1. And... we're back. You'll notice that all of your images are back as well, as are our beloved emoticons, including the infamous :foo: We have also worked with our server folks and developers to fix the issues that were slowing down the site.

    There is still work to be done - the images in existing sigs are not yet linked, for example, and we are working on a way to get the images to load faster - which will improve the performance of the site, especially on the pages with a ton of images, and we will continue to work diligently on that and keep you updated.

    Cheers,

    Fok on behalf of the entire Styleforum team
    Dismiss Notice

Advice: What to tell my girlfriend

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Craiger, Dec 3, 2012.

Tags:
  1. kev777

    kev777 Senior member

    Messages:
    1,465
    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2009
    Location:
    Northern England
    Was thinking of some politically correct sorta answer here and then thought what would I do in this situation? Wear what the hell I like that's what I would do and if she's that bothered she knows the way to the exit !!!!! :rimshot:! End of !!
     
  2. phoenixrecon

    phoenixrecon Senior member

    Messages:
    2,441
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    Location:
    In some dude's court
    This is as bad as when Im at work every grown association man has to "ask" if they can buy some shoes. At least with my gf we've made it pretty clear. I don't tell her how to dress and she doesn't tell me. Its actually funny because she says its more attractive that i can dress myself. And that does't mean she sometimes dislikes what i wear.
     
  3. Schadenfreude

    Schadenfreude Member

    Messages:
    16
    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Location:
    anywhere
    A grown man should dress himself, or have a valet do it. That being said, it wouldn't be a good idea to make a massive fuss over this. She does, after all, control the lady-bits in your relationship.
     
  4. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    8,355
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2011
    Location:
    Washington, DC
    1) you're a grown man, you should be allowed to dress yourself

    2) if she ever threatens to be embarrassed by you, to me this is kind of red flag manipulative non-keeper stuff, but obviously that part is up to you

    3) objectively, your choices are more correct for black tie, and in my opinion as well as the vast majority of members here, much more elegant
     
  5. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    8,355
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2011
    Location:
    Washington, DC
    But as to what to say to her, I'd go with something like -

    I'm sorry you don't enjoy what I've chosen to wear as much as I do. But there's no reason to be embarrassed - if you take a look at blacktieguide.com, you'll see that everything I'm wearing is very classic black tie. For both this reason and the fact that I am so awesome, I hope that you always feel as proud and lucky to be with me as I feel to be with you.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
  6. yywwyy

    yywwyy Senior member

    Messages:
    1,750
    Joined:
    May 8, 2011
    Location:
    NY
    Show her this thread!
     
  7. HughJ

    HughJ Senior member

    Messages:
    554
    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2011
    

    No, that's the advice you wanted to hear.



    First thing that came to my mind too.
     
  8. ddsg

    ddsg Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    89
    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    As opposed to the advice you wanted to hear?


    I haven't gone over the entirety of the thread, but isn't one of the main observations that black tie is no longer treated the way it used to be (i.e. the vast, vast majority of attendees will are dressed similarly to the way the OP's girlfriend is suggesting?).

    Regardless of the proper or classical definition of what black tie is, I'm of the opinion that a person should always be dressed in function of the event and the people who will be attending said event. This does not mean you should wear a potato sack suit because everyone else has poorly fitted clothing, but your clothing should not be radically different from what is expected.

    For example, I work in a large law firm that is known for being very conservative. If I am meeting clients that are in finance or banking, I of course wear a suit and tie. However, there are some clients for whom "formal wear" is (a) wearing a dress shirt and (b) tucking said shirt into their jeans (some of these people are upper management representing Fortune 500 companies) and if I met these clients in a suit and tie, I'd either make them uncomfortable or be laughed out of the room.

    Just because something is a "client meeting" or a "black tie event" does not mean that there is only one way to dress and everyone who does not follow this rigid definition is wrong. Years ago maybe. Now, not so much. You wouldn't wear a top hat, monocle, cane and pocket watch to a dinner party, would you? I think your girlfriend's concerns are legitimate, but how correct she is remains to be seen. If it were the opposite, and she wanted to go to one of your formal events in jeans and a tank top, wouldn't you object? Wouldn't you feel just a little embarrassed?

    I find all the calls to "dress however you want" to be a touch ridiculous when they're coming from a crowd notorious for shaming people for dressing "incorrectly".
     
  9. Elegantly Wasted

    Elegantly Wasted Senior member

    Messages:
    279
    Joined:
    May 30, 2011
    

    A "client meeting" and a "black tie event" are two different things. There are so many types of Clients and of Meetings as you mentioned, that you have to have to adapt to each situation.

    Black tie on the other hand, has rules to be followed. If you want to dress like a "cowboy" you wear jeans- not corduroy, a hat- not a baseball cap, and so on. Same happens with formal attire.
     
  10. Ivar

    Ivar Senior member

    Messages:
    928
    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2010
    Location:
    Stockholm
    

    Not sure I follow you here. HughJ was implying that Craiger is -- knowingly or unknowingly -- fishing for an excuse to follow the line of least resistance, and so when someone suggests something to that effect, he tells himself (tries to tell himself?) that it's "damned good advice". It's basically a case of confirmation bias:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias



    That last part paints a very disturbing image. It's like you're letting yourself be defined by the nerd patrol ... :lol:
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
    1 person likes this.
  11. jgeldner

    jgeldner Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    52
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2009
    As someone with actual experience nearly the same exact situation, I can tell you what worked for me. My fiancee (now wife) wanted my groomsmen and me to be dressed as such:

    [​IMG]

    Or close to it anyway, she had a strong preference towards a red long (FIH) tie. She said no one wears bow ties anymore, and cummerbunds are for old fat men. I countered that I wouldn't wear a long tie, or anything in red, unless I was allowed to make something disappear (because it would make me look like a magician).

    I took her to a store (black tie in Philadelphia) that specializes in black tie attire. The salesman there put both options (red and traditional black) up on a mannequin, and it was pretty clear that one looked silly and one looked good.

    In her head, she was imagining something classy, and it really didn't look that way in person - if you take her to a store and put together the outfit she's thinking about, it will probably look dumb, and she will realize it.

    Of course, it could totally backfire and she'll think it looks great and then you're really screwed... Just my 2 cents...

    here's what I wore for the wedding...

    [​IMG]
     
  12. msulinski

    msulinski Senior member

    Messages:
    2,139
    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2012
    Location:
    NYC
    Ugh, can we stop with the "Happy Wife Happy Life" comments? I think this is some of the worst advice on this forum, especially in this situation. She sounds extremely controlling. If you can't convince her that your outfit is fine based on pictures from blacktieguide.com, then I think this relationship is over. Sure you can give in and wear what she wants, but you'll be doing that for the rest of your relationship when it comes to attire and probably everything else.
     
  13. ddsg

    ddsg Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    89
    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Styleforum is a gigantic exercise in confirmation bias. This entire thread is very pro "do what you want and screw what other people(in this case the girlfriend) think" simply because the way the OP wishes to dress falls directly under Styleforum's infallible dress laws. Go to the thread where a guy wants to wear a black shirt/pant/tie combo (which I admit, I find absolutely hideous) to go clubbing and the direction of the advice instantly shifts.

    Had the OP been the one wanting to wear a notched lapel suit with long tie and the girlfriend been the one pushing for the peak lapel/bow tie/cummerbund, I'm quite sure the advice would have shifted from "dump the girl because she's telling you how to dress" to "marry that girl". I have no problem with people giving recommendations on what works and what doesn't, which is after an important purpose of this forum. But let's try to not mask our attempts of enforcing style doctrine as anything other than what it is.

    As for the "nerd patrol" dictating what I wear, when the client is paying several hundred dollars per hour for even our most junior lawyer, we do what we can to make them feel comfortable [​IMG]

    Black tie has/had rules to be followed back when black tie had a single defined definition that was respected by most, if not all, attendees (or rather the organizers that use the term). Just because the invitation says "black tie" does not mean that you should blindly go for the full patent leather, winged collar, cummerbund, bow tie combo if the event isn't actually calling for it. You can call a strip club an artistic dance studio all you want, it doesn't change what goes on inside.

    Your cowboy analogy can be seen the same way. Were you to go to a "cowboy" event, would you show up in leather assless chaps and riding spurs with pistols strapped to your belt and an ammo belt strung across your chest? Maybe if you were going to a rodeo, but try to pull an outfit like that at anything less and you'd come off as downright insulting.

    Don't get me wrong, I take no pleasure in the current use of the term black tie nor in this whole "maverick CEO who never wears a suit" trend that's been going on. That does not change the fact that that is where things are. Are there still true black tie events? Undoubtedly, and should you attend one, you should dress appropriately. From what I understand, the OP's girlfriend is quite confident that this is not that.
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. facet

    facet Senior member

    Messages:
    698
    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2009
    

    lol.
     
  15. letmefly

    letmefly Senior member

    Messages:
    242
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Haven't read the whole thread but without having seen the actual outfit in question couldn't the reason behind the girlfriend being controlling and wanting the change the outfit be that it looks dated/doesn't fit and so forth? Would be nice to see an actual fit pic of the outfit we're defending here ;)
     
  16. HughJ

    HughJ Senior member

    Messages:
    554
    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2011
    

    Precisely. There is a consensus here, yet the advice from the guy with 8 posts (no offence) is cherry picked as damned good.

    I think the the control issue is larger in the long view, though.
     
  17. jgeldner

    jgeldner Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    52
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2009
    I don't think the "control issue" exists. We've been talking about brides, but this isn't about weddings, (OP didn't say he's getting married, right? Just that his girlfriend doesn't like his tux?). Which leads me to the following conclusion:

    Commenting on the strength a relationship between two people we've never met because one person wants the other to wear something other than his ideal seems like internet bullshit. Just sayin'.

    OP - relationships are built on compromise. That means you'll have to take some dives and so will she. If she wants to dress you like a clown (or, in my case, a magician), you'll have to decide if that's worth burning one of your matches by doing what you want anyway. The only way around having a fight about it is to lead her to the conclusion that you were right all along traditional attire is better looking, and the only way I've found to do that is to show her photos of people she thinks are fashionable (and you've got some good options from recent awards shows, finally - Bradley Cooper and P. Diddy at the 2012 Oscars, Ryan Seacrest at any awards show, etc) wearing something traditional. George Clooney works too - their fits tend not to be spectacular, but they're getting the accessories at least close enough for this purpose (bow tie and waist covering). Make sure your good and bad examples are the same person though - in case she is biased toward one of the guys you show her. Black tie guide is useful, but it's hard to tell a girl that you're going to wear something because it's the rules. Women's fashion doesn't work like that, and at least for me, that argument gets you told you dress like an old man.

    It's the same argument I had before going MTM for suiting. She was upset that I "hadn't exhausted all my options" with good brands before deciding to get something from a "no-name."

    I mean, just compare this:

    [​IMG]

    to this:

    [​IMG]
     
  18. yywwyy

    yywwyy Senior member

    Messages:
    1,750
    Joined:
    May 8, 2011
    Location:
    NY
    

    This is very good advice. If you both feel so strongly about it, it's best to see examples, perhaps even on yourself. If you do it right, it should be clear to her that you'll look good in what you want to wear.
     
  19. TM79

    TM79 Senior member

    Messages:
    2,806
    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2010
    Location:
    Boston
    
    Maybe you missed the part that she said she'd be embarrassed to be with him if he wore the outfit he wanted to?

    Maybe you also missed realizing how you can only reply based on what information you're given? He made her sound really bitchy. If she isn't, then that's his fault for writing it that way.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2012

Share This Page

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by