made in England). Where Barker is the lowest grade of the three of them in my opinion. Barker leather quality is hit and miss and Loake's 1880 leathers are better but stiff as hell and tough to break in. CS leather quality is comparable to Loake in my opinion but not as stiff and easy to break in.

@MST : Grenson Fred if from their G two range and made in India, indeed sub-par quality. When buying Grenson go for their made in England lines (G one of G zero)

I echo CS is better than the others mentioned here.

 

[tonicab]

What is diference between 234 and z401?

I have 8,5UK in 234 and I have just bought a double monk for sale in pediwear.co.uk in 234.

I have seen one hour after they sell new last z401.

Change the 234 for z401?

 

[Schweino]

@tonicab : a quick thread search for "401" popped up these for instance.

I prefer last 234 over 401 and 401 over 160

Hi buddy, yes that's right. Most of the styles built on the 234 last offered via the Patina Service Program have now been replaced by the new 401 last, which is slightly slimmer at the toecap. Other than that, the sizing fits the same for both last. Also, do note that Carlos Santos' shoes are generally slightly more generous compared to other brands.

Do you've any size reference from other brands such as Carmina? Most of our customers usually size down by half from their usual dress shoe sizes. I'm a Carmina Rain UK7.5, and I take the UK7 on Carlos Santos 234/401 last. Hope this helps!

Our experience would suggest otherwise. We have customers who had bought the old double monk strap in the 234 and then ordered the same size in the 401 but found it too narrow - we swapped it for the next half size up and this worked well. If the Carmina Rain is about as snug as you would want to go I would probably have advised you try the next half size up on the 401. Of course, everyone is different, but we have been advising on this basis since and have not encountered any difficulties.

Mike

 

[Schweino]

Field boots from @Afinepairofshoes

 

[Paul902]

Hi, can anyone here compare fit of CS333 to Carmina Oscar (or Soller)? The Oscar fits me very well. I like the low instep better than that on Soller. Wondering if in 333 I'd need to size down, or OK in my usual 8.5UK.

 

[misiuacademy]

Hi all,
1st post from a new member, with 2 questions.

I'm looking for a pair of brogue boots, and the Carlos Santos ones look pretty good (https://www.afinepairofshoes.co.uk/.../carlos-santos-brogue-boot-in-guimaraes-grain).

I'm also considering the Barker Calder (https://www.barker-shoes.co.uk/calder/), and Loake Bosworth (https://www.loake.co.uk/bosworth.html), although I don't really like 2 tone boots so it depends how they look in real life. I've not had a chance to try to Loakes or Barkers on yet as no-one stocks them near me so I'll have to pop to Jermyn street when I'm next in London. I thought the Grenson Fred looked nice online, but when I tracked a pair down in a shop I didn't like the way they looked at all, and they didn't feel very high quality (more like Loake lifestyle than 1880).

Question 1:
How do the Carlos Santos compare quality-wise to Barker and Loake?

Question 2:
Size-wise I'm a 7.5, and have a pair of Loake Downings and Loake Pimlico Suede (both capital last) in UK7.5 that fit me pretty well, though I get quite a bit of creasing on top as I think I have a low instep (think I'm interpreting 'low instep' correctly). These are the only 2 pairs of formal shoes I own - I work in 'tech' so my Adidas Stan Smiths are relatively formal for my office! I've tried on a pair of Loake Cornwall (on the narrow Duke last) that fit me perfectly - unfortunately they only seem to make 1 shoe in this last and I don't like the colour.

If I went for the Carlos Santos brogues (333 last), should I stick with a UK7.5, or drop to a 7 do you think?

Thanks for any thoughts!

Mike

Hi Mike!

First of all, i am a long time lurker but I finally registered. I will try to answer your questions or worries. I run a small style/review blog called Misiu Academy and one of my favourite categories is shoes! You can find many of my reviews in the goodywearwelt sub on Reddit as well.

If you are hell bent on buying those brogues sure! But why don't you use the patina service? It is on amazing discount right now on pediwear (https://www.pediwear.co.uk/carlos-santos/patina-service/) as it is currently on 224£ (244£ for boots)! I bought a pair of derby shoes from there in Coimbra and i am waiting for them in 1-2 weeks. Let me know if you would be interested in reading a review. I also have a pair of Coimbra lace ups coming up in the same time period.

Question 1: No idea about the barker, but i can tell you about the Loake 1880. I have the Chatsworth and Aldwych and I must admit that the break in (especially on the former) is quite long. The capital last is far more generous for me on the Aldwych and a UK8 compared to the Carlos Santos UK7 and Loake Chatsworth UK7. The oxfords on that last however are very comfortable. I find the Chatsworth kinda narrow on the small toes.

Both are very good entry shoes, but CS is on a whole new level of leather, finish and presentation. If you are looking for classic british then sure go for the Loake, but man the CS double monks on wine shadow I have are beautiful.

The Loakes have aged well in the 1 year I have them. A little creasing in the vamp but overall look as good as new. Here's a recent picture of the Aldwych.

And the Chatsworth:

Question 2: Unfortunately I am not familiar with the CS 333 last, but I am with the Z401 and 234 and UK7 works for me. As mentioned, the Capital is roomier for me and had a bigger size. They have free returns but I would advise sending a message to CS customer service, Ana Santos is an amazing person and I have been corresponding with them for the last 6 months.

Let me know if anyone would be interested in reading the reviews.

Nice to formally meet you all!

Kostas

 

[misiuacademy]

What is diference between 234 and z401?

I have 8,5UK in 234 and I have just bought a double monk for sale in pediwear.co.uk in 234.

I have seen one hour after they sell new last z401.

Change the 234 for z401?

Hi! From what I have collected the Z401 is a newer last replacing the 234 (not sure 100% and I can't find my source) but I talked to the guys in Skoak and told me that the 234 is essentially similar and I should go for the same size. My 2 new pairs arrive in a couple of weeks so I will see the difference if any!

 

[JJRADICK]

How does 316 and 234 last fit?

 

[MST]

I went ahead and bought the CS brogue boots from A fine Pair of Shoes in 7.5. Great service from them, and speedy delivery. I initially wondered whether I needed to try a 7 but with thick socks they fit great. Worn them all day today and although they feel new they aren't uncomfortable. Really pleased with them. They certainly don't feel inferior to Loakes. I'd say the CS333 last seems to have a little less height in the mid-foot area (between the toe box and the instep) than the Loake Capital, which probably suits me better. There's not as much creasing as I get on Loakes.

 

[Crafty Cumbrian]

Picked these up from Herring, made by CS for Herrings. I’ve had a pair before which were thre most beautiful boot ever but were just too tight. These were reviewed as being wider and sure enough I could wear with thicker socks as a true to size boot. Picked up on sale so happy with my purchase.