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TOJ - updates on the debacle, complaints, news about other ventures, whatever.

Discussion in 'Streetwear and Denim' started by impolyt_one, Jan 7, 2011.

  1. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    -I agree with most of your post, but I don't feel that this is SF's responsibility to broker a solution between the customer and vendor. It would be helpful, but it isn't SF's responsibility.
     
  2. jim_n

    jim_n Well-Known Member

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    Charly said he has the list of the current batch from Dan.
     
  3. Distorbiant

    Distorbiant Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't trying to imply some sort of institutional responsibility on SF's part.
     
  4. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    Mediation(of which I have loads of experience in) to me is a borderline joke in this situation(as of right now.)

    -"Customers" and ToJ will be asked to agree to the mediator's decision before the process starts.
    -"Customers" have already agreed to a transaction which ToJ has not fulfilled.
    -"Customers" will then have to take ToJ at their word, again, that they will "do as they say."

    Mediation in this case is extra difficult as one party is located in a country where many of the "customers" don't reside(cross-border.)
    So basically, this thread(and I am just going by recent history) will become the "ToJ didn't adhere to the mediation agreement!"
     
  5. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    Understood......I was just painting broad strokes as to who the parties that need to come to a solution need to be(and who can help, but really are not under any obligation.)
     
  6. hokuto

    hokuto Well-Known Member

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    To break down this situation as simply as possible most of the outstanding customers want one of the following.

    1. To get their product regardless of how long it'll take
    2. To get their product by a certain date or otherwise get their money back
    3. Get their money back

    There are people who believe that more pressure on Drew will make him either a) ship more jackets, b) show more transparency, c) or change the company in some way that a and b happen like letting someone else in charge. With respect there are other people in this thread who feel this will make this worse.

    Since you'll never get everyone to agree, those of you who still have an outstanding order and want to get your product or money back should form a group and choose a representative, have that representative say to Drew, hey we want answers or all x of us are going to collectively contact Paypal to get our money back. There is power in numbers in that look at how much has happened from the spreadsheet alone.
     
    1 person likes this.
  7. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    :crackup:
     
  8. johanm

    johanm Well-Known Member

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    In this scenario, would Paypal refund everyone and then go after Drew, even though the dispute window is over? Is there precedent for this type of thing?

    If so, this would be an insane ending to the TOJ saga.
     
  9. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member

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    I'll try to take a picture later today. Also shown in that photo: Big John "Rare" jeans, slim tapered cut, sized up one, White Mountaineering sneakers, Lanvin and Steam Locomotive bracelets, fist of fury.
     
  10. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    First someone has to "contact" Drew and say that ABC will happen. The "contacting" drew part is rather difficult.
     
  11. hokuto

    hokuto Well-Known Member

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    Hey, it's not like I expect Drew to care just because people ask, hence the whole point of gathering everyone up for collective leverage. The point is collectively we hold a stick, not everyone wants to swing said stick as a large group of people would prefer there jackets/wallets/etc vs getting a refund. But at least threatening to swing the stick may at least be something Drew can't ignore.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ter1413 [​IMG]


    First someone has to "contact" Drew and say that ABC will happen. The "contacting" drew part is rather difficult.

    I'm sure if someone got this organized and said it to Charly, it'll would get passed on and it wouldn't be something he could ignore.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2014
  12. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    :rotflmao:
     
  13. hokuto

    hokuto Well-Known Member

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    /shrug we'll have to leave it to a difference of opinion, Paypal is overwhelming scaled to the buyer and if 20 or so people claim his company is a scam they'll close his account ending all of this spot reselling, which will snowball into a inability to offer refunds.
     
  14. klonowj

    klonowj Well-Known Member

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    There's obviously a systemic problem with production now. Whats with the instagram "updates" of shipped boxes that tries to pretend that everything is moving along. I remember that many June/July 13' orders were being delivered in winter/spring 2014. The spreadsheet even shows that some were tricking through before that in end of 2013.

    It doesn't look like they're all that close to finishing those orders yet, knowing that just those jackets have been in production for about a year now, its clear that a 1.5 year wait wont be close to the benchmark anymore.

    Is there really no one here that can persuade Drew to say something? I'm surprised that he would just ignore everyone here when hes so connected online. There are so many people here that will be understanding of whatever is going on and will keep waiting, but if people feel like they're just getting strung along and are waiting indefinitely they're just gonna give up and go elsewhere. I think depending on how this is handled, this will be a crucial point when people will decide to stick around or get out, so toj please say something. I'm waiting on a dr from July 2013, and will be waiting tentatively because I'm too damn tall and need the mtm, but if I didn't I would so be getting out and buying a phillip lim moto.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2014
  15. ninopwns

    ninopwns Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    Drew will surely post soon, g-guys
     
    2 people like this.
  16. Melbush

    Melbush Well-Known Member

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    That may sound like a stupid question but as of today, are they still making jackets? How many of them are produced every day/week/month?
    And would anyone have a rough estimate of how many jackets have to be made?
     
  17. Joona

    Joona Well-Known Member

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    It's already something like 20 - 40 F / -5 to + 5 C where I live and I'm wearing it with just a t-shirt and a crew neck wool knit, works fine for me at least. I've found MA-1 and A-2 both warmer than MDR (mostly because ribbings will keep the warmth better compared "open" sleeves/hem). If you plan to wear it when it's colder, you might want to size accordingly / allowing enough room for some extra layer.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2014
    1 person likes this.
  18. klonowj

    klonowj Well-Known Member

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    ^ Who knows. But at the current pace it seems to be taking about 10 months to get through a two month block of orders. This is on top of the 5-6 month wait when production was in the swing of things. Lead time is 16 months + and counting.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2014
  19. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    The only person that can answer that is not answering the requests for updates.......so:
    Yes......stupid question....
     
  20. ter1413

    ter1413 Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     

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