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Bergdorf shoe find

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Lomezz, Jul 7, 2004.

  1. Lomezz

    Lomezz Senior member

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    I was taking my lunchtime consitutional which often includes a peek into saks/bergdorf/barney's, and spotted htese Pelusos for $199, down from $475. I'd reckon it's a fair deal- good quality leather, goodyear construction. There were a couple of Gravatis there for the same price, though they were all Blake construction. [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  2. bigbadbuff

    bigbadbuff Senior member

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    looks good to me, nice find
     
  3. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    Nice looking. I think Peluso makes decent stuff. See any casual shoes on sale? Say, Kiton loafers for $199...?? [​IMG]
     
  4. Lomezz

    Lomezz Senior member

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    you dropped a zero there on the Kiton prices... they had a beautiful pair of Kiton full cuts in antique red - $1800 and change.

    But there were 3 pairs of Lattanzis (the tame kind) at 50% - practically giving the darn things away at $900 a pop...
     
  5. norcaltransplant

    norcaltransplant Senior member

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    Were there a lot of Peluso's on sale?  I'm interested to see how they compare to likes of Barret and Lidfort.  All three brands are priced in the mix-lux range but can be had at significant discounts... I remember T4 discussing Lidforts for around 125 Euros.  The Peluso's look like a deal for $199--nicer finishing than the Goodyear Alden's at BB.

    Must show restraint...
     
  6. Lomezz

    Lomezz Senior member

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    There were a few Pelusos for sale, including ones with the 'too boot' label which also stated 'fate a mano', but were blake-constructed. Prices are about the same - $200 on sale.

    I'd put Peluso (at least the goodyear welted ones) above Lidfort in terms of quality. I've seen a few Lidforts on sale today at Barney's, and some were made with the kind of shiny, plasticky leather one usually associates with the likes of kenneth cole. Only caveat is there are probably several grades of Lidfort, as well as Peluso. Can't comment on Barret, though, as I've yet to see them.
     
  7. AlanC

    AlanC Senior member

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    What tipped you off that they might be Goodyear welted? [​IMG]
     
  8. T4phage

    T4phage Senior member

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    For the prices you quoted me, I saw them last year on sale in Rome, pretty nice shoes. However, there is another "level" of Lidforts, and they can cost upwards of Euro 500. (Looking to Improve - have you gone to Hardies and seen thier wholecut Lidforts in a beautiful antiqued brown/burgundy?). Barrett is also quite a nice shoe, with the upper ranges of their beatuiful blake shoes costing (here) about Euro 400, such as these pair: [​IMG]. Their norwegians cost even more.
     
  9. RIDER

    RIDER Senior member

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    Peluso makes pretty decent shoes, IMO. I've looked at them a few times. The leathers are mainly chrome with a veg retan - come off kind of waxy and hard to work. Not as supple/fine as they could be. Bottom work is very nice though. Lidfort makes a better shoe, from what I have seen. And Barrett is MUCH better.
     
  10. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Okay, you lost me. I understand chrome tanning. I understand vegetable tanning. Why would you tan it once with chrome and then tan it again with vegetally.
     
  11. RIDER

    RIDER Senior member

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    OK, it's a complicated deal, but... veg tanning was the method for centuries to tan hides. Â The process took 6-9 months, then down to 1-2 months by the turn of the century (1905 I believe) when Freudenburg developed the process of adding chromium salts to the mix which had the principal effect of cutting the tanning time to 1-2 days. Â This obviously had great financial impact for Fruedenburg, but the product had some problems. Â First, there was no 'coverage', so only the best, non-marked hides could go thru the process. Â Second, there was no shrinkage, or grain tightening, so the leather ended up being very loose. Â In other words, the shoes made with this leather stretched too much. Â This is how 'Box Calf' came about; Freudenburg max stretched (boarded) the leather in two directions (opening the pores into a 'box&#39[​IMG] before delivering to shoe manufacturers. Â This eliminated the stretching problem. Â Combine that with the fact that only flawless hides can go thru this process, and you have a very tough, clean leather. Â Now, since most hides are not flawless, a tannery who wants to speed up the processing time (most tanneries) can take a lower grade hide, chrome tan it and follow with a veg 'retan' which has the effect of shrinking out (6-8% total) minor defects such as fat wrinkles. Â This also provides a medium for the dye to provide a more uniform coverage, which also covers up imperfections. Â This is why you see a 'waxy' film in the reflection as well as a uniform finish - it flows well after the re-tan. Â So, this is the most authentic definition of 'corrected grain'. Â Now, of course, most associate the rolled on, built up (or worse, sprayed on) pigment process as 'corrected grain'. Â To finish, this leather we see is 'corrected grain', but better than the covered 'corrected grain' we see more of. sorry about the goofy winking guy, don't know how I did that.
     
  12. Lomezz

    Lomezz Senior member

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    RIDER - most enlightening. Is full-veg tanned leather, then, the best choice? which brands use it today?

    Can you rate the different types of leathers by quality? (i.e., veg tanned, chromium tanned, chrome-veg, and other methods)

    How does thickness come into play in this ranking? I've noticed that many Italian brands use thinner, more supple leathers, whereas English brands tend to use more substantial skins.

    Thanks.
     
  13. RIDER

    RIDER Senior member

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    well, it depends on the product.  Veg tan is used mainly for the more rugged, casual leathers.  Pure chrome is the best tanning for dress leathers.  Quality goes beyond the tanning type.  Many other variables; thats too difficult a question to answer in general terms.  As for the 'thicker' leather used by English manufacturers, what you are really feeling is a thicker cotton/linen 'doubler' pressed between the upper and lining.  Universally, dress shoe upper leathers are between 3-5 oz.  Casual uppers (veg tanned, hot stuffed) are generally thicker.
     
  14. RIDER

    RIDER Senior member

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    Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed the shoes in question are labeled 'goodyear', yet there is clearly a channel in the outsole.?.
     
  15. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Well, yes, but the channel looks close enough to the sole edge that it could be from a welt stitch rather than a Blake stitch.
     
  16. Lomezz

    Lomezz Senior member

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    Yes, but isn't there supposed to be one in goodyear welted shoes? I mean, the stitch that goes through the welt and the outer sole.

    BTW, wouldn't it be great if every shoe maker would label their shoes in terms of construction method, leather type, sole leather type, etc.? I say it's no less important than labeling food products or drugs...
     
  17. RIDER

    RIDER Senior member

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    I guess I've just never seen it like that. I suppose you are right.
     
  18. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    That would be much too easy. What would I obsess about then?
     
  19. Lomezz

    Lomezz Senior member

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    Â Â Â Â [​IMG] Oh, I'm not too worried - there's always waist bevels to measure, last numbers to memorize and shining technique to perfect.
     

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