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Brogue?

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by demeis, Dec 13, 2004.

  1. demeis

    demeis Senior member

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    I have a very brief understanding of brogue in shoes. I was wondering if someone could explain it to me and is it good or bad. NO brogue, semi-brogue, or fully brogue? Which one to look for ect.
     


  2. FIHTies

    FIHTies Senior member

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    I predict that Jcusey will at some point and time respond to this thread. Happy Holidays Jcusey. [​IMG] JJF
     


  3. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Will not. Ummm, well since I couldn't resist, I might as well answer the question. "Brogueing" refers to perforations incorporated into a shoe design. A full brogue is a wingtip: [​IMG] A half brogue is similar, only with a cap-toe rather than a wingtip: [​IMG] Edit: And a shoe with no brogueing will have no perforations on it at all, like this cap-toe for example: [​IMG] All pictures are from Crockett & Jones.
     


  4. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    "Brogueing" refers to the little holes punched into the edges, near the seams, of the constituent pieces of a shoe. Â These holes are purely decorative. Â They serve, in general, to "spiff up" a shoe, but also make shoes less formal, more casual, and more countrified. Â Shoes with brogueing are called, generically, "brogues." The difference betwee quarter, half, etc. brogues depends on the amount of brogueing, and in some respects the design of the shoe. "Punch caps" have brogueing only on the seam that joins the toe cap to the shoe's upper. Â This is a punch cap: http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/03767.../bonora_01.htm "Quarter brogues" have brogueing on the toe cap seam, and also on the seams that join the quarters to the vamp. Â Shoe #1 here is a quarter brogue. http://www.gjcleverley.co.uk/stock/bltown2a.gif "Semi brogues" are like quarter brogues, except that they also have a toe medallion decoration. Â These are semi brogues: http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/welt-...ount90_top.htm Some shoemakers call a semi-brogue with a heel counter a "three quarter brogue": http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/shoe.com/diplomat.htm "Full brogues" are commonly called "wing tips" in America: http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/0376732....enu.htm There are several variations to these designs, depending on whether the shoe is an Oxford or a blucher (derby): http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/welt-...b1/jlobb01.htm Oxfords can also be adelaides: http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/welt-...3/milano03.htm or straight sided (Balmorals): http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/welt-...leverley06.htm EDIT: Too slow. Well, what the hell, we can never have too many posts about shoes.
     


  5. RIDER

    RIDER Senior member

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    Brogueing is a term to describe a pattern of perforations on the upper; either the strip of perfs that outline the seams of the pattern, or the medallion, or both. It is usually accompanied by pinked edges. The European manufacturers also use this term to define patterns. For example:

    Captoe with medallion = semi-brogue
    Wingtip with medallion = full-brogue

    If either of these patterns did not have a medallion, or pinking, it could still be identified by these terms. However, if no perfs exist, it would simply be called a plain - ____.
     


  6. Horace

    Horace Senior member

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    I had read somewhere -- and I cannot recall where -- that brogueing was originally put on a shoe to allow one to trek through the field. The holes allowed water to pass through the shoe. This seems half-plausible. And I wonder if anyone can confirm my notion or disabuse me of it?

    If what I'd read is correct, then the origins of the brogue are in sport. And as such, would be less formal than one without brogueing.
     


  7. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    I have heard this too, but I don't find it plausible.  What idiot wants to trek through the Scottish moors soaking his feet in a continuous bath of icy water?
     


  8. Horace

    Horace Senior member

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    (Horace @ 13 Dec. 2004, 8:32) I had read somewhere -- and I cannot recall where -- that brogueing was originally put on a shoe to allow one to trek through the field. Â The holes allowed water to pass through the shoe.
    I have heard this too, but I don't find in plausible. Â What idiot wants to trek through the Scottish moors soaking his feet in a continuous bath of icy water?
    I'm sure we could find or two out there, what?
     


  9. Looking to improve

    Looking to improve Senior member

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    Can this thread (or Jcusey's and Manton's) posts be linked in the HOF:Glossary of...-thread?

    MtB
     


  10. justlurkingthanks

    justlurkingthanks Senior member

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    And I heard brogueing was started by Irish fishermen who punched the holes to allow water to escape.
     


  11. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    Manton, strange as it may be, some army boots were designed the same way- to let water in and out easily. I guess the assumption was that water would get in, at least you can help the water get out easily.
     


  12. TKDKid

    TKDKid Senior member

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    From the Shipton & Heneage website:

    "The brogue remains the English Gentleman's shoe of choice. However, very few people are aware as to how this distinctive style arose. Amazingly the holes were introduced in Scotland and Ireland in the 4th/5th Century. This meant that the locals did not have to wander around with shoes full of water as they negotiated the sodden terrain of their homeland. The holes became decorative and although from an evolutionary point of view obsolete, this legacy exists today."

    From Handmade Shoes for Men:

    "It was Irish farmers who first began to decorate shoes with patterns of holes. Their shoes tended to become waterlogged due to the wet ground in the bogs where they worked. They put holes into the toe caps and quarters of their heavy leather shoes so that the insides would dry better."
     


  13. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    It's a wonder everyone didn't get gangrene or trench foot and have their feet fall off.

    Is this serious? Is there any historical record?
     


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