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Let's speak high end suits here

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Scabal Fanatic, Jan 25, 2013.

  1. chogall

    chogall Well-Known Member

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    The upside of those brand threads is that they come with brightly labeled minefields to read or to avoid.

    You are not incredibly short. Putin, Sarko, Bunga Bunga are all between 160-170cm.

    Or you meant the other body measurement...
     
  2. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    Can you covert that into American? I'm 5 feet and 4 inches. I'd convert it myself, but as an American I feel too lazy and entitled.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
    1 person likes this.
  3. GBR

    GBR Well-Known Member

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    +1

    So far the OP has not contributed anything whatever. Does he even have any suits matching the descriptor he uses I wonder?
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  4. Journeyman

    Journeyman Well-Known Member

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    If my mental arithmetic is correct, that means that you are about 162cm tall.

    Berlusconi is 165cm tall and Putin and Sarkozy are 169-170cm tall, so you're a bit under them (about an inch less than Berlo and 3-3.5inches less than Sarko and Putin).
     
  5. Millerp

    Millerp Well-Known Member

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    I think most would agree that the highest quality US factory made suit brand is Oxxford.
    Available OTR, MTM and for certain celebrities or VIPs they will do bespoke.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  6. jeff13007

    jeff13007 Well-Known Member

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    Oh hands down, i remember reading a quote somewhere from an interview with the head of Borrelli (i think) and he was asked if his was the best suits in the world and he answered they were the 2nd best and when asked who was the best he responded "oxxford". Their shirts were for a while made in the Kiton factory if I'm not mistaken as well.
     
  7. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    This is not really true. I was a "bespoke" client of Oxxford before switching to Rubinacci. And I was definitely not a celebrity. Anybody can do it--you just have to ask.

    Moreover, it's not really bespoke. It is really MTM, but with a basted fitting. As in MTM, someone takes your measurements, sends them somewhere else, and there a pattern is generated based off of a template. They put together a basted try-on for you and send it to the store you ordered the suit from. The salesperson or alterations tailor at that shop then notes tweaks to the suit in basted form and sends them back to the factory in Chicago, along with the suit. The factory interprets the tweaks and alters the suit, possibly altering your pattern itself.

    The pattern cannot be fine-tuned as in proper bespoke because the person fitting you is not the person altering the pattern. Theoretically, you can do as I did, and go directly to the factory to be fitted by Rocco, their tailoring director. However, he will just do as a salesperson at a shop would do, and pass his notes onto someone else who will alter the pattern. I'm not sure how much is done by hand versus simply tweaked on the computer. So, the benefit of seeing Rocco himself is limited. Moreover, it might even be a detriment. He's not really in the daily business of fitting individuals, so it's not his forte (I know this firsthand). A skilled, experienced salesperson used to dealing with Oxxford could be a better fitter.

    What you get at the end is more complicated, possibly more tuned, MTM--not bespoke.


    Have you inspected an Oxxford garment? Technically, they may have more hand-stitching than a Kiton or Borrelli. But the finishing and fineness of that hand-stitching tends to be markedly inferior. So, which is "better?" I think it's an academic, useless question. The issue is going to be what fits you better and what style you prefer. Who cares which factory-made suit has marginally more hand-stitching?

    If you really want to reap the benefits of a handmade product, you'll need to go bespoke. And that's why we stopped talking much about these high-end MTM products years ago. Everyone who could afford them realized they are a bad deal and there is far better stuff out there.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  8. Apollotrader

    Apollotrader Well-Known Member

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    +1000 BTW Foo, the wallet is exceptional.
     
  9. Millerp

    Millerp Well-Known Member

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    OK. Fair enough. I asked a salesman at the NYC store whether anyone could get a custom made suit
    like Oxxford did for George W. Bush. He laughed and said something like: "We give special attention to VIPs".
     
  10. mafoofan

    mafoofan Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that's just talking themselves up. Ignore it.
     
  11. TonyThe Tailor

    TonyThe Tailor Well-Known Member

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    All of my clients are VIPs to me :)

    In the past year my Oxxford business and my house MTM business has doubled mostly because people are looking for quality AND fit. My in house Bespoke could double, but I have a hard time finding sewers where I am located so I can only take on so much.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  12. Scabal Fanatic

    Scabal Fanatic Active Member

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    Well, there are my experiences. I recently got a bespoke sport jacket made of VBC Super 130, half-canvassed. I also got a pair of trousers also VBC Super 130, all in navy blue, (revenge).

    Also, I got 4 bespoke dress shirts 110 thread, 2-ply, Cotonificio Albini.

    In a couple of months, I'm going to get a 3 piece suit (charcoal), Scabal Super 150, fully canvassed, as part of my new higher end wardrobe. When winter comes, I'll get myself a nice wool trench coat, also bespoke from a respectable mill (TBD).

    Considering that I just stopped going into stores and got in tailoring my clothes, I find it a decent amount of items. [​IMG]

    Also getting a pair of C&J Lonsdale, black when going to NYC. Will switch between those and my AE Fifth Avenue.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  13. JubeiSpiegel

    JubeiSpiegel Well-Known Member

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    This thread is about to get good, I can feel it...
     
  14. jeff13007

    jeff13007 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you on your oxxford point Foo, and yes i have inspected an oxxford garment, He was just saying they were the best "American RTW" i was just agreeing and adding on a quote i remembered reading a while back, i never said oxxford was better than Kiton of Borrelli. As for your second point you are also correct but when you use the term "bespoke" its very misleading. You on one hand use one of the greatest tailors on earth with suits costing north of what Brioni or Kiton would cost so of course you would expect it to be better. On the other hand majority of the people here who talk about "bespoke" use tailors who are far inferior to said brands but take it as because they are "bespoke" they are immediately superior to any factory produced brand which is just not the case, which is why a thread like this might make sense because these brands are available for steep discount at times and lets be honest if you can find a Brioni suit that you can make fit you without major surgery for $1500-$2000 which is not really that much of a stretch, then there is NO WAY IN HELL you are finding "bespoke" in that price range that can even come close to the fabric quality, and handwork of Brioni.


    P.S I have used both Bespoke: Steed, NSM (dunno if this one is considered true bespoke as I'm not sure if Mina herself is making the pattern) as well as high end MTM, and yes Bespoke will give you a better fit but for someone like myself its only marginal as RTW already fits me pretty well so MTM using the same block patterns does the same. Most importantly though is that i had access to these tailors because i was living in NYC, now that I'm in Singapore i don't but i still do have access to Kiton and Brioni which would be my only go to if i wanted something on that level
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  15. chogall

    chogall Well-Known Member

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    pix or it didnt happen.

    its not short when u r taller than snooki in heels.
     
  16. jrd617

    jrd617 Well-Known Member

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    Desubscribed
     

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