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madhat

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You give him and many others too much credit for understanding trademark (and/or copyright) law.

Kirby Allison/Hanger Project is a small business trying to stay afloat and is probably sick of people watching his videos for information and then buying the same products he sells from Amazon just to save a few dollars. I have no connection to him or Bezos but if you want to be angry at someone, what has Bezos/Amazon actually done to help you lately? Have they created videos to help you with your shoe care? Or does Amazon monitor what small sellers on its platform sell and do well with only to then list the same products at a lower price and put that small seller out of business?




AFAIK, a Hanger Project Carmina MTO was delayed, a few pairs got messed up, and Kirby stopped communicating. It is poor customer service and poor communication but he should not be vilified for it. Heck, Meermin is no better (in my experience) yet they have many more resources and still do not communicate properly with their customers about MTO/GMTO delays and screw-ups.
I don’t have a problem with Kirby. I have a problem with what Amazon is and stands for.
On a shoe related note: my Santa Moks will get their first use of the season this week! Only 4 pairs left before I’ve made it through rotation, so logically they’ll get worn.
 

audog

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I don’t have a problem with Kirby doing his own sale to poach Amazon’s Prime Day. It’s common sense though to not use trademarks from another company.
In the 1980's, I was a partner in a high-end audio store, we had competition right across the street. They would, twice a year have a "we are open until midnight" sale, we "poached" on their sale, by hanging a sign in the window that said "We are Open Too sale". It was good competition, afterwords, all of us from both stores would go out for drinks.
 

NYCTechNerd

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Amazon does just fine by me. I don’t have a problem with Kirby doing his own sale to poach Amazon’s Prime Day. It’s common sense though to not use trademarks from another company. Ignorance isn’t even possible at that point. He knows what he does.

So, you are fine with Kirby poaching "so-called" Amazon sales but don't care about when Amazon poaches sales from sellers on its own platform and then tries to put them out of business? or the fact that Amazon may not have had many of those sales if it was not for Kirby's videos.

If Kirby used a different tag line, such as, "Kirby's Special Sale Day" but happened to offer it on the same day as Amazon's Prime Day would you still say he was "poaching" Amazon sales? Isn't Amazon poaching his sales by offering the same products with no added value at lower prices (because they can)?

Does it bother you that while Kirby is in it ultimately to make money, by purchasing from Amazon you are lining Bezos' pockets with your money rather than someone like Kirby who is trying to inform a community (and make money at the same time)?

Would those people (aka shoe enthusiasts like you and me) have even known to purchase these products if it were not for Kirby (or Bedo's or Cobblers Plus or Elegant Oxford or Trenton & Heath)?


I say it again, you are giving people too much credit for understanding trademark law. Ask 100 people and I bet less than 10 of them will know that copying music is against the law yet you expect a small business owner to be familiar with trademark law concepts?

I am not an attorney and I do not even play one on TV but after working for more than 25 years in the technology field, having earned a masters degree in information management from the #1 program in the country, and dealing with software licensing for more than 20 years, I can share that the average person still does not understand that copying software, music, and artwork is illegal.

Not trying to pick a fight, have no love for Amazon, no connection to Kirby Allison, but I am amazed at the hate you have for Kirby and your limited view about who and how many people actually understand trademark law.
 
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EZB

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In the 1980's, I was a partner in a high-end audio store, we had competition right across the street. They would, twice a year have a "we are open until midnight" sale, we "poached" on their sale, by hanging a sign in the window that said "We are Open Too sale". It was good competition, afterwords, all of us from both stores would go out for drinks.
So, you are fine with Kirby poaching "so-called" Amazon sales but don't care about when Amazon poaches sales from sellers on its own platform and then tries to put them out of business? or the fact that Amazon may not have had many of those sales if it was not for Kirby's videos.

If Kirby used a different tag line, such as, "Kirby's Special Sale Day" but happened to offer it on the same day as Amazon's Prime Day would you still say he was "poaching" Amazon sales? Isn't Amazon poaching his sales by offering the same products with no added value at lower prices (because they can)?

Does it bother you that while Kirby is in it ultimately to make money, by purchasing from Amazon you are lining Bezos' pockets with your money rather than someone like Kirby who is trying to inform a community (and make money at the same time)?

Would those people (aka shoe enthusiasts like you and me) have even known to purchase these products if it were not for Kirby (or Cobblers Plus or Elegant Oxford or Trenton & Heath)?


I say it again, you are giving people too much credit for understanding copyright law. Ask 100 people and I bet less than 10 of them will know that copying music is against the law yet you expect a small business owner to be familiar with trademark law concepts?

I am not an attorney and I do not even play one on TV but after working for more than 25 years in the technology field, having earned a masters degree in information management from the #1 program in the country, and dealing with software licensing for more than 20 years, I can share that the average person still does not understand that copying software, music, and artwork is illegal.

Not trying to pick a fight, have no love for Amazon, no connection to Kirby Allison, but I am amazed at the hate you have for Kirby and your limited view about who and how many people actually understand trademark law.
Again, simply doing a sale is competitive business. Naming the sale the same when the name is trademarked is bad.
 

woofmang

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Wearing Surrey Chukkas for some errands today:

20201031_155503.jpg


Coincidentally, I've been wearing my AEs in order of acquisition the last couple of days: yesterday, I wore my Brown CXL Higgies (1st AE purchase); last night, I wore my Navy/Brown Boulders (2nd AE purchase) to take the wife out for cocktails and dessert; today, I'm wearing my Surrey Chukkas (3rd AE purchase). I'm not sure how long this trend will continue (theoretically, it could go on for the next two weeks, if I don't wear any of my non-AE footwear in between AE wears, but after these, my recollection of the order of acquisition gets a little sketchy)...
 

EZB

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Which is why we chose a different sign :)
I have no problem with that. Target does a “deal days” sale I think at around the same time. That’s just competitive business. Kirby could have called it the “Allison Sale” and I’d have been fine with it.
 

audog

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I have no problem with that. Target does a “deal days” sale I think at around the same time. That’s just competitive business. Kirby could have called it the “Allison Sale” and I’d have been fine with it.
Not to defend, when I don't know the particulars of the decision, but I bet the nomenclature didn't even cross his mind. No excuse for copyright infringement, but bet it wasn't a thought out decision...probably a "Hey, lets do that too" type of thing. Now lets all get back to shoes....
 

EZB

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