Bespoke shoes from Shanghai - Jack Peng (all goodyear welted, supposedly)

[coxaca]

Shame about the price increase. I had a pair of shoes made by Jack Peng a couple of years ago. Went through the whole process of having a mold taken of my feet, from which lasts were made, and then the shoes were made from those. I chose Italian leather with a crocodile vamp, all in black; and the "more expensive" leather sole finish. Total cost was rmb 4800 - sounds like I got a (relative) bargain!

The shoes themselves are a very good fit and have worn in well. Overall though, I would say that the finish and general aura of refinement falls a little short of what can be had for the same price in a RTW shoe from, say, Santoni. Nevertheless, the MTM experience with a certain level of bespoke customisation is a pleasant one.

Finally I should add that Jack himself, while quite possibly a master shoemaker as he claims, is more of a businessman these days. I believe the actual shoes are made by a team of craftsmen in a factory somewhere outside Shanghai. Nothing wrong with that, but this is not some kind of old-style single-maker bespoke service.

Living in Shanghai as I do, I'd like to track down these Tianzi people. They seem to be mainly an internet outfit. Do they also offer a bricks-and-mortar bespoke service in Shanghai?

 

[LANO]

Tianzi people? Did I miss something? If you're looking to have more mtm shoes made, you should pay yan ye a visit (1363 fuxing road). I'm very happy with my first pair (a copy of Corthay Arca), and just ordered a second pair. Obviously, don't expect Santoni quality for rmb 1500, but the fit is great and the leather is full grain. So far I assess the quality to be a bit better than my Loake 1880 shoes, but with better fit and for a better price.

 

[babygreenspots]

It seems a lot of local people into classic style hold a very low opinion of Jack Peng. They seem to think that buying RTW shoes made in Europe is still much better value. I still haven't tried him though.

There is a general consensus among this kind of tribe that the local bespoke shoemakers should not be used. This might reflect a certain snobbery toward local products though.

 

[DWFII]



A. A. Crack's leather may not be very good either. I came across this post on The Crispin Colloquy a few weeks ago. I bolded the relevant words.

Check the date on that post.

Things have a way of changing in the leather world. As of this date, A.A. Crack are probably the best source of quality leathers for the small maker in the UK. As with many British firms...at least in my experience...it is not always easy to get a response from them esp. if you're in the US. But their leathers are generally top shelf.

 

[Ilovelobbs]

I ordered 3 pairs of MTO and MTM shoes in Shanghai couple of years back - each pair cost me 1500 RMB.
They took about 4-6 weeks to complete. ......

Overall, was happy with comfort, fitting; finishing and craftmanship, but disappointed with the leather grade they used (worst than Church's and Loakes) . Guess they don't have full access to the high-end leather sources in Western Europe. Mine was definitely locally sourced. ..............................

I found a bunch of these leather shoe shop behind Plaza 66 on Nan-Jian Road.
Prices vary - some quoted 1000 RMB to 3500 RMB............ .......................

In Plaza 66 you will also find the newly opened John Lobb in Shanghai - I am so glad I don't
live in this City. Their Lobbs were 40% dearer than London!!!

 

[coxaca]

It seems a lot of local people into classic style hold a very low opinion of Jack Peng. They seem to think that buying RTW shoes made in Europe is still much better value. I still haven't tried him though.

There is a general consensus among this kind of tribe that the local bespoke shoemakers should not be used. This might reflect a certain snobbery toward local products though.

Definitely snobbery. Certainly my JP bespokes are not a match for European or Japanese bespoke, but the fit is perfect, service was good, and at the price I am overall very happy.

 

[chogall]

Shame about the price increase. I had a pair of shoes made by Jack Peng a couple of years ago. Went through the whole process of having a mold taken of my feet, from which lasts were made, and then the shoes were made from those. I chose Italian leather with a crocodile vamp, all in black; and the "more expensive" leather sole finish. Total cost was rmb 4800 - sounds like I got a (relative) bargain!

The shoes themselves are a very good fit and have worn in well. Overall though, I would say that the finish and general aura of refinement falls a little short of what can be had for the same price in a RTW shoe from, say, Santoni. Nevertheless, the MTM experience with a certain level of bespoke customisation is a pleasant one.

Finally I should add that Jack himself, while quite possibly a master shoemaker as he claims, is more of a businessman these days. I believe the actual shoes are made by a team of craftsmen in a factory somewhere outside Shanghai. Nothing wrong with that, but this is not some kind of old-style single-maker bespoke service.

Living in Shanghai as I do, I'd like to track down these Tianzi people. They seem to be mainly an internet outfit. Do they also offer a bricks-and-mortar bespoke service in Shanghai?

Not a master shoemaker. He worked for a Taiwanese shoemaker/shoemaking factory and learned the business there. Not the same cut compare to the actual trainees from London's Cordwainer's College/College of Fashion who worked as outworkers for various British bespoke makers for several years, before setting up their shop.

For those who are interested...

 

[wurger]

Shame about the price increase. I had a pair of shoes made by Jack Peng a couple of years ago. Went through the whole process of having a mold taken of my feet, from which lasts were made, and then the shoes were made from those. I chose Italian leather with a crocodile vamp, all in black; and the "more expensive" leather sole finish. Total cost was rmb 4800 - sounds like I got a (relative) bargain! The shoes themselves are a very good fit and have worn in well. Overall though, I would say that the finish and general aura of refinement falls a little short of what can be had for the same price in a RTW shoe from, say, Santoni. Nevertheless, the MTM experience with a certain level of bespoke customisation is a pleasant one. Finally I should add that Jack himself, while quite possibly a master shoemaker as he claims, is more of a businessman these days. I believe the actual shoes are made by a team of craftsmen in a factory somewhere outside Shanghai. Nothing wrong with that, but this is not some kind of old-style single-maker bespoke service. Living in Shanghai as I do, I'd like to track down these Tianzi people. They seem to be mainly an internet outfit. Do they also offer a bricks-and-mortar bespoke service in Shanghai?

Not a master shoemaker. He worked for a Taiwanese shoemaker/shoemaking factory and learned the business there. Not the same cut compare to the actual trainees from London's Cordwainer's College/College of Fashion who worked as outworkers for various British bespoke makers for several years, before setting up their shop. For those who are interested...

nice find, chogall, anyone knows how much are Jack Peng's Bespoke shoes now?

 

[TheWraith]



Living in Shanghai as I do, I'd like to track down these Tianzi people. They seem to be mainly an internet outfit. Do they also offer a bricks-and-mortar bespoke service in Shanghai?

Go to this website and email Bonita. She'll let you know whether they have a bricks & mortar presence:

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/702551

 

[wurger]

Interesting, another reason for me to go back to Shanghai.

 

[TheWraith]



+1. My first pair from those guys are great, probably one of the first shoes I owned which required no breaking in and fitted my feet like a glove. They also managed to add a topy free of charge. 


My only criticism is that the laces had a tendency to undo themselves after some time. Maybe some wear would fix this. 

Well done, sir.

 

[coxaca]

Finally got around to taking some shots of my Jack Pengs.

Enjoy.











(Partially cross-posted from Alligator/Crocodile Shoes thread)

 

[TheWraith]

^ Lovely.

 

[yoose]

Living in Shanghai as I do, I'd like to track down these Tianzi people. They seem to be mainly an internet outfit. Do they also offer a bricks-and-mortar bespoke service in Shanghai?

Did you find out if they have a store in town? I would be interested in checking it out as well.

 

[Scotto]

I've purchased a pair almost a year ago and can't say they're worth anywhere near what I paid for them (I can't remember how much exactly).

I chose what I would describe as cap-toe oxfords with broguing at the seams, in dark walnut "french" leather. I went for all options, short of the foot molding. Basically, this gets you leather lining made of one piece of leather and a nicer sole. Calling this service anything else than made-to-measure is a gross exaggeration.

The process went like this:
1. Pick your pattern from what they have in their showroom.
2. Pick your leather from some swatches.
3. Try on shoes of various size and width until you find one that fits.
4. Wait a few weeks (can't remember how long exactly)
5. Come in for a fitting. Take them home or recommend some adjustments.

My experience:
I originally was looking for whole cuts with faux wingtip broguing. I can't remember if they didn't have this pattern or that it had something that I wanted them to change, but the answer was that they couldn't do it so I went a bit more conservative with the cap-toes. I think each style was also made on a specific last, meaning if I didn't like the overall shape of the floor pattern because it was too pointed, I couldn't ask them to make the shoe using the last of a different model.

I chose french leather. The swatches were fairly thick and rich. It was explained that the leather may not be exactly the same color because of tanning, variance, natural product, yadda yadda... No problems there.

Next came fitting. I was actually interested in having my feet molded but the sales person advised this is unnecessary unless your feet are misshaped. Now I''m starting to wonder if they even have the technology to use this info, of if it was just a gimmick and they just would find something close. I tried on a few, walking around a bit until I found something that was comfortable. They did pay attention to size both of my feet separately, but the sales person was not taking notes on a pad, and I couldn't see any of the results.

Finally, I chose bright orange for the lining. Because I opted for the premium service, there was a small oval cut out where I could write a custom insignia with a ball point pen.

Delivery time came and the shoes were tight. No problem, they took them back for a week or two for stretching. I picked them up and wore them for a week or two (about 2 days each week).

First impressions were the leather didn't feel as rich as the swatch. Color was good. Soles looked nice. Fit was still a bit tight, but most shoes need a little breaking in. Most surprising was my custom insignia was sewn in, but the message was still written in the same pen I used in the store. To be honest, I don't like monograms and didn't realize that it came with this until the sales person asked me to write something. however, I had expected them to do something with the insignia after I wrote it with a Bic. Perhaps trace my writing with a burnishing tool of some kind? Anyway, no big deal. I didn't want it in there anyway.

The shoes came in soft bags. No trees were provided.

After wearing the shoes a few times, once walking 6 blocks, my feet began to bleed. I took them back. Their solution was that they would re-size (stretch) them. The did nothing to remove the blood stains. The leather lining in the sole, was also coming up. This was strange because there is stitching there, but it's clearly just for decoration.

I picked them back up, fitting a bit better but still tight. I wear them about once every other week or every third week. I do walk quite a bit though. Within a month, the rubber inset in the heal had worn out. I also go a slight nick in the toe, which was not dyed beyond the very surface.

After almost a year, I'd say the leather of these is fairly low quality and nothing like the samples you see in the store. The broguing is not that consistent and a close look shows many mistakes.

Quality wise, you're better off with Allen Edmonds or whatever basic shoe you could buy at a reputable store. I don't wear them nearly as often as other shoes because they're not that comfortable and I feel the uppers are a bit fragile.

Style wise, apart from the tanning that is quickly fading (I might get creative with polishing on these), they look pretty good. I do like the style and color and even with all of their flaws, they somehow still look elegant.

If someone tried to sell them back to me, I'd say they're worth about $150 new. I think Jack Peng has put all of their money into marketing and none of it into materials or craftsmanship. If you would see these shoes in a department store, you'd see they weren't worth the money. I definitely wont be buying again.

Regarding Tianzi, I emailed them a few months ago and they told me they don't have a physical store. I'm also pretty sure they're not located in Shanghai. It's a shame because I don't want to go through the trouble of sizing shoes by mail. Then again, I could have probably bought 3 pairs of shoes from them for the price of Jack Peng and come out with a higher quality product in the end.