Attention edward green fans

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by shoefan, Jan 4, 2004.

  1. shoefan

    shoefan Senior member

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    I was visiting NYC this weekend and dropped by the Oxxford store on 57th street. As has been reported either here or on Andy's forum, Oxxford is in the process of discontinuing the Green shoes, either because of supply problems or, as per an Oxxford salesperson, because Oxxford has purchased C&J (of which I am skeptical).

    Anyhooo..., the remaining Greens are 1/2 off, making the shoes $350, boots $365.

    The sizes were generally the "end sizes," but included 7.5/8 (British/American), 8/8.5, 8.5/9, 10/10.5 (I think), 10.5/11, and 11/11.5. Widths were mainly E, with a few D's thrown in. Lasts were primarily 202 with a few 606.

    The Green styles included (varying styles in different sizes):
    Piccadilly slip-on in Black (sizes 7.5/8 and 8/8.5, D width); Berkeley in Black (size 8/8.5 and 8.5/9, others I think in larger sizes) and Dark Oak (I bought the 8/8.5, others in larger sizes); Fawsley in Black - I think - on the 606 last, Chelsea in Black (size 8.5/9, perhaps others); a skin-stitched derby in a lightish tan - akin to the Dover but without the hand-sewn center seam (perhaps Acorn or Chestnut), Galway boot in a country calf (Rosewood?) with Dainite sole (several sizes, including 8/8.5), a very nice cap toe with medallion on the 606 last in a lightish tan (not sure model name), and an oxford (don't remember particular style) in a suede (Fox suede?). They may also have had the Malverne wing-tip in a lightish tan. I may have forgotten one or two other styles.

    I would guess that Oxxford would ship the shoes with a credit card number, and I presume they could quickly tell you the styles they have in your size, since they are arranged by size. Please just don't waste their time by calling without any real interest in buying, or if you don't know your size.
     
  2. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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  3. norcaltransplant

    norcaltransplant Senior member

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    Update on the EG sale: REALLLY nice stuff left if you're a 10.5-11D. Dark Oak, mmmm. Everything for the wee' little people like myself are gone except for some really nice black loafers (I settled on a pair of relatively ostentacious, black medallion oxfords... the Malvern, I think). Strangely, my first Greens were in a 202 last, D width and they needed some laps around the house before conforming to my foot. The Malverns are marked identically, save for the "EG made for Oxxford clothes", but fit like a traditional American D on my feet (otherwise, they fit fine). Do I detect a discrepancy? Thanks again shoefan. I wish I knew about it earlier. No more shoes for me, or at least until the summer warehouse sale when I recoup [​IMG]
     
  4. Alias

    Alias Senior member

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    Why are none of these awesome shoe auctions ever in my size [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  5. FCS

    FCS Senior member

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    Suede boot if that's your thing: http://www.bluefly.com/pages....2261629 Edit: not sure if they are the same, but don't they look quite similar to those boots sold by that ebay seller mentioned a few days ago for $250?
     
  6. FCS

    FCS Senior member

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    Folks, does Oxxford carry shoes made by EG with their own Oxxford label on it or do they carry EG shoes with EG label? And do they use US sizes or UK sizes? Thanks a lot for any info.
     
  7. Lint Brush

    Lint Brush Senior member

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    The shoes were in Edward Green boxes, and I presume they were labelled "Edward Green" as well. The sizing was split--i.e., cap toes in 8.5/9 (U.K., U.S.).
     
  8. FCS

    FCS Senior member

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    Thanks for the info. How about the width, btw? Do they indicate them in both US and UK sizes? I suppose British F width would equal American E?
     
  9. Stu

    Stu Senior member

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    I don't know how Green's fit, but in Crockett & Jones, I wear an F width, and normally, in just about any other shoe I wear a D. So E and D widths are not always the same. English shoes are difficult to order without having first been tried on.
     
  10. FCS

    FCS Senior member

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    I called Oxxford store prior to posting my question but it seems that the person who took my call does not handle much of shoes inquiry. When I asked if the width comes in UK or US sizing, he told me that they have D and E, universal sizes.

    EG is quite notorious for their narrow shoes, so I definitely have to go with the wider fitting or probably even 0.5 size bigger with wider fitting.

    Edit: I think the person who took my call was George.
     
  11. shoefan

    shoefan Senior member

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    The shoes are labelled "Edward Green for Oxxford Clothes." As noted, the sizes give the length in both UK and US sizes (note that technically, UK sizes are not really quite a 1/2 larger than US, i.e., a true UK size 8D is really between a US size 8D and 8.5D in length; this all dates to an anachronism between the UK and US sizing dating to 125 or so years ago.) In terms of width, most of the shoes that Oxxford has are the Green "E" width; based on my experience with them, these are probably more akin to the US D, though perhaps a bit wider.  If you have a wider foot, the shoes on the 606 last might work better; they seem a bit roomier through the toes, since the last has a squared off toe, relative to the 202 last.  Or you can try going up 1/2 size, which will get you a bit more room. If you have other Green shoes, the widths should be the same, assuming your Greens have the dual-size labelling.  If not, they are pretty close to C&J, in my experience.  However, ordering without knowing your size can be risky. The following should be read at your own risk. I don't believe that there are, per se, differences in width between the UK and US markings.  However, the Greens are probably narrower than the given US width would indicate because, I presume, the width (really a girth/all around measurement) of the Green shoes is based on the UK length, and, in shoemaking, width goes up as length goes up -- i.e. a 8.5D is actually  1/8 inch bigger around than an 8D.  So, the result is that a Green 8D is actually 1/2 way between a US  8 1/2 C and D "widths" (girth).  Likewise, a UK 8E is between a US 8 1/2 D and E in girth.  (Note that, also, as width goes up length goes up -- but (at least in theory) only in the part of the shoe in front of the ball -- so a UK 8E is actually a bit longer than a UK 8D.)  Therefore, a Green 8E (UK size) is a bit wider/bigger girth than a US 8.5D and about the same length as the 8.5D, but with slightly different proportions; the heel to ball measurement is shorter than that of a US 8.5D. For what it's worth, it is also an anomaly of shoe-fitting that most customers think the "widths" are a measure of the width of the insole across the ball of the foot; this is incorrect.  As noted above, he "width" is actually a measure of the girth (circumference) of the last; therefore, even two shoes with the same "width" measurement can have different insole widths, as the shape of the lasts may differ and one may have more of the total girth/circumference in the top part of the foot -- manufacturers often like to keep the ball width narrow because a.) they can use the same insoles for multiples sizes, and b.) they think it makes the shoe and foot look slimmer and more elegant.  Furthermore, typically the "length" measure is from the heel to the ball of the foot; different lasts can have very different measures from the ball of the foot forward, based both on the manufacturer's preferences and the shape of the last/shoe.  Finally, shoemakers don't necessarily stick to the purported standards, and there is of course deviation around the mean, so their shoes can vary even more.  All of this says that it's important to actually try shoes on before buying them, particularly if you're not familiar with the manufacturer's sizing and last shapes.
     

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