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Best/Good position in Accounting/Finance?

longskate88

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I'm in college right now (SDSU) majoring in Accounting and might minor in Finance, and should get out with fairly good grades and a few connections. After a few years of experience, where should I aim to go? My current plan is to get my CPA, and specialize in Estate taxes or something else in the tax range.

I'm not looking for much money, just a decent lifestyle where I get some job satisfaction. I'd love to hear from those who are experienced in the field. From what I hear, the hours of a CPA around tax time sound like the worst part, but maybe after some years I could open my own little tax firm, and live a quieter lifestyle. Any thoughts?
worship.gif
 

Mark from Plano

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I'd start with a Big 4 or 2nd tier CPA firm to start. The experience and contacts you can gain there are unmatched. You will work like a dog for the first few years (at least), but you're young, you'll get over it. Plus, if you open up you're own shop you'll work even harder than that (but the rewards will likely be greater).

Accounting is an apprenticeship profession. You need to remember that and find the place where you can best extend your education.

I spent a total of about 10 years (in 2 different stints) in the Big 8/6 (now 4). It was a lot of hard work, but it didn't kill me and really sharpened my skills for the things that I would do later.

JMO.
 

longskate88

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Thanks! How exactly do you determine the different tiers of firms? Seeing as how I've never worked a day of my life doing what you do for a living, It seems to my a smaller firm would be preferable. Am I wrong in that respect? I know some people who work in small, 15-30 person firms locally. What are the negatives of working for a small firm? Seems like the 'atmosphere' would be better.

Also, how hard is it to get into a Big 4? Say I graduate with a 3.5 in the major, with one internship for experience.

Lastly, do I just continue in school to get the extra classes for the 150 hour rule, or work for a few years THEN start working on the CPA?

Thanks a bunch!
 

Serg

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agree with the big 4 recommendation.
 

Mark from Plano

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Originally Posted by longskate88
Thanks! How exactly do you determine the different tiers of firms? Seeing as how I've never worked a day of my life doing what you do for a living, It seems to my a smaller firm would be preferable. Am I wrong in that respect? I know some people who work in small, 15-30 person firms locally. What are the negatives of working for a small firm? Seems like the 'atmosphere' would be better.

Also, how hard is it to get into a Big 4? Say I graduate with a 3.5 in the major, with one internship for experience.

Lastly, do I just continue in school to get the extra classes for the 150 hour rule, or work for a few years THEN start working on the CPA?

Thanks a bunch!


Big 4 (E&Y, KMPG, PWC, and D&T) will be fairly competitive. Not sure what the hiring standards are in the Big 4 these days, but someone at your school will know. It will also vary depending on what school you go to. Before I left my former firm they had significantly reduced the number of schools that they recruited from. That said, if you can't get in with a Big 4, go for a national firm like Grant Thornton, BDO Siedman, McGladrey, etc.

You should definitely do the 150 hours and start working on your CPA immediately. Any firm worth its salt will require it.

Forget "atmosphere". Among the 15 things you should be considering right now "atmosphere" doesn't make the top 50. Worry about atmosphere when you've started your own firm. In the meantime focus on working as hard as you can to learn your profession. Find the best firm you can that services the largest variety of clients.

The issue with smaller firms is that their practices are much more limited. If that's where you end up, that's where you end up and you can make the best of it, but given the choice you should go where you can maximize your exposure...exposure to learning, exposure to complexity...all of these things will increase your value in the long term. Increased value means increased options down the road.

Good luck.
 

Viktri

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Originally Posted by longskate88
I'm in college right now (SDSU) majoring in Accounting and might minor in Finance, and should get out with fairly good grades and a few connections. After a few years of experience, where should I aim to go? My current plan is to get my CPA, and specialize in Estate taxes or something else in the tax range. I'm not looking for much money, just a decent lifestyle where I get some job satisfaction. I'd love to hear from those who are experienced in the field. From what I hear, the hours of a CPA around tax time sound like the worst part, but maybe after some years I could open my own little tax firm, and live a quieter lifestyle. Any thoughts?
worship.gif

I actually just got an offer from a mid-sized firm in my city. My cousins are CAs and one has a CA and CPA so I've had lots of experience helping me along the way. This is a comparison from the Vancouver area (midsized VS big4) where there is heavy competition for any accounting job - there are 500 accounting graduates per year from my school and that doesn't include the other University with accounting graduates fighting over an expected 100-150 positions. Smaller or Midsized firm: - Higher salary (Midsized firms pay $41k-53k/yr VS $38-39 from Big4 - these are for 2008/2009 salaries I got off my friends working at the firms) - Spend more time in office (in Yaletown
icon_gu_b_slayer[1].gif
) - Broader range of duties Big4 Firm: - More benefits (compensates for $$$) - More help with CASB in terms of mentorship/classes/tutors (they have a greater CASB pass rate) - Travel alot - May work with a greater number of companies BUT if you are working for a big company (IE: Microsoft) you will spend all your time working for that firm rather than working at multiple firms - Can transfer to another country for a while - More hirees that start with you I imagine it is similar for CPA firms in the US.
 

longskate88

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Originally Posted by Connemara
Answer: there aren't any.
teacha.gif


Heey, don't say that
plain.gif
LOL
 

longskate88

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Originally Posted by Mark from Plano
Big 4 (E&Y, KMPG, PWC, and D&T) will be fairly competitive. Not sure what the hiring standards are in the Big 4 these days, but someone at your school will know. It will also vary depending on what school you go to. Before I left my former firm they had significantly reduced the number of schools that they recruited from. That said, if you can't get in with a Big 4, go for a national firm like Grant Thornton, BDO Siedman, McGladrey, etc.

You should definitely do the 150 hours and start working on your CPA immediately. Any firm worth its salt will require it.

Forget "atmosphere". Among the 15 things you should be considering right now "atmosphere" doesn't make the top 50. Worry about atmosphere when you've started your own firm. In the meantime focus on working as hard as you can to learn your profession. Find the best firm you can that services the largest variety of clients.

The issue with smaller firms is that their practices are much more limited. If that's where you end up, that's where you end up and you can make the best of it, but given the choice you should go where you can maximize your exposure...exposure to learning, exposure to complexity...all of these things will increase your value in the long term. Increased value means increased options down the road.

Good luck.



Thank you Mark. Now, starting at a smaller firm doesn't make you 'damaged goods' or anything, does it? I'll probably have to take what I can get, I'm not exactly at a top school or with the top GPA. That being said, thanks for the justifiation for the larger firm.

Also Mark, do you consider the profession to be challenging, and in what respect? I enjoy learning and am interested in the rules and regs of Tax, I'm just looking for reassurance that I won't get eaten alive in my first year ; )
 

Mark from Plano

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Originally Posted by longskate88
Thank you Mark. Now, starting at a smaller firm doesn't make you 'damaged goods' or anything, does it? I'll probably have to take what I can get, I'm not exactly at a top school or with the top GPA. That being said, thanks for the justifiation for the larger firm.

Also Mark, do you consider the profession to be challenging, and in what respect? I enjoy learning and am interested in the rules and regs of Tax, I'm just looking for reassurance that I won't get eaten alive in my first year ; )



No. But look, you need to view this as an apprenticeship. You need to find that best situation that you can for learning. Things like pay, benefits, work environment, etc. are secondary. That can all come later. Find someone who's doing what you want to be doing in 20 years and get them to teach you how to do it. Then become an expert in something. Eat up continuing education and training. Become indispensible. Do that and all the rest (money, perks, lifestyle) will follow, don't and you'll be worried about keeping a job for the next 30 years.
 

supercarl

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Originally Posted by Viktri
I actually just got an offer from a mid-sized firm in my city.

My cousins are CAs and one has a CA and CPA so I've had lots of experience helping me along the way.

This is a comparison from the Vancouver area (midsized VS big4) where there is heavy competition for any accounting job - there are 500 accounting graduates per year from my school and that doesn't include the other University with accounting graduates fighting over an expected 100-150 positions.

Smaller or Midsized firm:
- Higher salary (Midsized firms pay $41k-53k/yr VS $38-39 from Big4 - these are for 2008/2009 salaries I got off my friends working at the firms)
- Spend more time in office (in Yaletown
icon_gu_b_slayer[1].gif
)
- Broader range of duties

Big4 Firm:
- More benefits (compensates for $$$)
- More help with CASB in terms of mentorship/classes/tutors (they have a greater CASB pass rate)
- Travel alot
- May work with a greater number of companies BUT if you are working for a big company (IE: Microsoft) you will spend all your time working for that firm rather than working at multiple firms
- Can transfer to another country for a while
- More hirees that start with you

I imagine it is similar for CPA firms in the US.


This is the most sense posted so far,
 

Johnny_5

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I am happy I have stumbled upon this thread. Good stuff mark and Viktri.
 

vitaminc

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Originally Posted by Viktri
Big4 Firm: - More benefits (compensates for $$$) - More help with CASB in terms of mentorship/classes/tutors (they have a greater CASB pass rate) - Travel alot - May work with a greater number of companies BUT if you are working for a big company (IE: Microsoft) you will spend all your time working for that firm rather than working at multiple firms - Can transfer to another country for a while - More hirees that start with you
You missed on one important benefit of starting with a big firm: big 4 looks hella ******* better on resume. Always start your career in a bigger firm then go small. Unless you are very damn sure on what you are doing. But if you have to ask/post this thread, you probably arent.
 

supercarl

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Originally Posted by vitaminc
You missed on one important benefit of starting with a big firm: big 4 looks hella ******* better on resume.

Always start your career in a bigger firm then go small. Unless you are very damn sure on what you are doing. But if you have to ask/post this thread, you probably arent.


wRONG - i wouldnt take on someone from big 4 over someone from a smaller practice, it's all about exposure, which often doesn't come in big 4 firms.
 

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