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Alligator / Crocodile Shoes

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by SpooPoker, Oct 16, 2009.

  1. SoGent

    SoGent Distinguished Member

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    right here, for now


  2. Zapasman

    Zapasman Distinguished Member

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    George Cleverley. The second pic with the clicker is from GG.
     


  3. ThinkDerm

    ThinkDerm Stylish Dinosaur

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  4. TtownMD

    TtownMD Distinguished Member

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    When I placed my order through Neus via gg. What I learned you can make alligator using porous crocodile or alligator. Porous crocodile is typically used for large bags & accessory. But one can request the maker to use whatever they like or prefer. But alligator is general recommended. Learned some thing new so figured to share. Will post picture when I get them from gg & bestetti.
     


  5. Texasmade

    Texasmade Distinguished Member

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    Is there a reason why gator is generally recommend over crocodile?
     


  6. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Price? Availability?

    In truth, I don't think gator is preferred over crocodile.

    There are any number of species out there and a number of different means of raising and harvesting and even tanning. All these will affect the quality and desirability of the hide. Caiman, for example is not really suitable for any footwear, in my opinion, although some makers use it if only because it is cheap.

    Animals that are raised on farms tend to be more uniform both in size and in quality--parasites, leeches, and such like, can be controlled. I'm not altogether sure about crocodiles but the alligator we get here in the States are usually farm raised and are harvested at an earlier age.

    Large animals will have large tiles in the prime areas (belly usually) which, to my eye, look garish not to mention that larger tiles are more rigid regardless of whether they be in the belly or tail.

    Crocs tend to have rounder tiles than alligator in the belly. Areas of round tiles tend to be softer and more flexible.

    For myself, all other things being equal, I would tend to prefer a small farmed crocodile over the same size farm raised alligator.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2018


  7. TtownMD

    TtownMD Distinguished Member

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  8. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    ^ Not really a one-to-one comparison...and thus not much of a comparison at all.

    For instance, I have bought gator direct from the tannery in Georgia (one of the largest sources for AA in the world) and it cost less than croc (Nile, IIRC) which I bought from a very well respected dealer in Louisiana. At similar sizes, the crocodile tiles were more round. And overall, the croc was softer.

    Again, this may be all down to the factors I mentioned above. But, in my experience using gator and croc...not just selling it...the information in the link above seems a bit misleading (although on a further page in the blog, there is a photo of an AA skin that says it all--all the tiles are square).

    And it's perhaps worth noting as well that their second favourite reptile for making shoes and boots is caiman...which for this shoe and bootmaker, at any rate, raises questions about objectivity.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2018


  9. TtownMD

    TtownMD Distinguished Member

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    Ok no problem that’s what’s googled provided. Any how both options are available with your retailers. And thx you for your info and feed back.
     


  10. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Well, my rule of thumb is to take any information provided by someone who wants to sell you something with a very large grain of salt--they have a "vested interest," as who should say.
     


  11. stephenaf2003

    stephenaf2003 Distinguished Member

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    Thanks for that TT. Since you and I are both consumers, (ie. not making or selling shoes), it’s good to have that kind of info. It’s just more info in our consumer tool bag. I’m like you, it’s about what I’m looking for in the particular shoe, so all of it factors in.
     


  12. Zapasman

    Zapasman Distinguished Member

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    Nikolaus_Tuczek161.jpg

    Nikolaus Tuczec
     


  13. mr monty

    mr monty Distinguished Member

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    Wow, I'm surprised Vass would use caiman??:confused2:
     


  14. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    I dunno. Why does any maker use caiman? Some of it, I suppose, is driven by customer demand...which in turn is driven by ignorance or even a somewhat vulgar need to show off--the tiles on caiman look brutal and ostentatious and, of course, ultimately, garish.

    But a big segment of the shoe industry...and the fashion industry...caters to just such sensibilities.

    The whole "large tile" debate is an example...consumers like them precisely because they are not subtle, because they are in-your-face-shouting "This is alligator! I can afford it." The holy grail of Style for the parvenu.

    The shoemaker doesn't really like it simply because he knows that larger tiles represent an older animal. And it is always...for any species...true that hides from younger animals are better quality--denser, more supple and usually stronger.

    Small tiles make an objectively better shoe (or boot) without screaming "look at me!" And that's the whole point...at least for the shoemaker.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2018


  15. stephenaf2003

    stephenaf2003 Distinguished Member

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    well to be fair to Vass, if I'm not mistaken, Vass would use Caiman only at the customers request. The hide used is something that is up to the customer during the hide/leather selection process; so if one opts to use a lower quality hide/leather that would be at that particular customers discretion.
     


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