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whnay.'s good taste thread

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Manton, Jul 30, 2012.

  1. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    I hear ya, so do it right this time! You won't regret a simple red plaid on brown tweed. For what it's worth, Mariano Rubinacci owns many multiples of exactly that odd jacket.
     
  2. Victor Elfo

    Victor Elfo Well-Known Member

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    How do you fell about Mariano's outfit on this photograph?
    I ask this because I'm having a suit made up in light gray fresco (his jacket seems to be of fresco as well) and the idea of being able to don the jacket (with patch pockets, double stitching and drape) as an odd jacket have occurred to me.


    [​IMG]
     
  3. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    I would not replicate it. He was running around that day and took off his dark suit jacket because it was too hot. The jacket in the picture was laying around the workshop and he switched into it. Notice, it is orphaned from a suit. It's as good as it can be as a makeshift outfit, but not something to learn from.

    Well, I take that back a little. The shirt, tie, square and jacket pairing is truly inspired. Genius. If he were wearing the whole light grey suit, I'd say it was framable perfection.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  4. romafan

    romafan Well-Known Member

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    You should never own charcoal odd trousers? :confused: I'm aware of your disastaste for navy pants, but this is the first I'm hearing of a :foo: anti-charcoal dictum....
     
  5. aravenel

    aravenel Well-Known Member

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    I agree that's a fairly common staple tweed, and in fact, I plan on getting one someday. But it is definitely more distinctive than a basic herringbone, and I'm a big fan of going as soporific as possible for early wardrobe acquisitions--makes it much easier to wear multiple times a week if necessary without it looking like the only jacket you own.

    I love loud tweeds--I agree with you that they are tweed at its best. I just don't know that it's a good first odd jacket.

    Perhaps he shouldn't be looking at tweed at all for his first odd jacket--what about a navy blazer, perhaps with horn buttons?
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  6. bourbonbasted

    bourbonbasted Well-Known Member

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    Not a fan of grey odd jackets, especially mid-grey. Light on top, dark on bottom is tricky to execute tastefully and is creates more headaches than it's worth, IMO.

    I like foo's look a lot more than Mariano's here (minus the huge cuffs). He is able to keep the same cool, unoffensive palette (for consistency) while using the dark tie to really draw out the visual interest in the jacket's pattern.

    Edit: After foo's comment the picture makes a lot more sense.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  7. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    I have charcoal odd trousers. They are buried somewhere deep in my closet. I wish they didn't exist. Just knowing they're there bothers me.


    That's probably the most correct advice. In fact, if he's really starting from scratch, the best option is a navy suit with a jacket that can be worn as a blazer. Two for one, baby.

    But, as for first odd jackets, I think brown tweed with a classic pattern is a pretty safe choice. It pairs with so many things, is more interesting to play with than a navy blazer, and can be worn in virtually all instances (season permitting) where a blazer would work. If he's really digging the idea of tweed, I say go for it. Just go all the way and do it to the best effect.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
    1 person likes this.
  8. Patrick R

    Patrick R Well-Known Member

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    Watching the [​IMG] spin up anti-charcoal odd trouser posts is worth the price of admission.
     
  9. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    I cannot possibly be the first person on this forum to attack charcoal odd trousers. In fact, I know I'm not. It's just that my comrades are long gone. Hence the downward spiral of this thread. One man can only hold up the fort for so long, even when that man is foo.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
    2 people like this.
  10. recondite

    recondite Well-Known Member

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    LOL!

    Whatever you say.

    You clearly do not understand the principles of using contrasting and complimentary articles of clothing to enhance or camouflage different parts of a body for the purpose of appearing more attractive.

    Your dogma on style is not on principle or real outcome, but simply because you like the idea of it.

    You like a certain color "odd" trouser, simply because it could never be confused with trousers belonging to a suit; to wit, "wow nice pants, I guess he bought them so I would know they do not belong to a suit."

    Guess what? The trouser colors you dislike, serve a useful purpose whether orphaned from a J. Crew suit or purpose built as "odd" pants sans jacket by Ambrosi: they camouflage or attenuate the appearance certain body parts and disguise their appearance. Just like they do when part of a suit of similar color.

    To accept an idea only when it is applied to a suit, and denigrate the same idea when applied to trousers, is a special kind of ignorance.

    You do not like the idea that I presented, that these colored trousers serve a useful purpose for many, so you make an ad homimen argument against me, implying my ideas come from some source that is beneath one so worthy as yourself and your self perceived audience. Really?

    Unfortunately you have only revealed that you fail to understand the application of style elements as one might do to appear better and more attractive than one might otherwise; including wearing dark orphaned or purpose built trousers.

    While you understand the elements of style; e.g., color, cut, etc., you are ignorant of how to apply them in a useful manner and so revert to self imposed dogma.

    The result of your lack of understanding appears on the surface to be an unpleasant hubris that crosses the border deep into arrogance.

    I would like to thank you for your opinion, but it doesn't work for me or people that need to camouflage their lower half.

    Enjoy the day!
     
  11. recondite

    recondite Well-Known Member

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    The problem is Mariano's tie, which lacks needed contrast, not the color of the sport coat.

    A navy or black tie would supply the needed contrast and create an attractive look.

    It is a contrast failure, not a color failure. Not a jacket failure, but a tie failure.

    A tie lighter than the jacket almost never looks better than a tie the same tone or darker than the background or the jacket.

    Foo's outfit would look far worse, if his tie lacked contrast and was of a tone near to that of his jacket, like Mariano.

    FYI: Foo would look taller and longer if his shoes were nearer the tone and color of his pants.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  12. zeero3

    zeero3 Well-Known Member

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    I hope I'm not derailing, but I think this conversation would be beneficial to the lurkers and those in early-wardrobe-building mode like myself. I, and my pockets, LOVE the idea of being able to find a navy suit that can double as an odd jacket when switching the pants. The tough part about that is how one jacket can pull off those two different looks and do so successfully. Drawing on the principle that a suit can be dressed down easier than an odd jacket up (which I still agree with), I would START by trying to find a suit that would look fine as a suit while having the below blazer properties I've sketched out:

    Solid navy, SB, notch lapel, dual vents, 2 patch pockets, horn buttons, 3 or 2 buttons, soft shoulder, NOT worsted.

    The only thing that sticks out to me is the patch pockets and being not worsted. Finding this illusive suit on the cheap is tough. I think I'd have to cough up the dough and look towards someone like Kent Wang to make it up in something I can afford. I don't know how I feel about my first navy suit with notch lapels having patch pockets.......
     
  13. Claghorn

    Claghorn Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    I have a few other spread collar OC shirts with higher collar bands that I wear with odd jackets, but I don't have them on this computer

    And to bring up an unanswered aspect of my first question: are there any patterns or colors to avoid when getting non OC button down shirts?
     
  14. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    It wasn't an ad hominem attack. I was making a direct observation. Black cashmere overcoats, black and navy trousers, etc., are extremely odd things within classic menswear. That's not my rule. It's simply a rule I happen to know--and which understand the reasoning behind. If you want to understand that reasoning, sure let's chat. But you are coming from way out in left field with your suggestions. And yes, they do sound like they come out of 90's Banana Republic catalogue.

    You don't need dark colors to camouflage anything. Guess what: if you have a fat ass, it's going to look like a fat ass in black, navy, charcoal, purple, green, red, etc. The best way to flatter your fat ass is to get trousers properly cut for it. The best way to look good with a fat ass is not to worry about it so damned much and not let your body obstruct your style. There are plenty of men with irregular physiques that look fantastic even though nobody would ever mistake them for a toned athlete in their outfits.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
    2 people like this.
  15. DocHolliday

    DocHolliday Well-Known Member

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    I can tell you how I feel: It's a bad idea.

    Why would you want such a casual detail on what is meant to be a workhorse staple, especially with a limited wardrobe? Neither fish nor fowl, something like that.

    Would be of less concern if you have a solid charcoal notch, but do you really want to go to funerals in patch pockets?
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  16. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    Hmm. What do you mean by not worsted? A blazer should be made out of a worsted cloth. Were you thinking of a woollen flannel? That would make for a very odd blazer. Just wrong, actually. If you want a cloth suitable for a blazer with more texture, checkout hopsack. You will not find a RTW navy blue suit with patch pockets. Just isn't out there. A three-roll-two front is also rare. If you are stuck doing RTW, look for a navy suit with double vents with flapped pockets. Then, if the buttons aren't so already, switch them to brown horn. That will suffice. Otherwise, the only way to get a BlazerSuit like you describe is to get it MTM or bespoke. Don't worry about that if money is an issue. The flapped pockets will be fine.
    Uhh, I'm sure there are colors and patterns to avoid that wouldn't generally apply to all shirts. At first blush, I'm not sure why you'd think about a buttondown-collared shirt that much differently on account of the collar alone. I guess I'd avoid white.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  17. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    Eh. I hear ya, but I think they're alright. Remember, someone with only one suit is not likely to be in situations where people will judge him harshly for having more casual pockets than usual.
     
  18. DocHolliday

    DocHolliday Well-Known Member

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    I think Vox has like six of these.
     
  19. DocHolliday

    DocHolliday Well-Known Member

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    Same people aren't going to know flapped suit coat with brown buttons from a blazer, and that sin is much more venal. Better to have it right when it really matters.
     
  20. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    Vox has at least six of everything.


    Well, the point is sort of moot. Like I said above, I think if you are pressed by budget, you can do without the patch pockets. Nobody will look askance at a flap-pocketed blazer.
     

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