Alfred Sargent Makes G&G?

[LabelKing]

I thought it was Crockett & Jones.

 

[Omegablogger]

I must state that my experience of the Northampton shoe industry is gained solely [hehe] by attempting to charm the ladies in the factory shops, in to bringing me the good stuff from the back room. It strikes me as an enormously incestuous industry, and one in which it seems everyone is struggling for money. I get the impression that overheads are high and space is plentiful, it doesn't surprise me that arrangements like this exist. In fact it would be rather surprising if they didn't.

Having said that the fact that G&G RTW are, sort of but not really, made in the AS factory certainly won't strengthen the brand.

 

[teddieriley]

I think people were afraid it might weaken it!

 

[Manton]

I doubt it will have any effect on the brand at all. One, it won't ever become widely known. Two, anyone who does find and out and knows enough to know where AS ranks on the quality scale will also know enough to know that G&G is an extraordinary shoe, far beyond AS.

 

[brescd01]

Tempest in a tea pot. Different makers each make different levels of quality (except EG and Lobb for the most part), the Grenson Masterpieces everyone has a hard on for are made next to monstrous inferior creations, the same goes for Church, Sanders, etc.

I am frustrated that Tony is going to design a higher-priced line for AS when what they need desperately, is for him to vet their designs and re-vamp their finishing operation in colors other than black.

An elegant last costs the same as a clunky one and AS could change its lasts without raising their prices. The perfect example is the Alfred Sargent Veldtschoen model. I threw out my pair because its leather soles were unremediably slippery and its last was incredibly ugly. But it was indestructable. I purchased the EG Dundee, which cost almost three times as much, and its last is much more elegant (though I know few would call it absolutely elegant). And though it is much more nicely finished, it is much less durable, its leather softer so that it takes a polish so much better. I would have been satisfied with the AS model but for its clunky last.

The same goes for the AS Premier Exclusive wholecut model, which I tossed because its last was hideous and its leather just lifeless. I know tossing perfectly good shoes seems wasteful but you had to see the shoes to realize why I did not think they were worth the space, and plus I was learning and trying to benefit from Alfred Sargent's advantageous prices. The Alfred Sargents are frustrating because they have elements of good shoes in each pair, but one thing will be very off. By the way, I got started on Alfred Sargent shoes because the first pair of shoes I bought in my sartorial odyssey was a pair of Peals manufactured by Sargent and I was happy with their construction.

 

[TheFoo]

I don't see why it should necessarily matter where certain production processes are carried out. It's fantasy to believe that everything is going to be done under one roof. Anyway, even if it were true, total in-house production may not be a good thing: production costs would shoot up and quality may suffer given the scarcity of talent and expertise.

This diffused approach to production is typical of the Swiss watchmaking industry. Cases, dials, crystals, gears, baseplates, etc., are often machined by various smaller operations throughout Switzerland, then shipped to the watch manufacturer for finishing and assembly.

I can see why you'd want a more in-house approach for bespoke or custom products since the person who measured the client possesses special knowledge of what the client wants and production processess need to be highly individualized. However, if production is easily divided into different segments that are highly dependant on machinery, then in-house production might be the last thing you want. As a consumer, I certainly wouldn't want to pay a premium for it 'just because'.

 

[kolecho]

When people are paying G&G bespoke prices, it matters. At least TG is upfront about the whole thing. To me, what matters is who is delivery value - the factory or the last designer. Clearly the point of differentiation in TG's case is him, not where his shoes are made.

Having said that, G&G is competing with the likes of EG, who have history, lovely lasts, dedicated factory etc. What G&G is bringing in sexy last designs, EG already have (888, 82 etc). G&G is going one up in styling and finishing (fiddle waist etc). Isn't it great we live in a world where competition keeps us all progressive.

Personally, these things matter to me when I purchase luxury goods. This is why I would rather have a vintage Rolex Sub than a new IWC Ingenieur.

 

[Percy Trimmer]

Originally Posted by brescd01

I am frustrated that Tony is going to design a higher-priced line for AS when what they need desperately, is for him to vet their designs and re-vamp their finishing operation in colors other than black.

An elegant last costs the same as a clunky one and AS could change its lasts without raising their prices.

I read it first as good news that AS were trying to go up market with a TG designed shoe, but I agree now that what they really need is a makeover for their entire line. The same goes for Trickers.

I don't understand the comment about 'colors other than black' though. My brown (Premier line) AS shoes look much better than my shiny black ones.

 

[stilmacher]

I don't understand all the fuss about G&G.

 

[ABALO]

^^^^ Me neither... But I think it is a very SF common gimmick...

 

[tiger02]

Originally Posted by ABALO

^^^^ Me neither... But I think it is a very SF common gimmick...
The bespoke are really remarkable in person. I don't think I've seen that level of finishing and attention to detail anywhere. No personal experience with Lobb or EG bespoke, but it's more impressive than Vass, for instance.

 

[stilmacher]

Sure, I do see the point about their bespoke shoes but the RTW leaves me mostly unimpressed. Though I have to admit I have not seen either in real life.
Still and especially since I believe the same is true for most others here, I don't understand the hype.

 

[ABALO]

Originally Posted by stilmacher

Sure, I do see the point about their bespoke shoes but the RTW leaves me mostly unimpressed. Though I have to admit I have not seen either in real life.
Still and especially since I believe the same is true for most others here, I don't understand the hype.

I am the other way round, guys... IMHO, the RTW range is the best of the present market, if you consider quality which is about the same as JL or EG for construction and leather, and much cheaper, I would definitely go for it...
And I don't even mention the ******* good looking lasts and originality in the designs compared to boring JL or EG...

On the other hand, next time I have 3 500 € to spend on a bespoke treasure, many names come to me before G&G... In that case, I would choose a real bespoke specialist artisan and rather go for Dimitri, Delos or Corthay...