Yohji, Or How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love The Looser Fit (Yohji Yamamoto Thread)

[Ivwri]



and it was bought from rakuten for peanuts, it's not a secret that rex is being capitalizing all the effort made by some people e.g. the code list that asobu and me created some time ago, scanning old magazines etc, back in the day rex wasn't selling that much yohji compared to nowadays and his prices were much cheaper, thanks to the code list he could add runway pictures and upgrade his business and yet he won't tell you the truth. He's bidding on everything on yahoo and rakuten and then reselling it to the same people he's leeching info from. Not really fond of this behaviour myself.

i really regret sometimes making a lot of info widely available, there was nothing 8 years ago. Nowadays, with from japan and this artificial hype I can see loads of people just buying because is suddenly cool or straight closet cos players, funny that asobu and me we have the smallest pockets around and we can't even afford to buy **** from auctions anymore just some badly represented items. I feel like 90% of the pieces are not even seeing the light in the streets...which is extremely sad. All this consumerism is making me sort of sick, before we were just hunting for information to learn more about his work, now is just buying and selling. And I'm part of that of course.

I recently had a sort of overdose on Y!J myself. Even though I didn't buy that many pieces I still felt kinda sick just seeing all the stuff available that I even thought vaguely about buying, lol (I am now officially on hiatus at the moment). I guess consumerism comes with the territory for fashion anyway, the key is to be able to take a step back and settle into enjoying what you have, giving away and/or selling stuff that you don't wear much any more (or were only good ideas at the time you got them!) and focusing on being productive. I find that long periods of consumption really make me feel uncomfortable and unproductive so I always counter them by focusing on producing something and if the itch to buy something shows up, divert it into buying something for someone else. Picked up a Yohji skirt for my mum 'cos of this sort of thing...not to mention shopping for the wife.

As for Rex, I agree with your sentiment. While it is understandable that he is running a business, he should be aware of the fact that he can spoil his own market by being too mercenary with his approach. Anyway, I guess he is just another part of the fashion machine. Pretty sure things will revert back to normal by the end of the year when people move on to the next big fringe/authentic thing leaving those that discovered the brand due to the hype and got properly enamoured with it to stay behind and enjoy it going forward while he can move on and target the consumers of the next hyped designer.

I hope this hype also translates into money in Yohji's coffers .

In partially related news, I went for a fashion installation for a Nigerian designer recently and met a lawyer there who used to buy Yohji in the late 80s and early 90s! Was so stoked as he was the first Nigerian guy I had met that bought Yohji (even if it was decades ago). Had a good chat about that and he lamented not being able to wear Yohji again because of his job. I plan to tempt him into getting back into the game on the weekends though

 

[syed]



I find that long periods of consumption really make me feel uncomfortable and unproductive so I always counter them by focusing on producing something and if the itch to buy something shows up, divert it into buying something for someone else. Picked up a Yohji skirt for my mum 'cos of this sort of thing...not to mention shopping for the wife.

I think this is quite important. I'm not in a position to be able to afford most Yohji, but my brother fortunately is. I enjoy the hunt, and the work that goes into finding something that fits a specific bill, so the majority of the time I'm actually on the lookout for clothes for him rather than myself....and it's just as fun :tounge: If you're passionate about the clothes, I think there is a joy to be found in simply appreciating them and the work behind them. Of course in an ideal world we would be able to afford and wear exactly what we love, but to go to another extreme where you could buy anything and everything, I think you can end up losing a bit that passion and appreciation. Consumerist fatigue or whatever.

As for Yohji being hyped at the moment, I do think we are sort of at the high tide point, where there is just sooo much for sale and people buying snapping up anything without question, but it's all ebbs and flows. Soon the majority will move onto the next hype, and they'll end up selling a lot of what they've accumulated. Yes it sucks that this information being available is used for slightly greedy ends, but I think that is inevitable with any information being shared - there are always people who can profit from it. If anything I'd like to think threads such as this will help introduce people to Yohji's work, and even if they start out simply buying into the hype, if a few remain afterwards to develop an actual interest and love of the work, then surely that's a good thing?

But prices definitely have gone crazy on auction sites and what not...guess it'll just take me that much longer to build up a solid wardrobe

 

[Caveat]

I will play devil's advocate. If the items are available for peanuts, and your pockets are light, then why not flip them yourself? You're probably like me and don't want to deal with the hassle of all that. Buying things to sell them for a profit is just business. I don't see the problem.

If someone is using your photos to advertise their stuff then you have a beef. But if they are just posting lookbook photos and you think that they are using the list you made public to match the items to the lookbook, then I think you're overreacting. What is he supposed to do, not use the list you made available and search through the lookbooks manually out of respect for you? I doubt Yohji would be bitter about that in your position. If I didn't understand the situation correctly and it's something more nefarious that he's doing then I apologize.

Ivwri- Great post. You articulated a lot of the feelings I've been having.

 

[davidlee388]

and it was bought from rakuten for peanuts, it's not a secret that rex is being capitalizing all the effort made by some people e.g. the code list that asobu and me created some time ago, scanning old magazines etc, back in the day rex wasn't selling that much yohji compared to nowadays and his prices were much cheaper, thanks to the code list he could add runway pictures and upgrade his business and yet he won't tell you the truth. He's bidding on everything on yahoo and rakuten and then reselling it to the same people he's leeching info from. Not really fond of this behaviour myself.

i really regret sometimes making a lot of info widely available, there was nothing 8 years ago. Nowadays, with from japan and this artificial hype I can see loads of people just buying because is suddenly cool or straight closet cos players, funny that asobu and me we have the smallest pockets around and we can't even afford to buy **** from auctions anymore just some badly represented items. I feel like 90% of the pieces are not even seeing the light in the streets...which is extremely sad. All this consumerism is making me sort of sick, before we were just hunting for information to learn more about his work, now is just buying and selling. And I'm part of that of course.

I see where you are coming from Wire, I had been " victims " of Rex ( he adamantly and categorically denies ) making last min final bids to snatch items which were otherwise sleepers, or pushing the final winning prices up a lot thanks to his single sniper bids....

However for some people who are not used to bidding on Y! or buying from Rakuten, his stuff sold on FB and his eBay are still cheaper than what they have to pay full retail for in flagships and retailers, even in the sale. If those SS13 were bought for peanuts then all kudos to Rex for spotting them in the first place ( I certainly didn't see them, nor did I have time to look at a computer/phone screen for hours for YY ). To his defense, I have met Rex many times in his shop and he is a genuine Japanese fashion enthusiast trying to make a living from re-selling stuff he obtains from Japan or elsewhere. His clients are, I would say, 90% CDG and 10% YY although that ratio may be changing gradually. Every time I saw him he was always almost head-to-toe Yohji ( frankly he is too stocky to wear CDG ) so he is not just a businessman in that sense. He does have lots of passion for Yohji and Rei but people can't see it just from his FB and eBay.

We are all guilty ( myself in particular perhaps apart from you and Asobu ) of giving too much info away and I fully understand your sentiment since Rex seems to be just lurking in here without making any contribution to the thread. That's the downfall of any public domain or forum I suppose as shah had already touched on the subject of where-to-kop. Hopefully our small part of exposing Yohji to more people will result in a boost of his popularity which may result in more revenue going his way since some of these people may end up purchasing something in retailers/flagships.

 

[wireartists]

don't defend rex, he's just taking advantage of our passion, and is all good that he's passionate himself about it. But lately he's just being faster than anyone. And he never contributed **** btw, except when he posted his items for sale on SZ atchive with sz's and all....LAME

 

[wireartists]



I will play devil's advocate. If the items are available for peanuts, and your pockets are light, then why not flip them yourself? You're probably like me and don't want to deal with the hassle of all that. Buying things to sell them for a profit is just business. I don't see the problem.

If someone is using your photos to advertise their stuff then you have a beef. But if they are just posting lookbook photos and you think that they are using the list you made public to match the items to the lookbook, then I think you're overreacting. What is he supposed to do, not use the list you made available and search through the lookbooks manually out of respect for you? I doubt Yohji would be bitter about that in your position. If I didn't understand the situation correctly and it's something more nefarious that he's doing then I apologize.

Ivwri- Great post. You articulated a lot of the feelings I've been having.

Well, 8 years ago, I just jumped into fashion forums trying to show how good yohji was, it was pretty hilarious how people regarded his work back then. My only intention was paying my respects to his work. Also I met some of my best friends because of this, and to be honest that's the best collateral damage ever.

I'm not against reselling per se, fashion is just products after all. But we compilated that code list just to be able to find items from old collections, matching pants for a jacket etc, not for people asking 50% more when reselling. I think i can speak my mind and say it's making me sort of sad and angry.

It does becomes a problem when a a couple of guys just buy everything remotely interesting just to put it for sale later, y! right now is a jungle. I don't have to like it, and I don't have to like them using our work. The code list is still up right? so don't come and tell me that I want to keep it for my clique or some paying respects pantomime.

 

[dantebykiko]

Rex its proper ****. Don't care if he wears head to toe Yohji, probably its all flashy bullshit. If he its so supportive of Yohji's work, why he don't buy pre 00 items and promote them? Because he its scared that people will not buy it and its too much work. He likes to buy show pieces that attract customers.

I've caught myself buying a lot for the past 2 months, selling partly, partly to me and my gf. The money I make are going to support my gf final year and safe for me to be able to go and work for Dior over the summer and even try to work on both Yohji shows. I do this to be able to survive and I do it with effort. All the hours hunting stuff and all the late nights taking photos, so the garments can look good and spark some reaction for the person who wants to buy and never wore Yohji before.

Its big shame because I've got so much photos from early collections including the codes, reviews, editorials and ads that I will never post on internet. I don't need to say why, its obvious....

Have to agree with what Alfonso said... Most of the pieces are staying behind closed doors and never see light.

 

[wireartists]

anji timu, that's a respectable seller.

 

[davidlee388]



anji timu, that's a respectable seller.

I second that, he's a phenomenon, an egnima, a mystery.

@Kiko, I am sticking to my opinion about Rex's passion and personality. I've met him, spoken to him in depth many times. He's a passionate Yohji & Rei fan who happens to be a shrewd businessman as well who perhaps knows supply vs demand. Doesn't mean I like his business methods entirely, but that's life, and making a small business successful is pretty challenging, especially in a cut-throat, materialistic place like Hong Kong.

 

[dantebykiko]

Rex can go and have a battle with the African Yohji consumers that we saw on Youtube earlier. Who has more flashy Yohji. More embroidery, more naked girls, more buttons, more straps. **** that passion. If he respected Yohji's work he won't do what he its doing. Comme its different, though.. they don't care about fabrics and finishings, they make clothes from cheap boiled wool, so what doesn't sell got burned in the end of the season.

 

[Caveat]

I understand the frustration, but this is getting a little catty guys.

Is CDG boiled wool really cheap/bad material? I always wanted one of those coats.

Back on topic, I picked this up for a song from superfuture, although it hasn't arrived yet and I'm getting a little concerned. Anybody familiar with it that can tell me what season? It's apparently very slim because he said it fits a 46, but it's a size 3 so I just trusted yohji that it wouldn't be too slim for a 48.

 

[dantebykiko]

dibs if doesn't work out.

regarding comme. yes these days they use cheap materials for the prices they are charging. you paying for the design and concept rather than garment if that make sense. they just burn out everything left after the season, thats why there are not many "sample sales". just the DSM ones as they have quite different policy.

I understand the frustration, but this is getting a little catty guys.

Is CDG boiled wool really cheap/bad material? I always wanted one of those coats.

Back on topic, I picked this up for a song from superfuture, although it hasn't arrived yet and I'm getting a little concerned. Anybody familiar with it that can tell me what season? It's apparently very slim because he said it fits a 46, but it's a size 3 so I just trusted yohji that it wouldn't be too slim for a 48.

 

[xeraphim]

dibs if doesn't work out.

regarding comme. yes these days they use cheap materials for the prices they are charging. you paying for the design and concept rather than garment if that make sense. they just burn out everything left after the season, thats why there are not many "sample sales". just the DSM ones as they have quite different policy.

Going to have to argue otherwise:

Rei does not use "expensive" materials in her collections, but that was never what CDG was about to begin with. Does it make her garments any less inferior? I wouldn't think so. No doubt the CDG customer is paying for design and concept rather than garment - I'm assuming you mean fabric quality and overall construction here - but both designers operate in such different directions to allow for any proper direct comparison to be made. About burning out everything left after the season, where/who are you getting this from? I can't say for sure for Rei's stores in Japan - those stores barely have anything left by the end of the season to see a need for 'bulk disposal' - but I know for a fact that none of the other stores owned directly under her practice this, at least not in recent years (post-'06).

 

[dantebykiko]

Going to have to argue otherwise:

Rei does not use "expensive" materials in her collections, but that was never what CDG was about to begin with. Does it make her garments any less inferior? I wouldn't think so. No doubt the CDG customer is paying for design and concept rather than garment - I'm assuming you mean fabric quality and overall construction here - but both designers operate in such different directions to allow for any proper direct comparison to be made. About burning out everything left after the season, where/who are you getting this from? I can't say for sure for Rei's stores in Japan - those stores barely have anything left by the end of the season to see a need for 'bulk disposal' - but I know for a fact that none of the other stores owned directly under her practice this, at least not in recent years (post-'06).

I don't care what CDG stands for as its none of my interest. My comparison was in very different direction regarding the way someone resells clothing and how I don't see what he its doing being out of order for brand such as CDG. I'm far away from wasting my time stretching this discussion between Yohji and CDG.

I know from person who used to work there for 10+ years.

When I was in Tokyo there wasn't any signs of shelves been empty, the opposite I was sick of seeing CDG. In flagships and especially in 2nd hand clothing store where they had rooms dedicated to CDG.

 

[stadsvandringar]

Regarding anji timu, just thought I would stoke the rumor fires and add my own speculation. I'm fairly certain he's yohji shop staff. That's the only way to explain his getting very rare pieces, the knowledge and willingness to part with them for (sometimes) very low prices. There is a guy I know of at a resale shop in Tokyo specializing in Yohji that is in the same position and they also have quite a bit from the newer collections. Shop staff in Japan are required to wear the brand they're selling head-to-toe, so some may be sick of these things by the end of the season. They additionally have first access to the pieces and at a discount.

Again, just my speculation. He is a great seller though.