The arguement can be made, about the Suns prior to Nash joining the team, and the success they've had since. Prior to Nash arrival, the Suns were already widely considered as a powerhouse-to-be, with Shawn Marion + Amare + (then)Starbury. Barbosa and Joe Johnson were still learning the ropes, Boris Diaw and Raja Bell were nowhere to be found. What's your argument again? The Suns were mediocre at best without Nash, and that's with their allstars, whereas the Lakers actually pulled off some wins without Kobe The first part of your statement, as I just proved, is ludicrous. As for the other half, well, those wins came before Luke Walton and a few others went down with injury. Their game all have regressed significantly since. I mean, Amare, Matrix, Bell, Barbosa, Kurt Thomas, and even James Jones are better (and far more consistent) than all of Kobe's teammates with the possible exception of Lamar Odom.