A Sam (and David) Hober Tie Appreciation Thread

[pinkpanther]



A little help on terminology and construction.

My next Hober will be a small pattern on a dark red or burgundy ground.  I'm torn between the Macclesfields in the 120-126 range versus the Challis Macclesfield Dark Red Pattern Wool Tie #3 (below).

So, they are both identified on David's site as Macclesfields.

Q1:  Are they both printed?

Q2:  Is the only difference the former are silk and the latter wool?

Q3:  Is the #3 deemed a seasonal tie?

Bonus question:  Is there a favorite "non-printed" option in dark red/burgundy?

(Man, that #3 looks good but I really need something for year round use.)

Thanks in advance.

I have that tie and it is very nice. Wrt your questions:

Q1: yes

Q2: yes (although there could be other technical differences I am not aware of)

Q3: most on SF (including myself) would consider that a seasonal tie. However, fall/winter is a pretty long season.

Bonus: Other than the solid and stripe grenadines you might check out the woven pin dot ties David offers

Happy shopping. Also, if you haven't tried one of David's Macclesfields they really are quite nice. Claghorn posted a pic of a burgundy in action a page or so back that is tremendous.

 

[jeffd]

I just received the wool challis #1 pattern, and for myself, I'm not sure I'll confine it to just fall and winter. It's smooth and tightly woven and to my eye looks pretty much like a silk except for the matte finish - not textured or 'woolly' like the herringbones, for example. In fact, I like the midnight version so much, I'll probably include the #3 on my next order.

 

[Count de Monet]

I have that tie and it is very nice. Wrt your questions:

Q1: yes

Q2: yes (although there could be other technical differences I am not aware of)

Q3: most on SF (including myself) would consider that a seasonal tie. However, fall/winter is a pretty long season.

Bonus: Other than the solid and stripe grenadines you might check out the woven pin dot ties David offers

Happy shopping. Also, if you haven't tried one of David's Macclesfields they really are quite nice. Claghorn posted a pic of a burgundy in action a page or so back that is tremendous.

Thanks to you and Archibald. Clag's looks great (I think it is the 121).

 

[Claghorn]

Aye, I think it was 121. I asked for the thinnest lining available as I feel that thinner linings lend themselves well to Macclesfield silk, particularly when dimpling.

Made sure to take a good picture as it was for the Friday Challenge (sponsored by Henry Carter). If any of y'all wore a nice soporific tie this week, you should hurry up and enter it. Surprisingly, I think mine might be the only Hober entered at the moment, which is a shame because his selection of soporifics is better than any but Capelli's

 

[The Silverfox]

Well... if you want to be technical about it (who doesn't?), yes a wool tie is generally a seasonal tie. That being said, there's a big difference between a tie that looks like a shetland sweater and a tie that looks almost indistinguishable from a silk tie.

So while wool *should* be reserved for cooler climes/seasons, it's not going to look strange if you wear this in any place/season because the look and feel of the wool is so subtle I highly doubt any casual observer is going to have any chance at guessing it's wool. If someone knows what to look for and takes the time to study it, of course they'll see, but it doesn't scream WOOL like some do.

If I were you, I'd just decide based on what kind of tie you want without worrying too much about seasonality, it's not going to look out of place either way, and to me the lightness and softness of the challis is a bit summery in and of itself. The challis ties are extremely soft and light, and quite bouncy (from the elasticity in the wool), so if these qualities are qualities you like, you probably want to consider them. In my experience the surface will visibly be close to the same in smoothness as silk, but the fibers themselves will be less slick and less lustrous. So the effect is a tie that looks pretty much like a silk, except matter, and the knot will slip less because of the extra friction and softness. Another fun thing about the challis is how soft it is, not just in terms of how it hangs and drapes, but simply how it feels around the neck.

So wearing one in july would be a slight transgression against the rules, but when it doesn't look thick or overly warm and it's got a nice light, airy and soft hand, I think it's a type of rule-breaking that's permissible unless you need it for very formal settings. Just go with the tie that has the qualities you want (luster vs matte, heavy vs light, etc etc)

By the way, my experiences with challis is all with 3-fold. How the 6 fold acts I can't comment, but I would imagine it would become more similar to silk, aside from the matte-ness of course, as increasing the folds would reduce the lightness etc.

 

[tdude]

Nicely said silver and I agree. I've worn my challis a couple times "wrongly" and enjoyed my rebellion.

 

[The Silverfox]

Just noticed the bonus question.

I just got the burgundy diamond weave a little while ago (go back some pages and there are pics, though it's darker and deeper in real life than in the pictures) and I have to say it's absolutely spectacular. I bought it based on some older pictures from this thread, and it's even more awesome in real life than I thought. A classy power-tie if ever there was one. Sublime in a subtle way is probably the best way to describe it, if you know what I mean.


EDIT:
Here it is again. Picture is a bit brighter than real life, so the colors looks brighter and more washed out than it is. The real color is a bit darker and a lot deeper.

As someone else mentioned, the woven pindots are awesome. I have the white on midnight blue (though it's brighter than most midnights, more like very dark navy), which I love, and from having seen the swatch of the burgundy version I'm quite certain this one is also very nice. I was considering getting it, but went with diamond instead.

A third option would be the english solid satin. I have this one in dark navy, and I think the texture and luster of the weave does very very well with dark hues. It has that smooth, wet elegance of satin, but the english satin isn't so smooth as to become something garrish that Donald Trump might wear, and especially with dark colors it seems to work. I love my dark navy one, and I would think the burgundy would be equally good, this was another one of the contenders, and the front runner before I went with diamond weave.

And of course there are the grenadines, but personally I feel grenadines are better for brighter colors as this displays the most interesting part, namely the texture, to better advantage. Because the weave is so nonreflective, with the very dark ones, they sort of just absorb the light and you don't really see the texture as much, so for these colors I personally prefer satin/diamond weave/etc. Plenty of people love them in navy/midnight/burgundy/bitter chocolate though, and many of them are gentlemen with exceedingly good taste, so I'm not claiming any authority on this one, it's just my personal taste that bright colors do well as grenadines while darker ones look better as diamond/satin.

 

[Count de Monet]

Silvefox, thanks for weighing in on the bonus question. I must say, you're not making things simpler.

 

[archibaldleach]



And of course there are the grenadines, but personally I feel grenadines are better for brighter colors as this displays the most interesting part, namely the texture, to better advantage. Because the weave is so nonreflective, with the very dark ones, they sort of just absorb the light and you don't really see the texture as much, so for these colors I personally prefer satin/diamond weave/etc. Plenty of people love them in navy/midnight/burgundy/bitter chocolate though, and many of them are gentlemen with exceedingly good taste, so I'm not claiming any authority on this one, it's just my personal taste that bright colors do well as grenadines while darker ones look better as diamond/satin.

If I had to pick a side, I'd go with the opposite position. One nice thing about darker grenadines is that the texture becomes more subtle, which works well when you are trying to dress conservatively. Diamond weaves work well here too admittedly, but there's something about the grenadine texture that I enjoy regardless. On the other hand, a bright tie is going to be noticed anyway, so you might as well embrace it (the grenadine texture is interesting but reduces the brightness). Fortunately, there are plenty of Hobers to go around which lets me have grenadines in dark and light colors and do the same for diamond weave ties.

 

[sevenfoldtieguy]



A little help on terminology and construction. My next Hober will be a small pattern on a dark red or burgundy ground. I'm torn between the Macclesfields in the 120-126 range versus the Challis Macclesfield Dark Red Pattern Wool Tie #3 (below). So, they are both identified on David's site as Macclesfields. Q1: Are they both printed? Q2: Is the only difference the former are silk and the latter wool? Q3: Is the #3 deemed a seasonal tie? Bonus question: Is there a favorite "non-printed" option in dark red/burgundy? (Man, that #3 looks good but I really need something for year round use.) Thanks in advance.

Bonus answer: Oxford weave no. 7.

 

[Claghorn]

Bonus answer: Oxford weave no. 7.

It's a fantastic tie. A little too city for my simple country tastes though, so I don't wear it too much.

 

[The Silverfox]



If I had to pick a side, I'd go with the opposite position. One nice thing about darker grenadines is that the texture becomes more subtle, which works well when you are trying to dress conservatively. Diamond weaves work well here too admittedly, but there's something about the grenadine texture that I enjoy regardless. On the other hand, a bright tie is going to be noticed anyway, so you might as well embrace it (the grenadine texture is interesting but reduces the brightness). Fortunately, there are plenty of Hobers to go around which lets me have grenadines in dark and light colors and do the same for diamond weave ties.

I guess I like to go for the happy medium, brightening dark hues with lustrous weaves and tempering bright colors with more interesting but less flashy weaves. To me a tie just needs to have something about it, and with my navy grenadine it just seems so dead. So if the color is very muted, I feel it sort of needs to have more luster in the weave to balance, but I fully agree that grenadine does what you say it does, I just don't find myself wanting that effect too much. But I fully realize this is more personal idiosyncrasy and temperament on my part than anything else. And of course with rougher sportier coats where lustrous ties would be too formal, the grenadine reigns supreme precisely for the reason you mention.

It's a fantastic tie. A little too city for my simple country tastes though, so I don't wear it too much.

That's a good point, and it's one that's going to apply equally if not more for diamond weave in my opinion. If this is going to be a part of your city wardrobe to be worn with white business shirts and grey/navy worsted suits, you're not going to have a problem, but if you intend to wear it with button down shirts and a sweater or with sportier type odd jackets and trousers, grenadine is more versatile than oxford, diamond or the pindot, and probably the satin as well. Both can be dressed up perfectly well, but it's somewhat more difficult to dress the oxfords and diamonds down than it is the grenadines Also, is that the same suit from before with the burgundy print tie and the fine striped shirt? Really nice suit, great color and texture. What is that cloth?

 

[Claghorn]

Same suit. Kerry Knolls wool-linen; it's become my go to spring/summer suit.

 

[The Silverfox]



Same suit. Kerry Knolls wool-linen; it's become my go to spring/summer suit.

I can see why it would be, which tailor did you use?

Both the color and the look of the fabric seem perfect for a casually elegant summer suit, so assuming the cloth is cool-wearing enough that's gotta be close to the perfect summer suit as far as I'm concerned.

Is there enough wool and general weight in the cloth to prevent it from wrinkling the way linen tends to do? How heavy is the cloth?

 

[Claghorn]

A made to measure place here (Coveri; I think it's a chain). My B&T stuff has totally unstructured shoulders.

That's about as wrinkled as it gets. Cloth is like 9-10 ounces. I actually have two suits in linen-wool from Kerry Knolls, the second with a higher linen content and wrinkles a bit more: