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Are Neckties Going To Go The Way Of Bowties?

dieworkwear

Mahatma Jawndi
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Sure, but you're still (deliberately) missing what I am saying! Think about what the Japanese call a 'set-up' - basically any top and bottom that 'match', that are designed purely from that basis. Starting from that point, you have an infinite variety of possibilies, with all kinds of inspirations and models, not just the jacket with V-lapels and collar, not just particular cuts of pressed trousers. My point is that as men's work clothing moves further away from suits-as-they-were, it opens up space not just for suits to be worn more casually (which isn't news, as you say), but more significantly, for suits to become something different, or many different things. Potentially, this is akin to the transformation in men's style of the late C18th.
I understand what you're saying. I was only taking issue with this point:

The problem is that the suits themselves are still basically the same kind as we've always expected to be worn with ties.
I'm talking about the basic form of the suit as clothing more than the specifics of fabric and texture.
I think this depends on the viewer. If you're saying that the informed viewer will see these looks as being bad, then I disagree, as there's a rich tradition of men wearing casual suits without ties. Much of CM is about knowing fabrics and small details. An informed person will know the difference when seeing these looks.

If you're saying that the average person on the street is going to judge them poorly, then I don't really care that much. I don't think the average person on the street knows enough about classic men's dress. This is ultimately a niche interest and hobby. I'm fine with dressing in a way that I think is coherent and accords with classic men's style, even if the average person on the street thinks some small detail is wrong.

And in any case, any strong deviation from classic men's dress isn't going to resonate well with the public anyway. Just look at how most people look at SWD stuff. They just think "that's weird." By the time you've deviated far enough from CM, going tie-free is the least of the problems.
 
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double00

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there will probably always be some manner of necktie, probably in complementary fabrics to whatever else is going on.

the *modern* necktie is def not one of my favorite notions, i don't like having a slipped knot around my neck, or the length, or the typical construction. hopefully the bandanna will stick around in non-poly fabrics and hopefully the rest of the mode will make/leave room for such expressions.
 

JJ Katz

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The 'classic' necktie that we all grew up with, so to speak, seems definitely on its way out, as a mass-consumption item.
I would guess that as occasion-specific apparel, it might continue to exist for some decades, the same way that bow ties do.
But it will become something that many men don't own at all and many others don perhaps 0-3 times a year..

This is from someone who bought their first bow tie in 2020 and will definitely continue to wear neckties.
 

double00

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the problem with the bowtie is the associative baggage. otherwise i think it beats the necktie in most every way.
 

smittycl

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the problem with the bowtie is the associative baggage. otherwise i think it beats the necktie in most every way.
I’m afraid it’s now dorkwear unless worn with a tux. Looks contrived and well past it’s wear out date.
 

monkey66

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I’m afraid it’s now dorkwear unless worn with a tux. Looks contrived and well past it’s wear out date.
Whilst I have not succumbed to bow-ties yet I don't subscribe to the dorkwear suggestion. I imagine many of us here are frequently the most formally dressed in their environment. If you can pull it off then you are not a dork, you just look good.

As long as you 'own it' all is good.
 

smittycl

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Whilst I have not succumbed to bow-ties yet I don't subscribe to the dorkwear suggestion. I imagine many of us here are frequently the most formally dressed in their environment. If you can pull it off then you are not a dork, you just look good.

As long as you 'own it' all is good.
Not sure about that. I wouldn't try it in a work environment and have never seen it in DC beyond a few older and idiosyncratic types on the Hill. Opening myself up to a ration of shit for quoting the GSElevator jerk but:

  • Like Ambien and red wine, the wrong fashion combination can become a disastrously lethal cocktail of Larry Kudlow-esque proportions.
#1: A double-breasted suit and a blue shirt with a white collar? Was it a rough night in the water bed?
#2: Plaid shirt, bow tie, and pocket square is the douchebag trifecta.
 

EZB

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Not sure about that. I wouldn't try it in a work environment and have never seen it in DC beyond a few older and idiosyncratic types on the Hill. Opening myself up to a ration of shit for quoting the GSElevator jerk but:

  • Like Ambien and red wine, the wrong fashion combination can become a disastrously lethal cocktail of Larry Kudlow-esque proportions.
You can wear them in eccentric environments like academia also
 

madhat

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Not sure about that. I wouldn't try it in a work environment and have never seen it in DC beyond a few older and idiosyncratic types on the Hill. Opening myself up to a ration of shit for quoting the GSElevator jerk but:

  • Like Ambien and red wine, the wrong fashion combination can become a disastrously lethal cocktail of Larry Kudlow-esque proportions.
I wear bow ties, I'm very good at my job, and that makes me even more memorable.
If you're very good at what you do and are visually memorable, even better.
If you suck at your job and are visually memorable, there's a problem.
 

smittycl

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You can wear them in eccentric environments like academia also
I can see that. Tenure can lead to lots of weird behavior!
 

monkey66

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Perhaps depends on your age. There is probably a difference in perception between a 20 something and a 50 something guy wearing a bow tie.

I still see plenty in London and never think they are out of the ordinary. I could imagine if you are a young lawyer or trader and don't want to stand out it could be an problem but for the more mature/established gent I see no issue.
 

radicaldog

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The tie isn't going the way of the bowtie, because it's not going to be largely replaced by a different kind of tie. It's going the way of hats (fedoras, trilbies, etc): a garment only worn by eccentrics and/or jawnz enthusiasts.
 

double00

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once upon a time hats were super common, a better solution than sunblock!
 

stuffedsuperdud

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Not all stars have the personal good taste of a Cary Grant, Gary Cooper or
Marcello Mastroianni. I really like Clooney and think that he is excellent at
his craft, but more often than not at public events he looks like he was "issued"
a suit from Wardrobe. Personal note: I was in Venice for his wedding in 2014.
Unfortunately, I was unable to crash it. Did get to see many gorgeous guests,
however. As for the younger crop of entertainers, I have no idea if there are
any that can claim to be the heirs of Grant, etc.
The only one I know currently who has his own cultivated sense of style is Neil Patrick Harris.

Not exactly on the “AAA” list like Clooney, et.al. But he usually looks good and unlike some of the others, owns his look.
Fellas please. This conversation begins and ends with one person and that person is Henry Cavill. He's kind of a modern day Steve McQueen, that is, usually leans casual but can still wear CM better than we can (it probably helps to be 6'2" and jacked, but still). Yes, technically he's frequently styled by Grace Gilfeather and others, but even when he's caught shopping for himself, it's a very consistent collection of blue jackets, gray flannel trousers and three piece or DB worsteds from Huntsman and the like. Here, look:

No tie, it's fine. Doesn't try too hard to overaccentuate the v-shaped torso, pants even Alan Bee can appreciate. Rise could be 2" higher I guess. Close enough.


Or with tie, since that's the topic here. Nicely picks up some of the secondary color from the plaid pattern.

^Can anyone ID the shoes? Cleverley? G&G?

I mean, come on.


Of course this was just an excuse to post this pic: you may be cool, but you'll never be one-of-the-Cifonelli-guys-came-to-your-BJJ-gym-for-a-fitting cool.


Okay that's enough mancrushing for a Friday.
 
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