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Best bespoke commission ever? I think so. *** PICTURES ADDED FOR THOSE LACKING IMAGINATION

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by mafoofan, Jan 21, 2013.

  1. Lovelace

    Lovelace Senior member

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    That collar style is what I believe is called an Ulster collar. A kind of storm collar. This collar style is a feature on several of the coat styles we have been discussing.

    There is also a variation called a Prussian collar.
     
  2. hendrix

    hendrix Senior member

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    I like the misappropriation of classic pieces.

    I dress casual 90% of the time, but generally prefer to wear MC shoes rather than sneakers. I like shell longwings with denim, or white wingtips with tapered washed jeans etc.
     
  3. Lovelace

    Lovelace Senior member

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    ..
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2013
  4. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I know what the collar is called. I was just describing how high the coat buttons up because I was asked.


    I think longwings can be great with jeans, and I have no problem with appropriating classic pieces in casual outfits. After all, the whole point of being casual is that there are few if any rules. It is what you want it to be. However, the reverse doesn't work nearly as well. An otherwise CBD-style outfit would fail with basketball sneakers. As a tux would. That makes sense. Though casual is about no having no hard rules, business formal, black tie, etc. are chock full of them.


    I've described in great length what I mean, in several posts.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2013
  5. Lovelace

    Lovelace Senior member

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    Are you familiar with the architect Adolf Loos?

    He is considered one of the founding fathers of Modernism (Style). His most famous, or infamous book depending on your particular bent is Ornamentation & Crime.

    In the book he makes the claim that how ornamentation can have the effect of making things go out of style and render them obsolete.This became part of the Modernist manifesto. Worth a read if you haven't already.

    He also wrote another book on Why a man should be well dressed.

    There are other writers, more in keeping with the flavour of our particular interest that I recommend. James Laver being foremost amongst them. Laver is excellent.
     
  6. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Thanks for the reading recommendations. Will look into them.

    Ornamentation is a different sort of sin in architecture, though. Like I argued it before, it comes down to the pace and cost of technology. Modernist architecture is born from the idea that materials, know-how, and technique have advanced so explosively that they should be embraced with conviction. Ornamentation detracts from that goal because it hides the glory of our advances, which should be promoted as more "true." Yet, no one would disagree that such ornamentation nonetheless has some value. Whether useful or not, a Corinthian column communicates a cultural message. I am a big proponent of modernism because I agree we need to divorce ourselves from such ornamentation when we have powerful enough tools to do something objectively better in the net. It is ultimately a cost-benefit analysis.

    I hypothesize that the difference with clothing is that we have not experienced technological advances great enough (and cheap enough) to justify shifting away from classic forms and their communicative value.
     
  7. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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    How is this? Have you read it, and if so, is it good?
     
  8. radicaldog

    radicaldog Senior member

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    Is this supposed to be a positive? Why, exactly?

    In any case the coat does look very good, though I would've gone for somewhat narrower lapels -- they almost touch the sleeves. I particularly like how the pleat opens from the half belt.
     
    1 person likes this.
  9. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    No, not a positive in and of itself. But I admire many of the coats I've seen from that era. The overcoats common in today's RTW realm are either hopelessly diluted or too strange and incoherent to consider.
     
  10. radicaldog

    radicaldog Senior member

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    Fair enough. By the way, I started a thread by quoting your modernism comments:

    http://www.styleforum.net/t/333582/on-why-we-like-modernist-chairs-and-houses-but-classical-clothes

    I hope to return to it tonight with some thoughts.

    Also, I completely agree that overcoat styles never became settled. The last one I made is three-quarter length, fly-front, slash pockets and single breasted, but with a storm collar (!). Arguably a goofy mongrel, but I think it works. The tweed large-scale herringbone I used is very similar to yours (a LL project).
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2013
  11. Lovelace

    Lovelace Senior member

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    ...
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2013
  12. wmb

    wmb Senior member

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    Would love to see a shot of that collar worn up -- looks like it would give fantastic protection from the cold.
     
  13. Cantabrigian

    Cantabrigian Senior member

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    There are enough different conversations going on at the same time that I don't mind shouting this out (to no one in particular)...

    It makes me angry and sad that there was an OCBD made with a french front.



    Those Mercer ones look like the second best batch of OCBDs ever made (after the one Geneva made me).
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. Cantabrigian

    Cantabrigian Senior member

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    :foo:, maybe you already covered this (this is a long thread) but why did Mariano want four rows of buttons as opposed to the - I believe - traditional three?
     
  15. Despos

    Despos Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    glad to know someone else noticed this too
     
  16. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I have no idea. Maybe because all the photos of great coats I showed him had rows of buttons going all the way up the chest. Think it would be better with three?
     
  17. aravenel

    aravenel Senior member

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    They do look pretty damn awesome.
     
  18. dopey

    dopey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    A higher buttoning point seems more practical for a super-warm coat. so the extra row makes sense. BTW, the photos from the straight on angle make the overcoat look more normal. I don't know if you think that is a good thing , or not.
     
  19. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    It's a good thing. It is much closer to what I see in the mirror and how I envisioned the project. Like I pointed out, the first pictures are distorted by the angle of the photo. My wife is one of the few people shorter than me, so she was pointing the camera upward a little. That makes the gorge look much higher and the collar much more horizontally oriented than they really are.

    In truth, the buttoning point isn't really any higher than it would be if there were only three rows of buttons. It's at my waist (real waist). There's just another row added-on down below. Of course, that forces me to button both center rows, which does alter the look.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2013
  20. Cantabrigian

    Cantabrigian Senior member

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    I think so - however slightly that may be.

    The extra (or extra relative to how I'm Monday morning quarterbacking things) row of buttons makes it look a little more martial.

    What I like most about this coat is that it doesn't look like a military surplus coat and the buttons tilt it a little back in the military direction.
     

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