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Advice on MTM suit

post #1 of 31
Thread Starter 
I think as a graduation gift my parents are going to help me purchase a MTM Zegna. I've decided to go with either light to medium grey or a navy chalkstripe. If you're familiar with the color Sean Connery is most recognizable in from Goldfinger, the grey is just barely darker than that. I'll probably go two button if I go grey, or three button rolled to the second if I go with the navy stripe. I'll certainly have a second pair of pants made. Do you think I should get one with buttons for braces and without belt loops? If I do that, can I still get the belt loops, but leave them off so that they can be attached later if I decide I would be better served by belt loops? I'm definitely going to go with side vents. Should I go for a ticket pocket? It will not have hacking pockets. Should I go for a vest? The purchase is still several months away, but I'm just trying to gather my thoughts. Also, do we think that the Zegna MTM prices will return to more reasonable levels when the dollar becomes stronger? Thanks for your input.
post #2 of 31
Just out of curiosity, any reason to go Zegna rather than Chan or a diff MTM program? Do you ever intend to wear braces? I wouldn't bother if you weren't going to do it quite often. Ticket pocket is rather trendy now, but I would avoid it if you were planning to keep it for some time as it could certainly fade into obscurity again... I guess if I were going to spend that amount of money, I'd rather go custom/bespoke with Chan and not worry about it being based on a preexisting pattern.
post #3 of 31
I am interested in getting information about this myself. In Singapore, where I live, a suit can be made-to-measure for S$700-800 (or even half this price at smaller tailors). That's less than US$500. RTW suits (even no brand) are not any cheaper. Zegna has a store where they sell suits for S$ 4000 but tailors across the street can make a suit at less than half the price using Zegna fabric. I also tend to have problems with RTW in Singapore because Singaporeans are so short (in Singapore only octopusses and Europeans seem to consider 35" shirt sleeves too short). So as a (somewhat surprising) result, I think I'll get an MTM suit although I do not need one to obey a dressing code (long sleeve shirts are quite dressy in the academic world). What would be a good choice (color, silhouette, etc.) for a first (versatile) suit for a tall slim guy? Mathieu
post #4 of 31
I agree with everything above. For the amount you are planning to spend value-wise Chan would be best. I do understand the security of having a brand name suit that will always supply the answer, "It's a Zegna" when asked about. Nonetheless, one thing that this forum has taught me is to appreciate the suit not the label. Remember, by definition, there is nothing like bespoke.
post #5 of 31
Quote:
Just out of curiosity, any reason to go Zegna rather than Chan or a diff MTM program? Do you ever intend to wear braces?  I wouldn't bother if you weren't going to do it quite often.  Ticket pocket is rather trendy now, but I would avoid it if you were planning to keep it for some time as it could certainly fade into obscurity again... I guess if I were going to spend that amount of money, I'd rather go custom/bespoke with Chan and not worry about it being based on a preexisting pattern.
Reasons to employ Zegna's MTM service: You will have your suit in 5 weeks The suit will be made as requested, no f_ck ups, no excuses The fabric section is excellent and innovative The model selection is excellent The construction is excellent These reasons aside, if you do have access to a trusted tailor whose work you know, whose fabrics and methods are as good if not superior to a branded MTM service, and who can do it for a better price, go that way. Why not? That is a logical choice. I have never been put off or turned on by Zegna's label. Some people around here are seriously affected by these labels, and the discussion regarding them is not wearing well. Get over it, if you are affected, whatever you have to do to cease putting energy in to comparing labels is time well spent. A label is but one minor indicator of the quality/value of something. I liken a label to the cover of a book. Obsessing over it gets us no closer to what's inside.
post #6 of 31
Thread Starter 
Well, there are several reasons that I have chosen to go with Zegna instead of one of the bespoke routes. First, it's probably untrue, but I feel that Zegna would be more responsible for the outcome than Chan or another bespoke tailor travelling around the country. I have had a lot of luck with Zegna ready-to-wear, so I am very comfortable with purchasing more of their product. I like the Italian appeal, even though I realize the MTM is made in Switzerland. Lastly, I'm still somewhat of a label whore (how shameful). Am I going to be banned now? Thanks for your input.
post #7 of 31
bump
post #8 of 31
Sure, bespoke suits are great, but for some people MTM is more than good enough. Some people, myself included, are lucky to be able to fit well into RTW sizes of certain brands. For me, its a 40L RL blue label coat. The tailor at the RL mansion, the first time I put one on swore I was the RL 40L fit model. He told me that in 40 years of tailoring he had never seen a coat fit someone so well right off the rack. He literally has to cut the button holes and thats it, nothing else. It just good fortune on my part. For me, there is no way I am going to pay for bespoke when I have a coat that fits me so well. Its only RL that fits me this well, so I use their MTM service, and have been extremely happy with the results over the years. I own suits from other makers, some twice the cost, with more handwork, but none fit me like RL. If the man likes zegna, more power to him. Even more so since hes not paying for it. If I had my heart on a certain suit I wouldnt want to get something else from a travelling tailor from China no matter how great his reputation. Additionally, from reading all the post about Chan over the past monts, there is one common factor in all of them. I will call it the "what a great deal, and I am happy with the Chan suit, BUT..." There always seems to be a but. The delivery time, a missed detail here or there, something. Its also been said that you have to give every minute detail to Chan or else he uses his default cheapest alternative. Id be wary of directing a younger person to Chan because of this. I have been wearing suits for 10 years now, and I am starting to get to the point where I have a good sense of all the tiny details I like. As a graduating college student, I would have been clueless. And lastly, I have pet peeve with people who direct other people to not care about labels. If you truly dont care about labels, it works both ways. You shouldnt care if its a Chan OR a zegna. NOT buying a zegna because of the label is just as label conscious as buying a zegan because of the label. Wear what you like regardless of the label.
post #9 of 31
Hartz is in Baltimore. I do not know if they have a factory outlet, but they make an exceelent Italian style suit. I can not tell you if it is fused or canvas. I do know that they offer a made to measure program for retailers. Look into it. Carl
post #10 of 31
Connery wore a grey glen plaid in GF, right? Is that the pattern you're considering?
post #11 of 31
Please refer to the ticket pocket thread on AskAndy. Ticket pockets are not trendy. They've been around for 75-100 years on bespoke garments, but have only recently been included on RTW fashion brands. The better question is whether a ticket pocket belongs on a formal business suit. That one is still open for debate. Please refer to the ticket pocket thread on AskAndy. I don't have any experience with Zegna MTM, but I have heard great things about Zegna's customer service, which is key on the first few custom-type orders one makes. I've only had a few custom garments made, and I still appreciate some of the hand holding.
post #12 of 31
Quote:
 
Quote:
I will call it the "what a great deal, and I am happy with the Chan suit, BUT..."  There always seems to be a but.  The delivery time, a missed detail here or there, something.
True enough.  Most of those detailing problems seem to occur on their US tour purchases, since you aren't getting multiple fittings unless you ask for them, which will substantially increase the wait.  But if you search the archives you can also find complaints about major label MTM suits when the sales person takes bad measurements. Delivery time is kind of a here nor there issue for me.  If you order from a Savile Row tailor who does US trips, you're probably talking about six months or more from measurement to delivery.
Quote:
Its also been said that you have to give every minute detail to Chan or else he uses his default cheapest alternative.
Who said that?  "Cheapest alternative?"  WW Chan has a house default style, but the defaults have nothing to do with cheapness--the defaults are in the cut.  If you're referring to the recent horn vs plastic buttons thread, every one of my WW Chan suits has come with horn buttons without my asking for them.  There are some HK or Bangkok tailors that will go with a cheap construction method unless asked (e.g., they'll fuse the coat unless you ask for, and pay extra for, canvas construction) but Chan isn't one of them. Nor do you have to specify every minute detail unless you are one of the near-OCD types who wants to butt into the process at every step (this is not meant as a pejorative, since I tend to be this way).  A friend of mine has ordered a couple of WW Chan suits and all he did was walk in wearing his favorite suit and told them was "I like the way this suit looks and feels.  Please make one like it that fits right."  They did a fine job for him.
Quote:
Id be wary of directing a younger person to Chan because of this.  I have been wearing suits for 10 years now, and I am starting to get to the point where I have a good sense of all the tiny details I like. As a graduating college student, I would have been clueless.
Agreed, but this applies to any tailor that does not have a strong house style to steer you towards.   At risk of inciting yet another anti-Flusser flame war, I think he is dead on when he writes that an HK tailor may do good work from a craftsmanship perspective, but can lack the stylistic history and context to steer you right.
Quote:
And lastly, I have pet peeve with people who direct other people to not care about labels.  If you truly dont care about labels, it works both ways.  You shouldnt care if its a Chan OR a zegna.  NOT buying a zegna because of the label is just as label conscious as buying a zegan because of the label.  Wear what you like regardless of the label.
Agreed.  If you find a suit that you like, and wears well, you shouldn't care what label is inside.
post #13 of 31
Quote:
I think as a graduation gift my parents are going to help me purchase a MTM Zegna.  I've decided to go with either light to medium grey or a navy chalkstripe.  If you're familiar with the color Sean Connery is most recognizable in from Goldfinger, the grey is just barely darker than that. I'll probably go two button if I go grey, or three button rolled to the second if I go with the navy stripe.  I'll certainly have a second pair of pants made.  Do you think I should get one with buttons for braces and without belt loops?  If I do that, can I still get the belt loops, but leave them off so that they can be attached later if I decide I would be better served by belt loops? I'm definitely going to go with side vents.  Should I go for a ticket pocket?  It will not have hacking pockets.  Should I go for a vest? The purchase is still several months away, but I'm just trying to gather my thoughts.  Also, do we think that the Zegna MTM prices will return to more reasonable levels when the dollar becomes stronger?  Thanks for your input.
I'd only get brace-specific pants if you really like braces. Otherwise I don't see the need to do it. That's also a choice that depends on the context where you will be wearing the suit. One can argue that the "no belt loops with braces" rule is irrelevant because if you are wearing your coat like you are supposed to, nobody sees whether you have belt loops or not. On the flip side, if you are like me and don't wear a coat around the office, maybe the rule means something. Personally, I wear braces on occasion, but not enough to devote the style of my pants to being brace specific. I just wear the braces with belt-looped pants and damn the rules. The ticket pocket controversy. I have several suits with ticket pockets, several without. I'd say to leave it off on a primary suit. There will come an occasion where you want to look as conservative and formal as possible, and you don't want your best suit to be DQ'ed from the occasion because of the less-than-formal detail. I speak from experience on this one--my only current navy blue suit has a ticket pocket, and since it gets left out of the starting lineup pretty often because of it, I need to get another navy suit. Getting a vest is a very personal choice. I like the concept, but I live in LA where it never gets cold enough to make it a utilitarian necessity, and where wearing a 3-piece suit makes a decidedly conservative, against-the-grain and probably uncool statement.
post #14 of 31
My post wasn't a slam against Zegna (as I own and like several Zegna suits/shirts) or a recommendation for W.W. Chan, merely a question and recommendation if that channel had not been considered, as it's likely you would be able to get two W.W. Chan suits with two pairs of pants, made in a LP Super 120s or Zegna Trofeo fabric for the same cost as a Zegna MTM... something to think about. Is this the suit you're referring to?
post #15 of 31
Quote:
My post wasn't a slam against Zegna (as I own and like several Zegna suits/shirts) or a recommendation for W.W. Chan, merely a question and recommendation if that channel had not been considered, as it's likely you would be able to get two W.W. Chan suits with two pairs of pants, made in a LP Super 120s or Zegna Trofeo fabric for the same cost as a Zegna MTM... something to think about.
How much is a Zegna MTM suit at the current pricing?  IIRC, two suits with 2 pairs of pants from WW Chan in any of the Zegna cloths would run somewhere close to $3K.  The Charles Clayton 150s on special right now would come out to roughly $2400 for 2 coats and 4 pants.
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