Blake Stitch/Good Year Welt Procedure

[Mr Lam]

Hi all,

Recently made an enquiry about how the soles of a pair of shoes at x company are made. They told me that their shoes are glued to the upper first before being stitched.

I've probed even further (hey, I want my shoes to last) and they've also clarified that the soles are glued to the upper before they stitch them to the upper (apologies for the repetition there, but I had to make sure we were on the same page).

I'm making this post because I want to be sure that's how the process usually works: the soles are glued before being stitched to the upper.

How often are there cases like that?

 

[breakaway01]

Are you talking about Goodyear welted shoes or Blake stitched shoes? Goodyear construction stitches the outsole to the welt, not to the upper. Blake stitching goes through the insole, upper, and outsole. Anyhow, neither method requires cementing of the outsole to the welt or upper. I could imagine that cementing might help speed up the construction process but it's hardly necessary.

Care to share the name of this company?

 

[Mr Lam]

The company is "Supreme Leather Wear". I've attached the link to their ad on Bonanza.

Update: they've come back to me and attached a photo of how the shoes are made. It sounds really sketchy. What are our thoughts?

 

[breakaway01]

Hard to tell from the small picture but it does not look like a GYW shoe (can't make out a canvas rib). On the other hand, I do see what appears to be a welt, so it does not seem to be Blake stitched either. In any case, the photos of the shoes on the website look like a corrected grain leather. I would avoid.

 

[Veit Lehmann]

I agree with breakaway01. Normally the upper leather is fixed with nails, before it is connected with the canvas rib and the welt. If you don't see a canvas rib, it might be done with an even more elaborate technique: Instead of using a glued canvas rib, you cut a 'canal' into the inner sole and use this to saw through it. This is however an expensive method and I highly doubt that they can sell their shoes for about 200 $. I have attached a picture of the Goodyear Welting technique. ​

 

[AssMan543]

Dude, they all use cement before stitching the outsole to the upper, whether gyw or Blake. Otherwise the soles would fall out as soon as you wear through the threads. There are numerous photos of shoes worn through the threads but still attached to the shoe.

 

[breakaway01]

Dude, they all use cement before stitching the outsole to the upper, whether gyw or Blake. Otherwise the soles would fall out as soon as you wear through the threads. There are numerous photos of shoes worn through the threads but still attached to the shoe.

not true. a lock stitch is used precisely to avoid this problem. No cement is needed.

 

[AssMan543]

not true. a lock stitch is used precisely to avoid this problem. No cement is needed.

It may not be needed, but most manufacturers do it anyway because having the cement as a reinforcement is just a better engineered structure.

 

[breakaway01]

you were completely wrong about your original claim; what makes you so sure about this one? If there is any glue used to facilitate stitching the sole to the welt, it seems unlikely to be used for structural integrity. When a GYW shoe is resoled it does not appear to be difficult to pull the unstitched sole off the upper+welt, which makes me think that if there is any cement or glue used, it can't be too strong of a bond.

Anyhow since neither of us is an expert on this, perhaps @Nick V. can shed some light on this.

 

[AssMan543]

No.i am right

 

[Veit Lehmann]

you were completely wrong about your original claim; what makes you so sure about this one? If there is any glue used to facilitate stitching the sole to the welt, it seems unlikely to be used for structural integrity. When a GYW shoe is resoled it does not appear to be difficult to pull the unstitched sole off the upper+welt, which makes me think that if there is any cement or glue used, it can't be too strong of a bond.

Anyhow since neither of us is an expert on this, perhaps @Nick V. can shed some light on this.

The AssMan is actually right. Glue is also used for the gyw method, even though the sole is stitched to the welt. It is just more stable that way and all of the famous brands do it.

 

[breakaway01]

interesting, thank you.