21st century women can be difficult

[scarphe]

Originally Posted by hannahmontana

interesting that you feel the men's legal position is the one that defines what "complete citizens" are. perhaps men should be pushing to not be conscripted. then, perhaps they would be complete citizens?

again you are avoiding the issue.... could you please anser teh question directly...
honellty women...

btu to address your issue. how else would define a citizne in western terms? being conscripted is part of being a freeman in western societies. and being a freeman is part an esseitila part of being a citizen... so what is you defintion of a citizen?
this socratic crap you are doing sucks donkey balls by the way.

 

[philosophe]

Originally Posted by yachtie

What absurd claims? I've made no claims at all aside from stating that the feminist movement is fairly rife with a specified ideology. You, of all people, should know better than to insert qualifiers (absurd) without data. I don't think I've made any other claims, absurd or otherwise. I haven't made any claims as to what I think the goals of the feminist movement are. Yet.

Regarding neurobiology, I can see that it a clear species advantage that women and men do NOT think the same way. If that is undermining to some tenet of feminism, then maybe they should revisit their assumptions.

There was that small claim, some pages back, that feminists took the sexes to be identical.

Your second paragraph indicates your ignorance of contemporary feminist thought.

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by Dashaansafin

Sucks for you. This is why you dont marry a woman until you are sure what kind of person she is.


My mom cooked, cleaned, raised 3 kids, sent us to tutors/activities every day. This is from when we were dirt poor till we are wealthy. Never had a maid, how lazy can your wife get?

My mom cooked, cleaned, raised and educated 2 kids AND worked as a full-time doctor.

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by harvey_birdman

Your desires are not unreasonable at all.

Yes but good luck trying to explain that to her

 

[SirGrotius]

A quick update in the most active thread in the general forum...I brought up a number of things with my wife, some of them inspired by you guys:

Q: Have you thought about PPD?
A: Is this your way of making me feel bad?

Q: How do you think women used to do it when they had five kids?
A: I couldn't do it! Are you nuts?

Q: What do you think about working again?
A: Why? Why? Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!

In all seriousness, we found a nanny that can come a couple of days a week for about five hours a time. It sounds like a small thing, but those 10 hours are HUGE. My wife is in much better spirits. Also I'm noticing as the baby gets a little older, it's much, much easier.

There's also an element of me enjoying being with the baby more. I hate to say it but during the first few months I was barely interested. He just pooped, etc. but now that he laughs, rolls around, pulls his binkie out, etc. there's a much greater entertainment factor. Do I have free time? No. Do I enjoy my time with him more, yes.

At the end of the day though, the liberation of women has made the traditional man's role a lot less rewarding. It's not as though just because my wife is hyper educated she's somehow more intelligent than women were earlier this century, etc.

Here's another theory for you. She spend her most productive years (20s) being educated and not bearing children. I wonder if she'd be more hmmm accepting? of her position were she to have been in a mother in her twenties not thirties.

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by Runningman411

How old are you and your wife? I ask because I honestly don't see how a traditional marriage can work these days. Most women under 30 have no idea how to cook and, because they're often an only child or one of two, have no idea how to raise children. And, because of housekeepers in many households, have no idea how to clean either. So, other than having a womb and being able to bear children, modern women don't really seem suited for the housewife job.

I've seen it many times with even people my age (36). Guy and wife meet each other in college or something. Both are pursuing degrees or even graduate degrees. When they're done with school, they decide to marry because that's the logical next step. What next? Well, kids of course. However, and for whatever reason, the guy thinks that having a kid will somehow transform that binge drinking, eating out every night, career woman into Susy Homemaker!

Here's my tip...Regardless of how much money you earn, DO NOT EVER offer your wife the opportunity to be a stay at home mom. Do not hint at it while you're engaged. Do not believe whatever fairy tale stories you've heard or what your dad might have said. It just doesn't work these days. It worked for your dad because mom didn't question how many hours he worked a week or gave him grief for missing dance recitals, soccer games, etc. He worked all day and came home to a clean house, clean kids and a home cooked meal. Hell, mom might have even overlooked an affair or two if he kept it discreet. It takes a certain type of woman to do it and they're few and far between these days.

While being at home with a young child really isn't that bad, she will think it is. This results in resentment for both husband and wife and is not worth any perceived benefit of having a stay at home mom for your kids. Listen, they are simply not going to grow up like you did.


There's a lot of practical wisdom (and truth) in this post. Thanks.

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by munchausen

She can and will spend the money on herself. No ex-wife will ever set up some separate account for the kids. And they will not hesitate to hit the ex-husband up for any and all unusual expenses. And the ex-husband will see the kids when she says it's ok, custody order be damned. And there is nothing anyone anywhere can do about it.

And we wonder why people don't get married anymore.

More and more, men don't want to get married. Many women would love to be married

 

[BlackShoes]

Originally Posted by SirGrotius

A quick update in the most active thread in the general forum...I brought up a number of things with my wife, some of them inspired by you guys:

Q: Have you thought about PPD?
A: Is this your way of making me feel bad?

Q: How do you think women used to do it when they had five kids?
A: I couldn't do it! Are you nuts?

Q: What do you think about working again?
A: Why? Why? Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!

In all seriousness, we found a nanny that can come a couple of days a week for about five hours a time. It sounds like a small thing, but those 10 hours are HUGE. My wife is in much better spirits. Also I'm noticing as the baby gets a little older, it's much, much easier.

There's also an element of me enjoying being with the baby more. I hate to say it but during the first few months I was barely interested. He just pooped, etc. but now that he laughs, rolls around, pulls his binkie out, etc. there's a much greater entertainment factor. Do I have free time? No. Do I enjoy my time with him more, yes.

At the end of the day though, the liberation of women has made the traditional man's role a lot less rewarding. It's not as though just because my wife is hyper educated she's somehow more intelligent than women were earlier this century, etc.

Here's another theory for you. She spend her most productive years (20s) being educated and not bearing children. I wonder if she'd be more hmmm accepting? of her position were she to have been in a mother in her twenties not thirties.

No wonder she is in better spirits, someone else cleans her house, someone else looks after her baby and someone else earns the money to pay for it all. What on earth does she do all day? What does she do when the nanny is around for all those hours? Have you ever spent a weekday at home and noticed what she got up to? Can you afford this all? Think of the nice things you could buy (for you or your kid) by reducing your domestic staffing payroll.

 

[Dashaansafin]

^+1

 

[hannahmontana]

Originally Posted by scarphe

again you are avoiding the issue.... could you please anser teh question directly...
honellty women...

btu to address your issue. how else would define a citizne in western terms? being conscripted is part of being a freeman in western societies. and being a freeman is part an esseitila part of being a citizen... so what is you defintion of a citizen?
this socratic crap you are doing sucks donkey balls by the way.

my definition of someone who is conscripted is the same as a slave. you are involuntarily taken by the state and sent to war. that you think being conscipted is being a "freeman" is pretty freaking funny and I would love to hear your explanation of that one.

 

[SirGrotius]

Originally Posted by BlackShoes

No wonder she is in better spirits, someone else cleans her house, someone else looks after her baby and someone else earns the money to pay for it all. What on earth does she do all day? What does she do when the nanny is around for all those hours? Have you ever spent a weekday at home and noticed what she got up to? Can you afford this all? Think of the nice things you could buy (for you or your kid) by reducing your domestic staffing payroll.

A nanny is ridiculously cheap - this is only 10 hours a week, so like $100 a week, literally. That's nothing compared to daycare that many pay.

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by SirGrotius

A nanny is ridiculously cheap - this is only 10 hours a week, so like $100 a week, literally. That's nothing compared to daycare that many pay.

True but that's not the point. The OP's wife needs to pull her own weight (bring something to the relationship).

 

[cross22]

Originally Posted by mkarim

True but that's not the point. The OP's wife needs to pull her own weight (bring something to the relationship).

He IS the OP.

 

[Contingency Plan]

Nightmare scenarios like the OP really show just how important choosing the right woman is.

Edit: And an air-tight pre-nup!

 

[mkarim]

Originally Posted by Contingency Plan

Nightmare scenarios like the OP really show just how important choosing the right woman is.

!

Do you think that just because someone chooses the "right woman" she won't change later? People are heavily influenced nowadays by friends, media, Oprah, Dr. Phil, etc.

Remember the adage: "A woman marries a man hoping that he will change and he doesn't. A man marries a woman hoping that she won't change and she does".