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Dress and elitism

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by poorsod, Jun 2, 2006.

  1. The False Prophet

    The False Prophet Well-Known Member

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    Mar 10, 2006
    Location:
    Brisbane, Australia
    I think at some base level its really an environmental question. What do you want to see when you are out in America? Its depressing to see on any given day or location the sheer amount of slob everywhere.(clothing and architecture) I don't think its elitist to have that basic visual assessment, but I do believe aesthetically, most could do better.

    As Gandhi said, be the change that you want to see in the world...
     
  2. JLibourel

    JLibourel Well-Known Member

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    If you go on the streets of Rome, New York, London, Sydney or Beijing you see people wearing the same t-shirt and jeans as though it were a proscribed industrial uniform.

    It may just have been a slip of the keyboard, but if not, I suggest you learn the difference between "prescribed" and "proscribed." Few things would gladden my old heart more than to see T-shirt and jeans proscribed![​IMG]
     
  3. sloaney

    sloaney Well-Known Member

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    Jun 18, 2006
    this thread reminds me of when my grandfather, after working out in the yard all day, decided to go buy a car, wearing overalls and no shoes. he visited several dealerships with a paper grocery bag full of cash, and bought a new mercedes benz (paying full sticker price) from the first person who acknolwedged his existence. I think it was the 3rd or 4th dealership he went to.

    It seems to me that I'd rather dress appropriately, be served immediately, and be able to complete the transaction without visiting four dealerships.
     
  4. hobo

    hobo Well-Known Member

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    Mar 11, 2006
    Of course, I also read an article a few years ago (in Forbes I believe) that pointed out that the only people who are still wearing suits are those of us who have to work for a living. They made the claim that you could spot middle-class people by the fact that they were still wearing suits and ties while the truly rich (upper-class) have moved away from that and wear mostly casual clothes (albeit expensive clothing) on a day-to-day basis.

    It clearly wasn't talking about what people wear to special events, but specifically for going about their day-to-day business.

    Definitely made me wonder...

    Sounds like an interesting article. I wonder if it is around anywhere online to read.
     
  5. MrRogers

    MrRogers Well-Known Member

    Messages:
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    As a 26 year old I find the movement towards casual (read slovenly) dress very disappointing. I was reading through one of Flussers texts this weekend and he recounted a time, several decades prior, in which the New York Times offices first allowed sportcoats as suitable daily dress in liu of a suit and the controversy among the staff that resulted.

    Contrast that to today when memo's need to be sent out to professionals reminding them that flip-flops are not suitable to see patients in.

    My question is, where can we really go from here??? Is a return to formality even possible?

    Somedays, I think fondly of a time in the distant future when I can dress as I do now and not receive stares or inquiries from others as to why I am dressed nicely on that particular day.

    MrR
     
  6. DGP

    DGP Well-Known Member

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    If the point is simply that one can get an ivy league education without learning how to dress well, that's certainly true. (Though both my fraternity and career services at Dartmouth offered education on the subject).



    Tru dat. Just look at 99.9% of the professors at any such institution, many of whom probably attended a similarly ranked university, and you will understand quite well [​IMG]. I've heard Alan Dershowitz lecture several times at public forums, and I can tell you, a worse dressed person would be hard to find. However, if, God forbid, I am ever accused of stabbing my wife and her boyfriend to death (hell, I already own several pairs of Bruno Maglis [​IMG] ), there is nobody I'd rather have at my defense table!
     
  7. muelleran

    muelleran Well-Known Member

    Messages:
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    Apr 24, 2006
    Location:
    Zurich
    As a 26 year old I find the movement towards casual (read slovenly) dress very disappointing. I was reading through one of Flussers texts this weekend and he recounted a time, several decades prior, in which the New York Times offices first allowed sportcoats as suitable daily dress in liu of a suit and the controversy among the staff that resulted.
    MrR


    I think it is a hallmark of our generation that we find the movement towards casual disappointing (I'm about 10 years older than you).
    The generation before us was quite different, just imagine your statement coming from someone who was 26 in 1968. My uncle (who was at college in the late 60's) showed up at my sister's wedding wearing a leather jacket and jeans. He still has an issue with conservative clothes and what they stood for in his days. These guys don't know how to dress and they can't care less.
    Our generation does not have such an issue - if anything we have an issue with the ex hippies. In Germany at least we have an issue with our former ex-hippie teachers. Many of us believe they did not do us a good service with their "womb your inner child" attitude.
     
  8. DGP

    DGP Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,100
    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2006
    As a 26 year old I find the movement towards casual (read slovenly) dress very disappointing. I was reading through one of Flussers texts this weekend and he recounted a time, several decades prior, in which the New York Times offices first allowed sportcoats as suitable daily dress in liu of a suit and the controversy among the staff that resulted.

    Contrast that to today when memo's need to be sent out to professionals reminding them that flip-flops are not suitable to see patients in.

    My question is, where can we really go from here??? Is a return to formality even possible?

    Somedays, I think fondly of a time in the distant future when I can dress as I do now and not receive stares or inquiries from others as to why I am dressed nicely on that particular day.

    MrR



    Here is what I really take issue with in your post: you equate casual to poorly dressed. I think there is well-dressed formal and sloppy formal, and the same is true for casual. flip flops and cargo pants are casual, but sloppy. However, well-fitted, designer jeans and a pair of dress boots are casual, but far from sloppy. I think that for well-dressed people, be they casual, business-casual or ultra formal, the transition between casual and formal is pretty easy, they have a good eye for what is "in" in terms of formality. It is the poorly dressed crowd in general that has the problem, not the crowd that simply chooses to dine at the Palm in jeans.
     

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