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Yohji, Or How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love The Looser Fit (Yohji Yamamoto Thread)

Discussion in 'Streetwear and Denim' started by Ivwri, Dec 29, 2011.

  1. Ivwri

    Ivwri Well-Known Member

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    Haha! Indeed :).

    On a side note, I just finished watching the movie Pina by Wim Wenders and it was amazing. A lot of the clothing/costuming looked like it could have been designed by Yohji himself and the movement of the dancers was really inspiring and thought provoking. I would gush about the movie more, but don't want to go too off-topic. Hehe. Suffice to say, if you can see it in the cinema do so. Or pick it up on bluray or dvd. The music was beautiful as well, definitely picking up the album now.

    I can really see why Yohji would do an entire collection dedicated to/inspired by Pina Bausch. To want to make anything that evoked even something of what she was able to accomplish with her dance troupe and her choreography would be enough inspiration to make one attempt all sorts of things.

    It also got me thinking about what would happen to Yohji Yamamoto Inc. once Yohji retires. Watching Pina's dancers going through her routines in different locales and re-interpreting her love of natural elements and intense emotions made me realise that at least in their own field, at the very worst, they could keep on performing those same routines with slight modifications for a while longer. They are amazing to watch and they are all very talented individuals that have been working with each other for years. Pina Bausch died before Wim Wenders began shooting for the movie and they were still able to release something quite powerful.

    I am pretty sure Yohji has enough assistants that he could hand over the creative duties to, and could basically continue to walk on the path he has set, going through the motions that he choreographed over the three decades he has been working, but I wonder whether it would be enough. Unlike dance, most fashion houses could not get away releasing the exact same designs with modifications to just fabric or possibly button positioning etc. season after season. Could anybody else capture what it is that makes Yohji's clothing and designs so unique and expressive? Would the designs have that same aura that quite a few Yohji lovers are drawn to? Or is it all a cult of personality based around Yohji and dependent on his remaining at the helm?

    Would it be better to have someone come with a different angle completely from what Yohji had? Maybe they could distill the essence of the brand into a completely different form that would probably in turn generate new shapes and silhouettes. Create clothing that still has, for want of a better word, soul?

    EDIT - That shirt really looks nice Parker, shame about the sizing.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2012
  2. asobu

    asobu Well-Known Member

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    I think these are very interesting questions that are very hard to answer. Didn't we discuss this over PM before? Can't remember atm...

    But to start with the most obvious and boring statement - I would like to see it go on IF that is Yohji himself wants. I'm not sure whether he feels that the brand itself is too connected to him as a person/creator, or if he wants his legacy to live on in the hands of whoever he deems fit for the job.

    The sad thing is that it's probably not up to him. Consider that he was actually thinking about qutting at the very end of the 00's, and then the whole bankruptcy affair happened right after that. It's true that he felt it was worth fighting for the house to stay alive, and not just call it quits at the time, but realistically he probably won't be able to be in full charge of designing 4 collection every year for many more years to come. The investors, however, are probably looking to make their money back and keep the brand alive for as long as they can keep selling stuff.

    As for the designer who would possibly take the helm of this ship, that is pretty much a lose-lose situation. No matter how successfully he or she will translate his/her own vision into the history of the brand there will always be that discrepancy between the creator and the customers vision of what the brand is or should be. People will just react to collections differently just because someone else is doing them. I can think of a handful collections in the last few years that - if they were designed entirely by someone else - would be considered just bleak copies of his work. I can even see how SS12, which was pretty much univerally liked or respected (form what I can tell), would garner comments like "too literal japanese references, Yohji wouldn't do that" or "just a ss04 copy" or whatever. It's gonna be hard no matter what.

    I would love to hear what Yohji thinks of this, if anyone has read interviews where this topic was brought up? I also wonder how hierachical the day-to-day design work is, if it historically all came from Yohji and his patterener(s) or if a lot of the ideas also eminated from the atelier group. I'm sure the studio is very competent, and obviously they will still have all the workshops and factories involved still. However, with a studio effort, would we just get SS10 all over again?

    And then for completely selfish reasons, the positive thing I can think of if the brand continues after Yohji's time is that no matter the quality of the new stuff, people will be pre-occupied with buying whatever's on the racks and I can keep picking up greatness from eras past without as much competition. :embar:


    Really need to see Pina btw, thanks for reminding me! I completely missed it when it was shown in the cinemas here.
     
  3. davidlee388

    davidlee388 Well-Known Member

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    Asobu put it very well there. Many people, I'm afraid me included, will always question the " authenticity " of the clothes created by his successor after his retirement. Obviously Yohji doesn't design every garment of every collection, the important thing is he has a design team to realise his vision. Also he had appeared in 99% of his runway shows so he is perceived to be in charge of the staging of the shows, the choice of models and the looks. So at least the pieces on the runway have his seal of approval.

    It's particularly sad for me to see him go eventually, and I seem to be stuck in a time warp, but I am more drawn to his creations of the yesteryears, the roomier silhouette, the humor and the groundbreaking concepts of some pieces. So there is no denying the return of some of his greatness from recent offerings, particularly SS11 and SS12, his true greatness was behind him imho. The 2nd hand market is still a great place to find great YY vintage pieces to satiate our craving of things bearing his label.
     
  4. snowmanxl

    snowmanxl Well-Known Member

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    when he retires you can claim youve got "OG Yohji" and not the new stuff :laugh:

    i was just reading a recent Helmut Lang interview about his art and the legacy he left.
     
    1 person likes this.
  5. Ivwri

    Ivwri Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, it's definitely a very valid point you guys raise about whether his successor will be able to ever get out from under his shadow. Look at what Kris Van Assche is suffering at Dior Homme and Hedi Slimane has not been working in fashion nearly as long as Yohji has. I guess in a way I would prefer the house to go on, but primarily if the entire thing changed in the look of the clothing. Maybe the mainline could be collapsed to producing only re-issues of classic pieces from his history and then another label (Y's?) could then become the main line with a focus on a designer with a really strong vision. The only requirements being that that zen spirit and anti-fashion sensibility be carried on.

    Not sure whether I can express it better, but yeah, something like that I think I would be happy with. Of course, if Yohji himself wanted his line to continue under his name and named a successor, I would definitely not be against that at all.



    Lol. Well, there is that too. Looking forward to giving my son and/or daughter some "OG Yohji" pieces at some point :slayer:
     
  6. snake

    snake Well-Known Member

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    you mean the thousands of archive pieces he destroyed? it crushed my heart :embar:
     
  7. snowmanxl

    snowmanxl Well-Known Member

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    yeah, thats what i mean. 6000 pieces according to the interview
     
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  8. dantebykiko

    dantebykiko Well-Known Member

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    spend 4 hours reading the thread. bloody awesome! will join the conversation as soon as i find spare time!
     
  9. snowmanxl

    snowmanxl Well-Known Member

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    "if the HL interview is online would you mind posting a link? I'd love to have a read"

    i tried searching for it before you posted this :eek:
    i couldnt find it.

    the magazine is called dapper dan
    http://www.dapperdanmagazine.com/

    i really like this magazine. last issue had an ann d, kva and siki im interview. there seems to be a theme with yohji pieces making an appearance at the end of each magazine too :D (ive only read 2 issues out of 5)
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2012
    1 person likes this.
  10. asobu

    asobu Well-Known Member

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  11. Auburn

    Auburn Well-Known Member

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    Quote:
    Great answer. That New York Times interviewer was pretty terrible....
     
  12. valter

    valter Well-Known Member

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    Before this turns into a Helmut Lang thread, here's some photos of Yohji working:



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    2 people like this.
  13. robinsongreen68

    robinsongreen68 Well-Known Member

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    did yohji design all of pina bausch's costumes? some of the outfits in the wenders film are amazing.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2012
  14. snowmanxl

    snowmanxl Well-Known Member

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    fun fact: kris van assche's boyfriend gave him a photograph of pina bausch smoking a cigarette. he likes the attitude portrayed.
    that is all.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2012
  15. poorman

    poorman Well-Known Member

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    Watched Kitano's "Brother" in class, It said wardrobe by Yohji Yamamoto in the into credits and I was like, ":bounce2:"
     
  16. TACO_FLAVORED_KISSES

    TACO_FLAVORED_KISSES Well-Known Member

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    anyone know how those Mid zipper sneakers fit in comparison to say CP's? Quality?
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2012
  17. Ivwri

    Ivwri Well-Known Member

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    I don't think so actually. Costume design was credited to Rolf Borzik & Marion Cito. I also looked into it earlier and the only collaboration I could find was when Yohji did costume design for her and her troupe in 1998 for an anniversary performance. I think she wore Yohji in her private life though. Seen her pictured in a bit of Yohji. If anyone has more info would be glad to see it though. A lot of the costumes like I wrote earlier were really reminiscent of Yohji to me and like you say, it was really amazing.


    :). Apparently, Yohji and Takeshi Kitano are friends. I swear Kitano just gets Yohji suits for every film he is in though, lol. Watched Sonatine again recently and everything in the movie looked like Yohji could have designed it. Complete with flashy print shirts :).


    I assume you are talking about the Y's ones that are on Wrongweather? If so, they fit true to size. half a size large from my own experience. Got them in a size 44 and they are pretty snug. I wear a 44 in Ann and a 45 in AW11-12 MMM Gats if that helps any. I can't compare the quality to Cps or anything like that, but the leather is alright and the zipper is pretty solid. Fairly comfortable too (not as comfy as MMM Gats, but YMMV).
     
  18. Ivwri

    Ivwri Well-Known Member

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    I just realized that every time I wear out the silk tapered hakamas I get compliments from women in the form of them saying they "want my pants" and asking where they could get a pair. :eek:
     
  19. snowmanxl

    snowmanxl Well-Known Member

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    sounds like a job for Ivwri's tailor :devil:
     
  20. Parker

    Parker Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure if these have been posted, but I found some images of the Spring/Summer 2001 collection. From an old Superfuture thread. You can see some of the recurring themes: double lapels, oversized sleeves, busy prints, etc. Check out the super arm suits! There's even a 50s-style nerdy professor look.

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    Last edited: Apr 15, 2012

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