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Deceptive Shoe Advertising by Brooks? - Page 2

post #16 of 28
My earlier post contradicts what I posted on this thread. I am inclined to believe what I wrote earlier, because I had asked Alan about it. At least that had the benefit of being hearsay. What I wrote today was merely from memory.
post #17 of 28
Thread Starter 
As I understand the matter from previous posts in these fora, Peal folded in 1969, whereupon Brooks bought the name, etc. Edward Green was the first vendor for the Brooks Peals, then Crockett & Jones, now Sargent. From what I gather, some of the C&J Peals have been in inventory and offered for sale until very recently. Admitedly, this is just the impression I have had from reading posts on earlier threads here and on the AAF, so I can't vouch for their correctness.
post #18 of 28
Quote:
As I understand the matter from previous posts in these fora, Peal folded in 1969, whereupon Brooks bought the name,
I think you mean 1959? Peal was already sold at the Madison Avenue Brooks store by 1963.
post #19 of 28
I have no reason to doubt BB's claim and that they introduced the name Peal to the American audience in 1953. I was told (although I don't know for certain) that the bespoke shoemakers Peal & Co closed down somewhere in the early sixties. It is quite possible (again, I don't know) that Peal in London also sold ready-to-wear shoes (many bespoke firms did: Wildsmith, Alan McAfee, Maxwell.) Had BB not gone for Peal, they might have settled for one of the other names mentioned. Maybe they even negotiated with John Lobb first, but did not come to an arrangement. So in 1953 Peal gave BB the permission to sell a ready-to-wear range in the States. Obviously an arrangement beneficial to both parties: Peal got money and BB some old-world cachet. This might have simply been a licence of the name or, at this point, the firm had control of designs and the use of manufacturers; i.e. sold the range wholesale to BB. When Peal went under, I believe it was Foster in Jermyn Street who bought the lasts and also has use of the Peal logo, just as BB has. Whether the shoes produced under the Peal name today have any resemblance to the real McCoy, I have no idea. Designs for clothing or shoes change with fashion and Peal shoes, were the firm still in existence, would be different today than from the 1950s. I presume that over the years BB has changed manufacturers quite a few times. As there are considerable costs involved in making a new set of lasts, they might have been made on whatever lasts the different manufacturers hade in stock already. Alfred Sargeant, EG or C&J will make shoes to the specifications of the firm that places the order. Maybe the buyer in charge of the Peal collection at BB today, has a sense of history and is very particular in his specifications, or maybe he does not care about that. Bottom line in any commercial environment is the question whether or not it sells.
post #20 of 28
Quote:
When Peal went under, I believe it was Foster in Jermyn Street who bought the lasts and also has use of the Peal logo, just as BB has.
Really? I was just in there a few weeks ago, and they told me they use the Foster's logo and the Maxwell logo, but they didn't say anything about Peal. They had the other two names all over the shop, however. Perhaps they sold it at some point?
post #21 of 28
Fantastic, bengal. Thanks. One note: I believe Maxwell did not offer RTW until several years ago. That's what they claimed at least.
post #22 of 28
Quote:
One note: I believe Maxwell did not offer RTW until several years ago.  That's what they claimed at least.
Maxwell has been part of Foster's for several years now. I'm not sure when they bought it. I remember going into the old Maxwell's in Mayfair some time in the early 90s. But it's been part of Foster's for at least five years.
post #23 of 28
Quote:
Really?  I was just in there a few weeks ago, and they told me they use the Foster's logo and the Maxwell logo, but they didn't say anything about Peal.
I have a Foster & Son leaflet right in front of me (a few years old) where they use the Peal logo - a fox with a riding boot hovering above the animal - that's the same logo BB still uses and Peal had in its shoes. Foster & Son has integrated this design with their name but does not use the name of Peal. I believe (although I'm not absolutely certain) that this design with the name Foster & Son hangs as a board outside the Jermyn Street shop. (The Maxwell logo is simply a riding boot, no fox here.)
post #24 of 28
I find it sort of amusing that if you order bespoke shoes from there, you can decide for yourself what company name will be inside the shoe. Maybe some SR tailors with ten names painted in the window should do the same. "I think ... Davies for this one."
post #25 of 28
Quote:
I believe Maxwell did not offer RTW until several years ago.  That's what they claimed at least.
I remember Maxwell in South Audley Street (maybe 15 or 20 years ago), at this time they sold ready-to-wear. Then they changed owners and moved to Vigo Street (again ready-to-wear available) until they got in with Fosters (maybe 3 years ago). But prior to that, Maxwell had changed owners and locale several times. I believe they were once in Bond Street, Dover Street and Savile Row. They might, or might not, have sold ready-to-wear in their previous incarnations. In the last fifty years, they must have had more owners and addresses than Zsa Zsa Gabor had husbands. Maxwell is just a name, connected with a Royal warrant, that just gets sold on as they can lay claim to going back longer than anyone else (I believe 1790 or so).
post #26 of 28
Quote:
Maybe some SR tailors with ten names painted in the window should do the same.  "I think ... Davies for this one."
Eeeny, meeny, moo...that name will do.
post #27 of 28
The Maxwell location I remember was in that orange brick part of Mayfair near the Connaught, so it must have been South Audley Street.  I distinctly remember this huge, low coffee table on which they had left for perusal the lasts of several famous customers, past & present.  The names were clearly visible in black marker ink on the wood.  The only one I recall now is Tom Selleck.  But I distinctly remember that at the time I recognized all the names.  So different than A&S, which to this day refuses to acknowledge that Astaire was ever a client.  They would even deny Prince Charles, if it weren't for the warrant.  (Which, of course, they have since lost.)
post #28 of 28
In the 1980s at one point Maxwells were owned by Huntsman and operated out of their basement at 11 (?) Savile Row. They've been around, though.
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