1. Welcome to the new Styleforum!

    We hope you’re as excited as we are to hang out in the new place. There are more new features that we’ll announce in the near future, but for now we hope you’ll enjoy the new site.

    We are currently fine-tuning the forum for your browsing pleasure, so bear with any lingering dust as we work to make Styleforum even more awesome than it was.

    Oh, and don’t forget to head over to the Styleforum Journal, because we’re giving away two pairs of Carmina shoes to celebrate our move!

    Please address any questions about using the new forum to support@styleforum.net

    Cheers,

    The Styleforum Team

    Dismiss Notice

Unfunded Liabilities: a/k/a The Cloth Thread

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Manton, Feb 10, 2008.

  1. bertie

    bertie Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    808
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2009
    Location:
    North of
    of course - we can negotiate :)
     
  2. jrd617

    jrd617 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    14,544
    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    

    We're talking about a range of $2.50 to $12.50 for extra handling charges on a 2.5 meter order. (3 to 15%) I really don't mind the extra $10 if it gets the order finished. Price of two cups of coffee.

    This is assuming that R&T even lets us pay for them to cut the cloth in-house. They seem to have bigger fish to catch and limited resources to allocate. (Selling to garment makers with big orders). Just wish they had made that more clear to begin with and not nodded approvingly to everything I proposed. Would have saved us this headache.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2014
  3. dopey

    dopey Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    14,577
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    
    I am not sure what you are asking. I contacted the person you told me to and still haven't heard back. Obviously, I now understand why.

    I have wondered how much the mills' reluctance to deal with individuals is because it is too much trouble, they don't need the extra sales, they have lockups with distributes, or whatever. It seems foolish and a remnant of a prior era where the end-users had no idea who they were or any interest in buying cloth direct. there is clearly a market for this and I am not sure why they aren't jumping on it. If it costs a little extra to deal with individuals, they should simply charge for it - say $10 per cut or something like that.

    And they are foolish if they think they are cannibalizing sales. This thread is witness to the fact that people who buy cloth, often do it because they like it. Buying this length does not mean I won't buy any more cloth.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2014
  4. jrd617

    jrd617 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    14,544
    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    ^ Yes, the R&T rep told me that she would send me specific payment contact details that I could pass along to everyone by late Monday. They didn't materialize by Monday. (There seems to have been time-lag for when R&T finally grasped that the cloth needed to be cut up and sent out to indviduals) You wanted to get ahead of the curve because of the Passover holiday so I gave you the email of the rep I had been corresponding with.

    Very frustrating that R&T suddenly became reluctant to sell to individuals because I communicated to the rep all along that it was going to individuals. They seem to think that selling to individuals will "cannibalize" resources from fulfillment of big orders to the garment industry.

    It would definitely benefit them to get cloth into the hands of forumites. Get their product out to new customers. Isn't Reid and Taylor kind of obscure compared to Huddersfield and Harrisons? Certainly a lot of menswear influence here - bespoke tailors (Despos and NMWA/Formosa) and individuals.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2014
  5. Wallcloud

    Wallcloud Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,398
    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2008
    Location:
    THE FUTURE
    I would certainly be willing to pay a surcharge to get this done.
     
  6. Slickman

    Slickman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,190
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2009
    I think R&T was bought by Indian company
     
  7. terrorsquad

    terrorsquad Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    884
    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2011
    Location:
    South East Asia
    Yup, this is what i was told
     
  8. johanm

    johanm Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    670
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2010
    I wouldn't be surprised if some tailor caught wind of this SF group buy and complained to Reid & Taylor.

    I know that Shirtmaven from CEGO has directly complained to Grandi & Rubinelli, among other shirting merchants, about forum members organizing direct group buys. It undermines the tailor's ability to add a markup on the cloth on top of the tailoring charge, and also forces them to compete with CMT tailors that might not have the scale or resources to offer the name brand fabric in question.
     
  9. mktitsworth

    mktitsworth Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,834
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2011
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Not that I'm in on this, but why not consider the option of having the whole roll of cloth shipped to someone and then asking a tailor known to the forum:

    1) Whether or not they would like to participate in the buy provided they have not previously heard about it.
    2) Whether or not they could point us to someone (perhaps themselves) who would be willing to cut the cloth for a surcharge to be divided amongst the buyers?

    This removes the R&T problem. Given that jrd is the one who has organized and dealt with the whole thing, I'd imagine him to be the person to have things shipped to, but this also puts him as the person handling the second part. If a tailor were willing to get in on it and cut the cloth for us, it seems reasonable also to have it shipped to them in this scenario.

    If they suddenly don't want to deal with getting payments from so many people, this sort of thing can be dealt with as well, but I think in this case it would be an indicator of a bigger problem for you.
     
  10. AdamWill

    AdamWill Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    255
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2012
    is there some kind of special not-immediately-obvious Tailor Magic involved in cutting rolls of cloth? because, you know, you'd think someone could rustle up a tape measure and a pair of scissors.
     
    1 person likes this.
  11. Cantabrigian

    Cantabrigian Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,741
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2006
    Location:
    London
    

    Srsly.

    Like if you really want to pay someone to do it, I'll do it.
     
  12. kulata

    kulata Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,834
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
  13. TM79

    TM79 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,806
    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2010
    Location:
    Boston
    

    Go for it and let us know how it turns out for you.
     
  14. NorCal_1

    NorCal_1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,367
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    these group buys would be a lot easier for the cloth companies if there was only one or two options for length, rather than 20 or 30 random individual lengths

    5 yards for suits, 3 yards for jackets and the cost of the extra cloth is the tarriff we incur for participating and making it easy for them to cut one standard size

    the other thing we could do as buyers is have the sections mailed in one shipment to the main organizer, who then parcels out the individual sections and mails them off

    a lot of work for the organizer, though, but makes it far easier for the cloth company and them more willing to do it
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2014
  15. edmorel

    edmorel Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    25,669
    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2006
    Location:
    NYC
    

    I have a jacket in that fabric, it looks a lot nicer in tumblr pics, which are probably touched up, then it does in person. I actually don't wear the jacket anymore.

    I have not read through all the posts on the special run so I may have missed something but if this is with Reid and Taylor, I'd be a bit cautious as they are in the middle of a liquidation, there books seem to be a bit of a mess, and I wouldn't be so quick to send them a ton of money right now.

    As to the person who asked what the big deal is with cutting up different lengths, I did something similar once here, purchased a large amount of fabric and then sold off 15 or so lengths. Its a gigantic pain in the ass and leads itself to mistakes when people are ordering in 1/4 yd/mtr increments, mistakes the seller has to eat.
     
    2 people like this.
  16. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    33,327
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Location:
    New York City
    

    I would think they don't want to do this because it is kind of screwing over their reps that work hard representing them and getting their books and cloth in tailor's shops.
     
  17. dopey

    dopey Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    14,577
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    
    This may be how they look at things, though if it is, they are mistaken. It is hard to imagine how Reid & Taylor's distributor or rep did anything to contribute to this sale, and 100m represents about 30 individual orders from tailors. that is not insignificant. The distributors are still useful, but if this is how customers wish to buy cloth, this is how mills should sell it. It is foolish to ignore changing demand patterns.
     
    1 person likes this.
  18. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    33,327
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Location:
    New York City
    I understand that logic, but then again looking at it in terms of a business relationship: Salesman X made us $100,000 last year and we did nothing other than have him to make those sales. Now here comes along a bunch of dudes on the internet wanting to buy directly from us. We could, but it takes effort on our part, they have demands, and furthermore what does this say to Salesman X who made us that sweet $100k last year? We don't value him any more? If you keep taking business away from the reps, then there won't be work for them anymore, they will stop being reps and the mill has to handle all requests themselves in the future. I just kind of see it as shooting themselves in the foot in a way.
     
  19. kulata

    kulata Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,834
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    
    Would really appreciate if you can share close up pics if you have any.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2014
  20. Slewfoot

    Slewfoot Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,503
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2008
    Location:
    New York
    Ugh. Sorry this got all messed up. These things are never as easy as they seem.
     
    2 people like this.

Share This Page

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by