1. Welcome to the new Styleforum!

    We hope you’re as excited as we are to hang out in the new place. There are more new features that we’ll announce in the near future, but for now we hope you’ll enjoy the new site.

    We are currently fine-tuning the forum for your browsing pleasure, so bear with any lingering dust as we work to make Styleforum even more awesome than it was.

    Oh, and don’t forget to head over to the Styleforum Journal, because we’re giving away two pairs of Carmina shoes to celebrate our move!

    Please address any questions about using the new forum to support@styleforum.net

    Cheers,

    The Styleforum Team

    Dismiss Notice

Ask Me About Magic

Discussion in 'Entertainment, Culture, and Sports' started by Nouveau Pauvre, Sep 18, 2008.

  1. Nouveau Pauvre

    Nouveau Pauvre Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,563
    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Location:
    East Coast
    Fixed. [​IMG]
    [​IMG] .....just wait till we have a magic-off!
    the stuff where david blaine balances on a 100 foot pole for a couple of days, or is underwater for a few days or living in a box for a month, that is not illusory tricks anywhere, just plain old him bearing it out and doing it? these are not just magic tricks but just endurance tests , no? what i dont get is if these are actual endurance tests, he should be breaking some world records or setting them, but they dont go in to guiness world records, so that implies to me there is some trickery involved. no?
    Indeed. Most of Blaine's physical feats have been genuine. There is a long tradition of magicians mixing feats of physical prowess and endurance with magic. This first really came in to the public eye with Houdini. IT's a cool area but one Ihaven't really explored.
     
  2. T4phage

    T4phage Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6,117
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Location:
    sage
    I've never read Barker - he is a horror writer? I do enjoy some Steven King, so give me a good specific title to read. Carter Beats The Devil has been on my to-do list. Maybe I'll finally pick it up this weekend....
    Yes, Barker is a horror/fantasy writer (remember the character "pinhead"?). He has several books which revolve around the 'Art'. One his novels that I am rather fond of is called "The Thief of Always".
     
  3. bbaquiran

    bbaquiran Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,101
    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2007
    Are the animals ever injured/killed as part of a trick? (Like in The Prestige where the bird is crushed in the collapsing cage).
     
  4. Nouveau Pauvre

    Nouveau Pauvre Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,563
    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Location:
    East Coast
    Are the animals ever injured/killed as part of a trick? (Like in The Prestige where the bird is crushed in the collapsing cage).

    The death of animals used to be a common motif in magic. There was a particularly gruesome effect where a picture of a chicken would be stabbed in the neck, causing a nearby, actual chicken to die.

    This was gone by the mid twentieth, largely due to changing public sensibility. Nowadays great precautions are taken to make sure everything remains humane for animals in magic.
     
  5. Artisan Fan

    Artisan Fan Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32,345
    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2006
    Which do you like better as a movie...The Prestige or The Illusionist?
     
  6. Artisan Fan

    Artisan Fan Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32,345
    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2006
    Also, what do you think of Uri Geller?
     
  7. Dedalus

    Dedalus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,656
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2007
    Location:
    Internet
    The death of animals used to be a common motif in magic. There was a particularly gruesome effect where a picture of a chicken would be stabbed in the neck, causing a nearby, actual chicken to die.

    Oh man, that would be so sweet to watch. Do you know how that was done or if there is any footage of said trick?
     
  8. Cravate_Noire

    Cravate_Noire Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,994
    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2007
    Have you ever used magic to do what is advertised in a big number of spam e-mails, without a surgery?
     
  9. Nouveau Pauvre

    Nouveau Pauvre Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,563
    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Location:
    East Coast
    Which do you like better as a movie...The Prestige or The Illusionist?
    I prefer the Illusionist. Which is odd because i'm a huge fan of the whole Nolan clique (Christian Bale, Micheal Caine e.t.c. The Illusionist is just a very fun, beautifully shot fantasy piece. Paul Giamatti always steals the show and Ed Norton is excellent. The Prestige, which started out very well, ended up toppling under the weight of it's sci-fi conceit. Still both are well worth a watch.
    Also, what do you think of Uri Geller?
    Mixed opinions. I have a lot of respect for his success and think he was a great performer. On the other hand, I find the ethics of the situation unfortunate - I think it's very wrong to claim genuine psychic powers. ...still I almost feel as if the people who got duped, deserved it.
     
  10. Nouveau Pauvre

    Nouveau Pauvre Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,563
    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Location:
    East Coast
    Oh man, that would be so sweet to watch. Do you know how that was done or if there is any footage of said trick?
    Haha, no. The performances of effects like this predate television/cinema.
    Have you ever used magic to do what is advertised in a big number of spam e-mails, without a surgery?
    I've thought about it, but who really needs a wand bigger then 8 inches anyway? [​IMG]
     
  11. Artisan Fan

    Artisan Fan Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    32,345
    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2006
    I've thought about it, but who really needs a wand bigger then 8 inches anyway? [​IMG]

    Your momma. [​IMG]

    Sorry, could not resist.
     
  12. Reggs

    Reggs Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,528
    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2006
    Location:
    The Internet
    the stuff where david blaine balances on a 100 foot pole for a couple of days, or is underwater for a few days or living in a box for a month,

    that is not illusory tricks anywhere, just plain old him bearing it out and doing it? these are not just magic tricks but just endurance tests , no?

    what i dont get is if these are actual endurance tests, he should be breaking some world records or setting them, but they dont go in to guiness world records, so that implies to me there is some trickery involved. no?


    On Penn's old radio show he talked about he always assumed that magic was involved in some way to help Blane do his stunts.

    Penn said to a newspaper or something that he probably had a way to eat and drink via magic when he was in a glass box for a few days. He recalled in his radio show, after this hit the press, Blane saw Penn at some event, took him aside and said very seriously that it was "all real."
     
  13. NaTionS

    NaTionS Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,216
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    I would say right now I'm doing about %70 original material and %30 other peoples. MY goal is more like %90 mine %10 others. It is quite difficult to create original, strong magic but it is also much more rewarding to perform.

    Do magicians share their secrets with each other or are they secretive as well? Do magicians ever try to find out how someone else's trick is done? Like if Magician A comes up with an amazing trick, do other magicians try to spy on him or kidnap him and torture him until he gives up the secret?
     
  14. Nouveau Pauvre

    Nouveau Pauvre Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,563
    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Location:
    East Coast
    Do magicians share their secrets with each other or are they secretive as well? Do magicians ever try to find out how someone else's trick is done? Like if Magician A comes up with an amazing trick, do other magicians try to spy on him or kidnap him and torture him until he gives up the secret?

    It really depends. At the high end stuff is largely proprietary but even just below the top rung, a lot of magicians share secrets, teach classes, publish books, videos etc. There is generally not much of a fuss about stealing and performing secrets but more stealing someone else's lines and scripts.

    Also a lot of magicians get very upset when other magicians publish a secret they think is theirs - not because the secret is out - but because they did not get credit.
     
  15. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,187
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2008
    Location:
    Central Europe
    ITT: Ask a magician about magic!

    Inspired by RJMan's question from the Magic Castle thread. Any questions you guys have feel free to post.

    (Yes I am really a magician. No I do not do kid's birthday parties or have a bunny.)

    What are your views on (Mutational) Alchemy? (Thanks for the past answers, btw- they were quite good if not too informative, maybe my questions were a bit difficult.) What do you think of the Yi Ching in comparison to the Tai Hsuan Ching, then?
     
  16. oDD_LotS

    oDD_LotS Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    458
    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2004
    Location:
    West Virginia/Ohio
    I like the ES Andrews theory. I'm partial to anagrams. Were you in to sleight of hand stuff like that? Gambling and stuff?


    Nah, I was way too uncoordinated for much in the way of sleights. I mostly did the stuff that was profitable in my area--traditional stage/parlor with an emphasis on kids stuff. I had a lot of old-school Mak props, silk and rope effects, and usually 2-3 "illusionettes" (like the French Arm Chopper) to wrap up my little 45 minute thing.

    Eventually I had one or two chances to try my hand at grand illusion (which was always my passion). I'd love to really work on some of the better sleights and flourishes, though. God knows I've got enough McBride, Ammar, and L&L videos.
     
  17. Nouveau Pauvre

    Nouveau Pauvre Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,563
    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Location:
    East Coast
    What are your views on (Mutational) Alchemy? (Thanks for the past answers, btw- they were quite good if not too informative, maybe my questions were a bit difficult.) What do you think of the Yi Ching in comparison to the Tai Hsuan Ching, then?

    I don't want to be snarky because I love mysticism, especially that of eastern culture - I just happen not to believe in any of it. I find it a rich vein for performers such as myself - and a valuable source of history and cultural context.

    I especially like the Yi Ching - I'm working on quite a creepy liitle marvel for my close-up performances involving them.

    While I work very hard at my magic - I use solely sleight of hand, misdirection, psychology and hypnosis to accomplish everything you see. I study and perfect things for literally years to make it look exactly like real magic - but none of it is.
     
  18. Tangfastic

    Tangfastic Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,358
    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Location:
    Bristol
    Are you familiar with Tommy Cooper? Search you tube for clips. If people are having to add comedy to their acts he's well worth watching, though is style is unrepeatable.

    Living in the UK I'm familiar with Derren Brown who you've mentioned as an influence. I really wonder at the ethics of what he does - he clearly has a powerful affect on people, but I can see hardly any positive applications. I believe he has a somewhat shady past too. Also, if you've seen any of his tv shows, am I right in thinking the insights he gives into how he achieves his results are either only a very small part of the story or a complete bluff?

    I remember one 'trick' where he commissioned 2 pretty obnoxious 'creative' advertising executives to come up with a graphic design for a bogus firm of his. He stunned them by having guided them both to the same image, claiming on the tv to have achieved this through a staged car journey taking in certain influential sights. I could see how this could work to some degree, but felt if the stunt was real there was a lot more going on.

    The problem with magic on tv is we expect to be deceived.
     
  19. Nouveau Pauvre

    Nouveau Pauvre Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,563
    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Location:
    East Coast
    ^ Tommy Cooper was a great performer. Really hilarious in that eccentric British way. Derren Brown has written at length about the ethics of his work and I find it very enlightening especially as I move more towards this arena of performance. He explicitly states at the beginning of each performance that everything is done by misdirection and psychology. I find his performances meet a high ethical standard, and he has done a lot of positive work regarding rationalist and skeptical thought (especially with his System television special). I do not quite see how "expecting to be deceived is a problem" with magic on television. Much of it has to do with context - we must view this sort of thing as solely entertainment. Some performers definitely do engage in unfortunate ethics, including, unfortunately, some pretty well regarded ones here in the states.
     
  20. merkur

    merkur Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,907
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2008

Share This Page

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by