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A Fine Pair of Shoes x Alfred Sargent MTO Thread

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by SuitedDx, May 18, 2012.

  1. Saratorial_Splender

    Saratorial_Splender Senior member

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    While it is understandable it makes no business sense for the manufacturer. They should utilize all channels to maximize sales and profit, period.
     
  2. tchoy

    tchoy Senior member

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    I have to agreed 100%. How about for the people who don't live in the US or Europe where does AS wants us to buy their shoes from?
     
  3. scurvyfreedman

    scurvyfreedman Senior member

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    I'm sure AFPOS will advise us soon of how this will all play out, including MTO.

    When I spoke with Leffot about a year ago, they were only doing MTO Handgrade, not Exclusive. Plus, without this site or similar others consolidating Exclusive MTO of six, no store will ever get six MTO of the same shoe and type in the Exclusive range.

    I hope we can continue to do MTO special runs with AFPOS. If not, Chay Cooper will lose a lot of business and it won't be made up for with new US orders. Protecting main-line products is one thing. Protecting one-off productions of special designs just mean they disappear.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2013
  4. Gdot

    Gdot Senior member

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    I agree. The fine folks at A Fine Pair of Shoes represented AS Exclusives extremely well. I am very sorry to see them loose the opportunity for the business.
     
  5. Harrydog

    Harrydog Senior member

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    Leffot is currently stocking AS Exclusive. 720.00 for the Hunt. 518.00 at AFPOS. That is what we are getting with this new policy. Does anyone even know of any AS stockists in the US? If this is being done to suck up to Leffot, it is nuts!
     
  6. EBugatti

    EBugatti Senior member

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    I agree this is insane. No one sells AS Exclusives in the US except Leffot that I know. Why kill off a sales channel? Not the brightest move on their part. Also, why the huge price difference between US and UK buyers? Why try to "protect" a price they don't charge their own domestic (UK) customers?
     
  7. REguy

    REguy Senior member

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    Had I known this was coming, I would've bought a few more pairs during the sale. Hope the MTOs keep coming.
     
  8. scurvyfreedman

    scurvyfreedman Senior member

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    I realized the Leffot is now selling Exclusives, but not MTO Exclusives with changes to the designs like AFPOS does with Handgrade models. It's a completely different service than standard Exclusive range shoes.
     
  9. SoGent

    SoGent Senior member

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    Quote: that's too bad. Julian was a pleasure to deal with & was pretty accommodating when he was making sure the fit was just right.
    More sales for G&G (unless they decide to screw up too) and Carmina. bontoni is nice though.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2013
  10. mxgreen

    mxgreen Senior member

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    I believe that Ron Rider (Rider Boot Company) stocks a few models.
     
  11. justinkapur

    justinkapur Senior member

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    :inlove:
     
  12. Harrydog

    Harrydog Senior member

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    I didn't claim they were doing MTO exclusives. I think we can still do that with AFPOS. My point is that if you want to order a stock shoe in the exclusive line, like the Hunt, the Moore or the Ramsey (all available on the AFPOS site), you can't do it from the US. You have to go to US stockists like Leffot and and accept what they happen to stock at the price they charge. In the case of Leffot, the options are limited and the price signficantly more than what one would pay at AFPOS.

    Ultimately, it isn't even the price I care that much about; it is simply having access to as wide a range of style and purchase options. It took six months for AS to produce our Miller boot. I will do MTO for a unique build, but in many cases I'd be just as happy with a RTW stock purchase. The more options and opportunity to purchase out of stock is very welcome.

    Would I like more vendors and expanded stock and purchase opportunities? Sure! At the very least, I don't want to be denied the option of buying from a vendor's existing stock. That is exactly what AS has done.

    Perhaps the compromise is to have AS set a standard and more narrow price range for e-commerce sales. That is what I understand EG does. A friend who runs a small haberdashery with an on-line sales component said that EG set a minimum price he could ask as part of the sales agreement. It also makes me think about EG's decision a year or so ago to stop serving the US in its semi-annual sale. Perhaps that was at the request of US vendors as well.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2013
  13. Harrydog

    Harrydog Senior member

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    If AS cares about US retailers (do they really have any?), they might take the time to list that information on their web site.

    What I found is:

    Leffot has seven styles with a pretty good size run - but running about $200 more than at AFPOS. Maybe with the new AS policy, they will start to move them.

    Rider Boot has two boots from the Country line - more casual, rugged stuff. $660-680. $435.00 at AFPOS.

    Now of course you have to add in shipping to the US and play the customs game, but we are talking real money in the price difference. And as noted above, simply in availability and variety. For example, at Leffot I am not interested in the Pimlico , two hole derby in black (is that to fill the gap for an out of stock Arca?). Meanwhile, AFPOS has a nice derby, ankle boot the Radwell in a nice brown country grain. Ooooops, Can't buy that.

    I wonder if AFPOS can export the Exclusive Limited Editions they make up - like the shell Ramsay's.

    Julian and AFPOS have played a big role in establishing brand recognition for AS exclusive and now he is getting cut out so Leffot can reap the benefit?
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2013
  14. SuitedDx

    SuitedDx Senior member

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    It is unfortunate for those consumers outside of the EU without a local AS stockist. If the MTO program continues, it will provide AFPoS a nice avenue for business. Also, as in other MTO, they maintain the rights to the design. I do not want to make too many comparisons with Alden but their MTO program with various stockist (e.g., Leffot, Leather Soul) is a good example (from the business point of view).
     
  15. Fiddler

    Fiddler Senior member

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    Well what a bummer. That new Radwell chukka boot looks tasty. If they are doing this to protect Leffot, fine, but why can't I order this model to be shipped to Asia? Doesn't quite add up.
     
  16. Saratorial_Splender

    Saratorial_Splender Senior member

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    Leffot selling practices are very predatory. He went after an Edward Green customer who obough a shoes from him and from Edward Green directly. He forced EG hand into not selling to the customer directly. I would not be surprised if he has a hand in the latest AS decision.
     
  17. laufer

    laufer Senior member

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    Many companies do this. They simply want to protect their dealers. Leffot is in danger of being a victim of "showrooming" where people go to try on the shoes, determine their best fitting size and then purchase from somewhere else.

    The problem is Leffot is not AS exclusive dealer, Leffot carries many different shoe brands hence its stock offerings will be slim.

    Anyways I am not defending AS. I think this was shortsighted decision. AS exclusive line might be stuck in the middle of nowhere. At $750 price point you can choose to spend little more and go for G&G or little less and get Carmina shoes. In my opinion AS Exclusive line shoes should be in $500 range.
     
  18. Harrydog

    Harrydog Senior member

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    In that case, I backed Leffot. The shoe in question was a navy shell Westminster made up expressly for Leffot. Profits were being donated to charity I believe.

    EG was right to say that that design was exclusive to Leffot. Perhaps you could make the case that after a certain amount of time, one could have gone directly to EG. At the very least, they should have quoted the same price point.

    But let's not refight that debate here.

    I just keep coming back to the simple fact that I want the widest choice and the ability to purchase any stock items I can find. That is what the global market is about - not the kind of Neo-Mercantilist crap like banning export to certain markets. I don't want to refight the War of Jenkin's Ear, but I will if I have to!

    Comparative cost is actually secondary. I often support local vendors regardless of cost because I enjoy fostering those kind of relationships.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2013
  19. NAMOR

    NAMOR Senior member

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    Exclusives aren't allowed but MTO exclusives are still a go?
     
  20. Saratorial_Splender

    Saratorial_Splender Senior member

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    That was my understanding. The reason is that MTO style are seldom sold elsewhere with the same configurations that SF members dream up! I have order 3 MTO from AFPoS and none of them is available at stores.
     

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