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Athleisure Wear Going Out Of Style?

JFWR

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And when did wearing hats in restaurants become acceptable?

some guy in a t-shirt and Buffalo bills hat at the table next to me tonight.

restaurants need to get back to dress codes again.
I also dislike indoor hat wearing.

Men who do it to cover up balding look worse than if they just owned their thin hair, and men who do it just 'cause should consider whether they are in suitably casual enough environs (like say a Buffalo Wild Wings or some shit) for this to be close to acceptable.

Myself? I take the hat off when I'm in doors. I don't frequently wear hats, though, outside of winter hats.
 

The_Shooter

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I also dislike indoor hat wearing.

Men who do it to cover up balding look worse than if they just owned their thin hair, and men who do it just 'cause should consider whether they are in suitably casual enough environs (like say a Buffalo Wild Wings or some shit) for this to be close to acceptable.

Myself? I take the hat off when I'm in doors. I don't frequently wear hats, though, outside of winter hats.
I tip less at restaurants that allow men to wear hats indoors.
If they want to hold themselves as a glorified McDonalds, so be it. I will respond accordingly.

I’m generally a good tipper anyway, so they don’t notice I don’t think (I take it down from 25% to 20%). But hey, we need standards to be considered excellent and allowing slobs to dine with me does not meet my standards.
 

JFWR

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I tip less at restaurants that allow men to wear hats indoors.
If they want to hold themselves as a glorified McDonalds, so be it. I will respond accordingly.

I’m generally a good tipper anyway, so they don’t notice I don’t think (I take it down from 25% to 20%). But hey, we need standards to be considered excellent and allowing slobs to dine with me does not meet my standards.
LOL. That might be a bit much, but then again, I don't see most places enforce a dress code at all anymore. That's a bit hopeful that people will return to enforced social norms when our society is ever weakening those, so I think this is something of a losing battle.

Good social graces can probably be enforced in a better way than this, but I can understand the sentiment. Still, if it is that subtle, you're probably not making your message known.
 

The_Shooter

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A tip reflects service.
I don’t deny the tip, but if they fail to provide excellent service then they get less of a tip.
fair is fair. They want to allow some dude to wear a ball cap in their restaurant, that’s their choice. But they can hardly claim their service is excellent if they are a glorified McDonald’s.

of course the message isn’t being made known, as I still tip within the range (even higher side of the range), and not like I leave a note or anything.
but I know.
i know that I deserved better.
 

breakaway01

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A tip reflects service.
I don’t deny the tip, but if they fail to provide excellent service then they get less of a tip.
fair is fair. They want to allow some dude to wear a ball cap in their restaurant, that’s their choice. But they can hardly claim their service is excellent if they are a glorified McDonald’s.

of course the message isn’t being made known, as I still tip within the range (even higher side of the range), and not like I leave a note or anything.
but I know.
i know that I deserved better.
So you’re choosing to penalize the waitstaff, who have no control over whether a guest wears a hat inside the restaurant? And honestly, is this the hill you want to die on? “I deserved better?” Come on.
 
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bicycleradical

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I think the best thing we can do to address these worrying trends is to lead by example. Dress at least decently well and that can lead to widening the interest.
I've been going with this for a while. Few of my friends bother putting in any effort into how they dress and the ones who are made to feel insecure by me wearing a decent set of trousers will inevitably issue some microaggressions to paper over their feelings. However, I will continue to pay attention to how I present myself because it is important.

Interestingly enough, most compliments I receive on my attire come from African American men.
 

The_Shooter

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So you’re choosing to penalize the waitstaff, who have no control over whether a guest wears a hat inside the restaurant? And honestly, is this the hill you want to die on? “I deserved better?” Come on.
well, I still tip within the accepted range.
i just don’t tip in the exceptional range because, let’s face it, if they allow some slob in a nfl ball cap to be seated next to me - can we really call that exceptional service? Of course not. Service is the total package.
 

The_Shooter

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Twenty years ago? thirty?
you think?

I am not talking about McDonald’s or Olive Garden. I’m referring to restaurants that actually use clean silverware and have a chef who cooks the food.

i don’t remember seeing many ball caps on patrons at these types of restaurants in the past.
 

rjc149

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And I don’t buy the “comfort” argument.
When we're talking about wearing jackets, the comfort argument becomes very, very valid in 90*F+ weather. Much like the argument for wearing large, bulky down parkas becomes valid when it's single digits out. There is something overtly self-conscious and try-hard in being impeccably dressed when the climate (which is the basic, primal reason why we wear clothing in the first place) makes the outfit impractical or uncomfortable.

I tip less at restaurants that allow men to wear hats indoors.
If they want to hold themselves as a glorified McDonalds, so be it. I will respond accordingly.
Although grown men should remove their ballcap when seated at any sort of restaurant with table service (this includes diners or Olive Garden), this is unfair. For all you know, the waitstaff may also take issue with patrons wearing hats in their establishments.
 

The_Shooter

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I've been going with this for a while. Few of my friends bother putting in any effort into how they dress and the ones who are made to feel insecure by me wearing a decent set of trousers will inevitably issue some microaggressions to paper over their feelings. However, I will continue to pay attention to how I present myself because it is important.

Interestingly enough, most compliments I receive on my attire come from African American men.
so true re: the micro aggressions

I don’t think well dressed people walk up to slobs and ask them why they are dressed so poorly. They just let it pass.

but the slobs love to do that. “Why are you all dressed up?” “Sorry, my cargo shorts are at the cleaners.”
Or, “I don’t have to wear a suit anymore.” “So you chose to wear that??”

the whole idea of “we are allowed to wear jeans so everyone should wear jeans even if they are not comfortable” revolution that has taken the masses by storm. And it is acceptable to cal out in microaggression those who do not conform to looking bad.

The slobs are certainly willing to speak out against anybody who doesn’t adhere to looking bad.

regarding compliments:
- I usually get the most compliments from women. All ages, but women who are a bit older especially. Maybe it’s just more natural for a woman to compliment a man’s attire than a man to do so.
- Gen Z’ers. If I get a compliment from a guy it’s almost always a Gen Z’er.
big reason why I hold out some hope for Gen Z. I think the millennials are a lost cause. Jeans and sweat pants and want to stay at home all day playing on the metaverse. But I think Gen Z realize how pathetic that is and will want to do better.
 
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The_Shooter

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When we're talking about wearing jackets, the comfort argument becomes very, very valid in 90*F+ weather. Much like the argument for wearing large, bulky down parkas becomes valid when it's single digits out. There is something overtly self-conscious and try-hard in being impeccably dressed when the climate (which is the basic, primal reason why we wear clothing in the first place) makes the outfit impractical or uncomfortable.


Although grown men should remove their ballcap when seated at any sort of restaurant with table service (this includes diners or Olive Garden), this is unfair. For all you know, the waitstaff may also take issue with patrons wearing hats in their establishments.
agree regarding the weather. It’s tough In The extreme heat, and adjustments are allowed.

Re: tipping.
i still tip within the acceptable range.
i do not give an exceptional tip if the service is not exceptional.
it’s not fair to the servers at restaurants that do provide exceptional service to just give everyone the same tip. That would be like a teacher who gives all their students A’s, even the ones who do not try as hard or do as well.
 

mak1277

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you think?

I am not talking about McDonald’s or Olive Garden. I’m referring to restaurants that actually use clean silverware and have a chef who cooks the food.

i don’t remember seeing many ball caps on patrons at these types of restaurants in the past.
It’s been a while. “Sopranos” did a scene about this in the early 00’s.
 

rjc149

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I've been going with this for a while. Few of my friends bother putting in any effort into how they dress and the ones who are made to feel insecure by me wearing a decent set of trousers will inevitably issue some microaggressions to paper over their feelings. However, I will continue to pay attention to how I present myself because it is important.

Interestingly enough, most compliments I receive on my attire come from African American men.
This is purely a projection of their own insecurity.

Back in my 20's when I was still associating with childhood/high school friends who became Occupy leftists, I would get catcalls about my suit when meeting them after work. "Oooh, all suited up, doing the town" and then persistent backhanded comments about it throughout the evening. The first time they saw me in a suit, some catcalling and ribbing is expected and even welcomed in good fun. But they indicated a clear preoccupation with it which was clearly borne of either ideological resentment of what I represented, and personal envy. I got fed up with it and realized the only thing I had in common with these individuals was middle school.

At the risk of making a racial generalization, I too have received the most genuine compliments on my attire from black men, Asian men, and Indian men. I think dressing well is a status equalizer than white men aren't as concerned with, but minority men are more attuned to.
 
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acconrad

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A tip reflects service.
I don’t deny the tip, but if they fail to provide excellent service then they get less of a tip.
fair is fair. They want to allow some dude to wear a ball cap in their restaurant, that’s their choice. But they can hardly claim their service is excellent if they are a glorified McDonald’s.

of course the message isn’t being made known, as I still tip within the range (even higher side of the range), and not like I leave a note or anything.
but I know.
i know that I deserved better.
You sound like the kind of person who has never worked a day of manual labor or dealt with jackasses on a daily basis as a server. Especially not in a pandemic.

That is seriously some toxic attitude about people who are struggling the most right now.

A little compassion and empathy for those who are having it harder than us would go a long way towards healing right now.
 

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