• Hi, I'm the owner and main administrator of Styleforum. If you find the forum useful and fun, please help support it by buying through the posted links on the forum. Please visit ou very popular sales thread, where the latest and best sales are posted, including the latest, updated, very comprehensive, Styleforum Black Friday Sales List

    Purchases made through some of our links earns a commission for the forum and allows us to do the work of maintaining and improving it. Finally, thanks for being a part of this community. We realize that there are many choices today on the internet, and we have all of you to thank for making Styleforum the foremost destination for discussions of menswear.
  • STYLE. COMMUNITY. GREAT CLOTHING.

    Bored of counting likes on social networks? At Styleforum, you’ll find rousing discussions that go beyond strings of emojis.

    Click Here to join Styleforum's thousands of style enthusiasts today!

Rithrin

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2019
Messages
265
Reaction score
1,637
So, you are fine with Kirby poaching "so-called" Amazon sales but don't care about when Amazon poaches sales from sellers on its own platform and then tries to put them out of business? or the fact that Amazon may not have had many of those sales if it was not for Kirby's videos.

If Kirby used a different tag line, such as, "Kirby's Special Sale Day" but happened to offer it on the same day as Amazon's Prime Day would you still say he was "poaching" Amazon sales? Isn't Amazon poaching his sales by offering the same products with no added value at lower prices (because they can)?

Does it bother you that while Kirby is in it ultimately to make money, by purchasing from Amazon you are lining Bezos' pockets with your money rather than someone like Kirby who is trying to inform a community (and make money at the same time)?

Would those people (aka shoe enthusiasts like you and me) have even known to purchase these products if it were not for Kirby (or Bedo's or Cobblers Plus or Elegant Oxford or Trenton & Heath)?


I say it again, you are giving people too much credit for understanding trademark law. Ask 100 people and I bet less than 10 of them will know that copying music is against the law yet you expect a small business owner to be familiar with trademark law concepts?

I am not an attorney and I do not even play one on TV but after working for more than 25 years in the technology field, having earned a masters degree in information management from the #1 program in the country, and dealing with software licensing for more than 20 years, I can share that the average person still does not understand that copying software, music, and artwork is illegal.

Not trying to pick a fight, have no love for Amazon, no connection to Kirby Allison, but I am amazed at the hate you have for Kirby and your limited view about who and how many people actually understand trademark law.
Again, simply doing a sale is competitive business. Naming the sale the same when the name is trademarked is bad.
This is fascinating. I'd bet that 99% of people out there couldn't give two whits about whether Kirby or another small business used the term "Prime Day" or has any concept of the idea that "Prime Day" might fall under IP law. Obviously, the posts here show that there are people who care about that, but I couldn't even fathom holding this position. I've always thought Kirby was a little full of himself and far too pretentious (and probably not fun at parties, but I shouldn't be the first to throw stones on that subject), judging from how he comports himself in his interviews with various #menswear notables, but ultimately his videos on Youtube along with a handful of others taught me the most about shoes and shoe care when starting out. If I need Saphir and trouser hangers, I'll buy them from him as thanks for being informative and actively engaging new hobbyists. And I hope he keeps up with it, whether he used the term "Prime Day" or not.

Back to shoes, though!

Landons in Navy shell with JR soles have arrived!

IMG_20201031_134205.jpg

IMG_20201031_134128.jpg

IMG_20201031_142704.jpg

First would like to emphasize that these have no apparent construction issues whatsoever. They seem a little more bright in color than the samples, which is fantastic as the deep blue is beautiful. These were a little bit of a risk with fit considering how new the Landon was, but they actually fit better than my First Street boots. There's extra volume in the vamp, but with really cinching down the laces it snugs up quite well.

It wasn't the original plan, but on my way out today I noticed some of my plants needed maintenance so the boots got impromptu gardening experience, as boots should. The only tragic thing is that I drove to the bank afterwards and the first step I took out of the car was directly into a lump of fresh chewing gum some presumably kind and considerate person left on the ground for me. Luckily these are fresh JR soles and not lugs to make cleaning it a nightmare.

No Halloween pics here, but hopefully everyone has a nice night with the trick or treaters!
 

Lionel Hutz

Stylish Dinosaur
Joined
Aug 15, 2017
Messages
10,192
Reaction score
7,447
Again, simply doing a sale is competitive business. Naming the sale the same when the name is trademarked is bad.
He should just call it “RIMEP DAY” oe “RIME DAY”

though the idea of amazon crying about unfair online competition is pretty ironic
 

EZB

Distinguished Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2018
Messages
4,319
Reaction score
16,498
He should just call it “RIMEP DAY” oe “RIME DAY”

though the idea of amazon crying about unfair online competition is pretty ironic
It’s not the competition. Failure to defend s trademark can result in loss of the trademark
 

Shoenut

Distinguished Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2017
Messages
7,826
Reaction score
43,235
am i the only one who has never used Amazon? I went out for a beer today and told the bar maid that her body was Prime real estate. Guess I infringed on the Amazon trademark somehow.
 

EZB

Distinguished Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2018
Messages
4,319
Reaction score
16,498
am i the only one who has never used Amazon? I went out for a beer today and told the bar maid that her body was Prime real estate. Guess I infringed on the Amazon trademark somehow.
Would be funny if it even somewhat made sense.... that’s not how trademarks work. Prime isn’t trademarked except under the context of a subscription service. What would you think if Cole Haan started putting the Carmina logo on their shoes ?
 

NYCTechNerd

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2020
Messages
316
Reaction score
593
This is fascinating. I'd bet that 99% of people out there couldn't give two whits about whether Kirby or another small business used the term "Prime Day" or has any concept of the idea that "Prime Day" might fall under IP law. Obviously, the posts here show that there are people who care about that, but I couldn't even fathom holding this position. I've always thought Kirby was a little full of himself and far too pretentious (and probably not fun at parties, but I shouldn't be the first to throw stones on that subject), judging from how he comports himself in his interviews with various #menswear notables, but ultimately his videos on Youtube along with a handful of others taught me the most about shoes and shoe care when starting out. If I need Saphir and trouser hangers, I'll buy them from him as thanks for being informative and actively engaging new hobbyists. And I hope he keeps up with it, whether he used the term "Prime Day" or not.
This is almost exactly how I feel. I believe he is a pretentious little twat who wants to purport this fancy lifestyle but at the end of the day he is probably some gutter rat who is trying to drag himself out from under the rock from whence he came. Though, I do think what you say about "how he comports himself in interviews" may not be accurate because in my opinion I believe it to be actual child-like enthusiasm and a yearning for the better life that he wants so desperately to achieve and maintain.

With that said, I have bought products from him and will continue to do so because if it was not for so many of his videos I would not be as well informed as I am about shoes and shoe care. I could probably spend about $2 less per product on Amazon but I would rather give my money to the pretentious twat who helped me gain knowledge and who continues to support our community rather than some billionaire a-hole who does nothing for us, nothing for society, and works his warehouse employees in such a way that they do not even have time to go to the bathroom and must piss in a bottle at their stations when they need to relieve themselves.
 
Last edited:

Rithrin

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2019
Messages
265
Reaction score
1,637
This is almost exactly how I feel. I believe he is a pretentious little twat who wants to purport this fancy lifestyle but at the end of the day he is probably some gutter rat who is trying to drag himself out from under the rock from whence he came. Though, I do think what you say about "how he comports himself in interviews" may not be accurate because in my opinion I believe it to be actual child-like enthusiasm and a yearning for the better life that he wants so desperately to achieve and maintain.

With that said, I have bought products from him and will continue to do so because if it was not for so many of his videos I would not be as well informed as I am about shoes and shoe care. I could probably spend about $2 less per product on Amazon but I would rather give my money to the pretentious twat who helped me gain knowledge and who continues to support our community rather than some billionaire a-hole who does nothing for us, nothing for society, and works his warehouse employees in such a way that they do not even have time to go to the bathroom and must piss in a bottle at their stations when they need to relieve themselves.
Glad someone else out there feels similarly. You may be right about his enthusiasm in interviews. I have just felt on many occasions that he often interrupts and speaks over his guests, tries to finish their sentences, etc. It's as if he's trying to make sure the viewers understand that he knows everything about all things menswear. Perhaps it's just that he isn't a professional interviewer and I'm judging too harshly.

Now that Preston Soto has started his own webstore that also sells Saphir, I'm a bit torn on who to support, though. Maybe a 50/50 split!
 

NYCTechNerd

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2020
Messages
316
Reaction score
593
Glad someone else out there feels similarly. You may be right about his enthusiasm in interviews. I have just felt on many occasions that he often interrupts and speaks over his guests, tries to finish their sentences, etc. It's as if he's trying to make sure the viewers understand that he knows everything about all things menswear. Perhaps it's just that he isn't a professional interviewer and I'm judging too harshly.

Now that Preston Soto has started his own webstore that also sells Saphir, I'm a bit torn on who to support, though. Maybe a 50/50 split!

Based on my experience (and in order of how I learned about each one over the past 12 months):
  • Kirby Allison (Hanger Project recently renamed Kirby Allison) has great videos, a great website, and good customer service as well as fast response to emails - I have placed a few orders.
  • Trenton & Heath (Potter and Sons) have good but slow customer service and response to emails - I have placed an order with them.
  • Preston Soto (Elegant Oxford) has never responded to the contact form on his website, no response to emails, no response to DMs on FB and IG - so no orders placed.
  • Allen Trushkov (Cobblers Plus) has good videos that are getting better, a new informative website that is being improved, and good response to emails and a phone call - I sent him a pair of my wife's "favorite" Frye motorcycle style boots to resole and add sole protectors. I did not realize they were fake stitched (aka not GYW) yet he did all the work and Blake stitched them but did not charge me extra. The reason I trusted him (but did not tell him beforehand) was that after watching some of his videos I realized his shop was less than 2 miles from my brother's home in Denver and that not only is my brother's family a customer but they have always been happy with his work.

For me, product may still come from Kirby Allison but shoes/boots will go to Cobblers Plus. This is my next project with him and there should be a video about mine in a few weeks:


 

BFT9000

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2018
Messages
961
Reaction score
9,049
Based on my experience (and in order of how I learned about each one over the past 12 months):
  • Kirby Allison (Hanger Project recently renamed Kirby Allison) has great videos, a great website, and good customer service as well as fast response to emails - I have placed a few orders.
  • Trenton & Heath (Potter and Sons) have good but slow customer service and response to emails - I have placed an order with them.
  • Preston Soto (Elegant Oxford) has never responded to the contact form on his website, no response to emails, no response to DMs on FB and IG - so no orders placed.
  • Allen Trushkov (Cobblers Plus) has good videos that are getting better, a new informative website that is being improved, and good response to emails and a phone call - I sent him a pair of my wife's "favorite" Frye motorcycle style boots to resole and add sole protectors. I did not realize they were fake stitched (aka not GYW) yet he did all the work and Blake stitched them but did not charge me extra. The reason I trusted him (but did not tell him beforehand) was that after watching some of his videos I realized his shop was less than 2 miles from my brother's home in Denver and that not only is my brother's family a customer but they have always been happy with his work.

For me, product may still come from Kirby Allison but shoes/boots will go to Cobblers Plus. This is my next project with him and there should be a video about mine in a few weeks:


Elegant Oxford has treated me well. I bought a bottle of Renovateur from them that broke sometime during delivery. Sent an email with pics and they responded right away and sent me a replacement.
 

Lionel Hutz

Stylish Dinosaur
Joined
Aug 15, 2017
Messages
10,192
Reaction score
7,447
It’s not the competition. Failure to defend s trademark can result in loss of the trademark
I’m aware of the risks associated with failure to defend a mark. I was noting that infringing a mark is a form on unfair competition.

Still, it pains me to see any other business assisting AMZN in making the bullshit that is prime day into a real thing
 

Shoenut

Distinguished Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2017
Messages
7,826
Reaction score
43,235
Would be funny if it even somewhat made sense.... that’s not how trademarks work. Prime isn’t trademarked except under the context of a subscription service. What would you think if Cole Haan started putting the Carmina logo on their shoes ?
That’s why it is funny. I have no clue what the Amazon logo is or what they have trademarked. But if they can trademark something like Prime or Prime days then I think I will trademark the word water. I would only charge a penny for every use of the word.
 

OldTown

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2020
Messages
289
Reaction score
346
The Bezos and Amazon hate people have these days is some of the most irrational thing I've seen. Amazon lowering prices to compete (which makes other large retailers like Target and Walmart do the same) is a good thing for the customer. We live in a global age with the internet, it's time people move on from the "mom & pop" idea. It's dead like the USSR and ska music.
 

EZB

Distinguished Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2018
Messages
4,319
Reaction score
16,498
That’s why it is funny. I have no clue what the Amazon logo is or what they have trademarked. But if they can trademark something like Prime or Prime days then I think I will trademark the word water. I would only charge a penny for every use of the word.
that’s why you aren’t a lawyer lol. You can’t trademark water. You could trademark an image of water. Trademarks also have context. The word Prime itself isn’t trademarked generally—only when used for subscription services.
 

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by

Featured Sponsor

Most Interesting Fashion Collaboration of 2020

  • JW Anderson x Uniqlo

  • Nigo x Virgil Abloh

  • Converse x Midnight Studios

  • Rick Owens x Champion

  • Barbour x Engineered Garments

  • Adidas x Bed JW Ford

  • Jordan Brand x Dior

  • Billie Eilish x Takashi Murakami

  • Lego x Levi's


Results are only viewable after voting.

Related Threads

Forum statistics

Threads
449,166
Messages
9,723,041
Members
202,948
Latest member
numerimonhari
Top