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Hermes ties...huh?

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by FIHTies, Jul 12, 2004.

  1. FIHTies

    FIHTies Well-Known Member

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    For those that were following the hijacking of a previous thread to talk about the Lining of Hermes Ties, i wanted to share with you this response from the knowledgable staff at Hermes. This is the quote... >>> Dear Jonathan, Thank you for visiting Hermes.com. As I mentioned in my previous correspondence to you, our ties are 100% silk, which includes the lining.  We do not offer wool ties, wool-lined ties, wool blend ties or any ties made from "artificial material."  Again, thank you for your interest in Hermès. Sincerely, Sara Gergovich Internet Shopping SpÃ[​IMG]cialiste service@Hermes.com 800 441 4488 Original Message Follows: ------------------------ Message submitted by Jonathan --------------------- Hi: I emailed last week and got an answer not related to my question and although I emailed stating that my question still goes unanswered. Are your ties LINED with all wool, a wool blend or in an artificial material? This is impostant before I revisit the duty free shops at the airports and may affect many future sales. Please respond as soon as possible. Thank you in advance. JJF <<<
     
  2. FIHTies

    FIHTies Well-Known Member

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    Just emailed the following... Lets see what happens [​IMG] >>> Sara: Thanks for your response its always great to get timely emailed responses, and I am sorry to bother you yet again, however I need you to check again. Its quite impossible that the ties are lined with silk as only seven fold ties are lined with silk and the hermes ties are not seven fold ties. Indeed if you touch a Hermes tie you feel a distinct lining under the silk. Please check with the company and get back to me what exactly does Hermes use for the LINING of their ties. The sooner the better. Thanks again for all your help. JJF<<<
     
  3. marc237

    marc237 Well-Known Member

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    Do you think there is any possibility whatsoever, no matter how remote, that she feels any embarassment, even the tiniest smidgen, for using the title &quot;SpÃ[​IMG]cialiste&quot;?
     
  4. faustian bargain

    faustian bargain Well-Known Member

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    maybe she's a french canadian with divided loyalties. [​IMG]
     
  5. bengal-stripe

    bengal-stripe Well-Known Member

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    Aren't we confusing here two different terms: lining and interfacing. Lining is the shiny bit, which you see at either end; interfacing is the fluffy stuff running through the tie and giving body and volume to the tie.

    The lining in Hermes ties is a color-coordinated, plain fabric (other manufacturers have their name/logo woven into the lining fabric). I have no doubt that this is silk, although I have run no tests (wouldn't know how).

    The interfacing can be wool or synthetic but I assume that it also can be made from silk. I don't know for certain and I have no intentions of pulling my Hermes ties apart. But, just like the canvas in a suit it is interfacing, not lining.
     
  6. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member

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    I believe that Bengal Stripe is correct. All good ties are silk lined, as far as I understand. Only Sevenfolds or five folds are &quot;self-lined.&quot; Perhaps therein lies the confusion. The interfacing used to give the tie body is something else altogether.
     
  7. FIHTies

    FIHTies Well-Known Member

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    Sorry guys. First off, I am pretty sure that this woman is clueless to what I am asking. Â She speaks with an authority by telling me that there is no wool AT ALL in their ties. Â regarding the interfacing vs lining, as mentioned before, most ties have three main parts. Â The Tie itself, the Lining (your "interfacing") that gives it body and what Bengal Stripe calls the "Lining". Â The main purpose of this Lining is to keep the interfacing from falling out, hence in a seven fold this piece is absent as there is no separate Interfacing. Usually the Lining is NOT made of Silk, unless its a silk that is the same as the tie itself, which is done for Aesthetic purposes, and has no increased functionality in keeping the tie in. Â This is known as Self Tipping. Â Some companies have a signature Satin or Poly 'lining with their name or Logo on the back. Â I dont believe that this lining even a signature one is silk even on the best of ties. I could very well be wrong however as I dont have any of them in front of me at this moment I ask you to check yourselves. Â It will be a simple test. Â Does the front of the tie feel like the back. Â If it does, its silk. Â If it does not then its not [​IMG], unless of course you are wearing a polyester tie... . Â I am pretty sure on the Hermes ties that I saw in the Duty Free shops had a synthetic polyester backing. But neither here nor there our "Specialiste" is clueless as to the construction of ties and I think that her answer clearly maintains that there is NO WOOL NOR ANY BLEND AT ALL anywehre in Hermes ties. Still waiting for her response to the second email. JJF
     
  8. Will

    Will Well-Known Member

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    Don't be too hard on the Hermes person. :)

    Though I've never taken one apart, I understand (see Roetzen's book) that all silk Hermes ties use silk for the lining. They are not, however, seven fold construction but pieced.

    Will
     
  9. FIHTies

    FIHTies Well-Known Member

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    Will...Lining or Interface? Can we clarify terms here please [​IMG] Also...do we have a volunteer for a Hermes Dissection please? JJF
     
  10. hermes

    hermes Well-Known Member

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    i have a large number of hermes ties and they all have a silk lining - i'm referring to material on the back side of the tie, not any interfacing that isn't seen

    i've also never seen a wool hermes tie, all their ties are either woven silk or a printed silk (hermes stores, even duty free hermes stores i've been in, catagorize the display of their ties as such, one section is printed silk, another is woven silk)

    off the top of my head, all the printed silk ties have solid coloured silk back lining and the woven silk ties have a coordinating woven 'H' pattern silk back lining

    what is in the middle, i have no idea nor am i willing to cut one open

    i realize that this in no way answers your question but hey, whatever
     
  11. PeterMetro

    PeterMetro Well-Known Member

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    I could end every one of my posts with this. Basically sums up my feelings towards posting.
     
  12. TCN

    TCN Well-Known Member

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    (Will @ 12 July 2004, 4:37) Don't be too hard on the Hermes person. :) Though I've never taken one apart, I understand (see Roetzen's book) that all silk Hermes ties use silk for the lining. They are not, however, seven fold construction but pieced. Will
    Will...Lining or Interface? Can we clarify terms here please [​IMG] Also...do we have a volunteer for a Hermes Dissection please? JJF
    If someone sends me the tie, I'll gladly do the cutting. [​IMG]
     
  13. Will

    Will Well-Known Member

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    FIHTies,

    Hermes ties are self-tipped, meaning both back and lining, and made from an unusually heavy silk.

    The thread originator didn't ask about the interfacing, and I don't know why he (or anyone not a tie manufacturer) would care since they are not seven fold ties whether they have an interface or not. They are made from several, rather than one, piece of silk.

    Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than I can provide more detail about the interface.

    Will
     
  14. FIHTies

    FIHTies Well-Known Member

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    You guya are killing me.  Gotta be up soon...

    I was actually the originator of the thread.

    The importance of the interfacing is how the tie snaps back after each wear.  In a nutshell.  All wool when dealing with a regularly constructed tie is considered better as it reassumes  the shape the tie is supposed to have.   Easily creasable synthetics will keep the tie creased or only reassume the original shape after much time.  The best way to deal with tie creases is to hang the tie and let the gravity of the tie work its way and come back to shape.  In some ties due to their creae factor that wont happen for some time. In fact if a tie manufacturer cares about the interfacing it should only be because the end user will care and that is true in this case.  I can tell from experience (as a tie retailer) that it makes a difference.

    Now we have a difference of opinions between Jcusey and Will who have both been in the intestines of Hermes ties.  Jcusey says they are wool.  Will says they are silk.

    Anyone else?

    PS:  I am really wondering if the Duty Free shops quality is in any way one of a lesser level.  Anyone know? ALso, will...You have Hermes Ties that are Heavy? Is that the woven group? I thought Hermes specialty was prints
     
  15. LabelKing

    LabelKing Well-Known Member

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    Duty Free shops sell the exact things that are sold in the boutiques or department stores. They are not like outlets which may have problematic merchandise, etc.

    Hermes ties are not exactly heavy; they are a printed silk, and tie a fine knot in my opinion. They have wovens if I am correct with the H's, and such.
     
  16. Will

    Will Well-Known Member

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    FIHTies,

    I think I was mis-read. :)

    I said they are self-tipped and that I did not know, nor care, what the interfacing is or if Hermes uses one.

    According to The Book of Ties, Hermes uses silk that's some number of mommes heavier than most of the tie-making industry.

    From personal experience I will say that, print or woven, they knot very well over and over for years without creasing, unlike, for example, my Barberas and Borrellis.

    Will
     
  17. kalra2411

    kalra2411 Well-Known Member

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    Does what the tie look like even matter to you?. [​IMG] You seem to be too bothered with how it is made, if it is an Oxford Union Tie, and seven-fold, I would still not be caught dead wearing it [​IMG] If it 'drapes' well, why does it matter, the essence of quality should be how it looks, not connoted by weather or not the interfacing is silk. [​IMG]
     
  18. jcusey

    jcusey Well-Known Member

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    It matters because it imacts the longevity of the tie. There's more to a good tie than just looks.
     
  19. kalra2411

    kalra2411 Well-Known Member

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    (kalra2411 @ 12 July 2004, 6:55) If it 'drapes' well, why does it matter, the essence of quality should be how it looks, not connoted by weather or not the interfacing is silk.
    It matters because it imacts the longevity of the tie. There's more to a good tie than just looks.
    I see, I did not realise that. I do understand that a better construction normaly means a better looking garment, however in the case of ties; I will always go for looks as the main factor. I can just buy a new one.
     
  20. hermes

    hermes Well-Known Member

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    the weight difference between an hermes woven silk and a printed silk isn't as much as i thought - i simply did a weight and feel test in my hands and although there is likely a bit of more heft to the woven ties, the printed silk ones are pretty thick

    i agree with Will above, both the printed and the woven knot very well, drape very well and i have no issues with post use creasing or damage and the longevity of the ties is amazing, they hold up

    and for labelking, the variety of woven ties is on par with the printed silk ones - everything from multi-coloured regiment stripes to modern dot matrix weaves, usually more complex patterns than the printed ones, which tend to be more whimsical patterns involving dancing animals or objects and the like

    and labelking is also correct, the product you find in hermes duty free stores is the exact same thing as in the actual hermes stores, there are no such things as 'seconds' with hermes goods

    and although this still doesn't answer the riddle of what's between the layers of silk, look at it this way, hermes doesn't skimp on their product, from their packaging to their clothes, it's all top notch material and as such, it can likely be deduced that whatever is used for interfacing, it's likely of very good quality
     

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