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post #18601 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by elwood View Post


Interesting post, roytonboy.

I think I'm the right vintage for that "crossover" period (as I think I've said before I wasn't an Original: more an observer of Originals) but "Suedehead" is not a term I can remember being used round my way. We all knew it from the Richard Allen book - and the look on its cover was familiar to us in 71 - but it wasn't a term applied to anyone locally either as a matter of pride or as an insult.

By the time I really got into wearing what was fashionable (71), in my area we called ourselves - and were called - "smoothies" shog[1].gif Your list of clothing worn by (i) skinheads & suedeheads and (ii) suedeheads rings true for what we were wearing in 71. I associate the term "smoothies" most clearly with Crombies, PoW check trousers, two-tone suits, red socks and heavy brogues. I suspect that the term, like the clothes, reached us later than some other places: the usual effect of regional variations. In any event it wasn't a term that lasted long; probably no more than six months I suppose.

 

Wow! To think we are from less than 10 miles apart as the stone flies and spent our Saturday afternoons at exactly the same place at the same time!!! (I'm presuming that you stood on the North Stand season 1971/72 - exactly the period we're talking about)

 

WHAT'S IN A NAME? - here's my take on it......

 

We first started hearing the word 'Suedehead' in the spring of 1971. At that time it merely referred to the length of someone's hair. "Is he a skinhead?", "Well, it's more suedehead now" meaning the individual had grown his hair a little. This is what it alluded to:

 

 

 

The first time I ever saw the following photo (About a dozen years ago) it was attached to an article about skinheads. I immediate thought "Yes. but actually he is a suedehead"

 

 

 

Needless to say, this was 30 years after the event with decades of hindsight.

 

At the same time we also used the word "Smoothie" or "Smoovie". (both were used) A  smoothie was a lad with all the up to date skinhead styles whose hair was longer - usually collar length. The hair, however was styled, cut short at the front and top. It indicated a smooth dresser and had nothing to do with the style of shoes.I'm pretty sure we were using the term 'Smoothie' before the word 'suedehead'.  Incidentally I put the popularity of "Saturday Night At The Movies" by the Drifters down to the fact that from early 1971, when it was played people (mostly the girls) would sing "Saturday night with the Smoovies" (Yes, a bit naff, I know.......)

 

As the year progressed the tag suedehead also included hair up to about this length and style:

 

 

 

In reality a number of people started to grow their hair as 1971 went by and by that summer it was possible to see gangs of lads with this style (a sort of college boy?), skinhead cops , crops just growing out and collar length hair. This was certainly the case in Royton at that time. So Skinheads, suedeheads and smoothies together, all wearing the same types of clothes, only the hair styles different. What happened was, during 1971 most people started to grow their hair and the true 'skinhead' look faded out - a crop was not a common sight by that autumn. It was not unusual for someone to have been a skinhead in January 1971, to be suedehead by that autumn and a smoothie by Christmas! To be honest, many kept their hair at about the length and style of the lads in the centre of this photo. Late summer/early autumn, first red socks then crombie overcoats started to be worn. They became VERY popular and indicated a slight change in style -"Suedehead". As Elwood has said the front cover of the book "Suedehead" was familiar to us all by this stage and the clothes worn pretty accurate - our hair, though, generally was a bit shorter at that time. 

 

This is what I have always thought of as 'suedehead' During this period (Late 1971 - early 1972) my hair would have been like the lad with the scarf tucked in his jumper when just cut, obviously growing a bit longer until cut again about 4 weeks later. As the winter went on the style was worn a bit longer.

 

I have to say on reading some of your responses I have re-evaluated my thoughts on the subject. On reflection, I don't think I ever referred to myself as a Suedehead, though there is no doubt that I would have been recognised and described as such by my age group. I'm not sure either that girls were ever referred to as suedeheads or suedehead girls, though we would have recognised that definition.

 

 

 

The girl at the front certainly ticks that box (Preston - 1971)

 

Certainly girls were never referred to as smoothies by us.

 

Mr. Knightly - thanks in particular for your input on this one, those links were very informative. In terms of your difficulty in getting your head around the time/place continuum, I always think of it like this - if you throw a stone into a pond there is a big impact at that point and immediately around it then ripples widen out from it. it takes time for the ripples to reach the edge of the pond and as they do so they loose some of their impetus. By the time they have reached the edge, the point where the stone originally hit is probably calm again. Thus by the time of your photograph (which to me is post suedehead ) I was still out in a crombie, two-tone parallels and long wing brogues.

 

As we got into 1972 hair was getting longer and by that summer the whole thing was pretty much over as people started to wear penny round (beagle) collars, tank tops, stack heeled shoes, bags, glam rock inspired clothes (particularly Slade) - stuff all sorts of kids wore. In 1970 we all had pretty much the same hair style and were easily identifiable as skinheads by that and our clothes - this could not be said by mid '72 as all sorts of people wore all sorts of clothes.

 

Funny thing is 'Suedehead' should have been the pinnacle for me, I was 17, had the clothes, the whole look and could get out and about more than that 15 year old skinhead. Suedehead was a great look for school - you could wear the whole lot! There were certainly some advantages to this - for a start I appeared to be more attractive to a certain type of girl, "Get out with Barbara, you. You know she fancies you" and, from one of the West Indian girls I sat next to in one class, "Hey, Bryan, my sister got her eye on you, she tink you a reel tasty geeza" - these things never happened to me as a young skinhead! The truth was though, suedehead never quite had the edge to it that I had enjoyed as a skinhead. There was something about it, you felt part of something. By suedehead. I had realised it was all just an ever changing fashion.


Edited by roytonboy - 8/28/14 at 1:24am
post #18602 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post


I remember these businesses that apparently didn't want to make money. Is that cinema a Tesco now?


I believe it is now a restaurant. .

 

On an other occasion , about 9 of us went for a run on our scooters and ended up at nice, big , country hotel . I was second last to walk into the establishment and as I entered the hall area , a managerial type with a tray in his hand announced "No Mods"(you can tell this was a while ago). I just kept walking and turned into the lounge area , whereupon , I saw one of my mates with his back to the open fire and his parka hiked up ,heating his arse. .

 

By now , some guys had obtained drinks , as another managerial type was announcing that the establishment was a "family hotel " and therefore no place for Mods(sic). So I said , "well , we will go to the bar then". We then got told that only my Buddie and I would be served at the bar and the rest of the group would have to stand in the hall. .

 

So as we were standing having a quiet drink the first manager chap , walks past us and one of our group says "You were right about it being a family hotel as there are no condoms in the toilet" The manager stopped in his tracks but had no retort , we drank up and left . .

post #18603 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by roytonboy View Post


As the year progressed the tag suedehead also included hair up to about this length and style:




Point of information, that's me, early 69.
post #18604 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Saint View Post


So as we were standing having a quiet drink the first manager chap , walks past us and one of our group says "You were right about it being a family hotel as there are no condoms in the toilet" The manager stopped in his tracks but had no retort , we drank up and left . .


rotflmao.giflol8[1].gif
post #18605 of 18946
It is interesting to read the different Style variations in other Areas.For me Suedehead was`70 /`71 by the middle of that year Hair was Shoulder Length.The Article had come out about a Guy,who lived in Stepney,and he was saying about the Fashion changes.In the Picture,he had a Penny Collar Shirt,Mohair Strides and Royal Smooths..This was where the name "Smoovies/Smoothies" came from.Richard Allen only needed to look in the Papers and he would get all the material he wanted.About `70 there was an Article and a Film regarding(what was later to be become the ICF),West Ham Fans travelling on the better InterCity Trains-rather than the usual "Cattle Trucks".None of them are Skinheads.

If I remember correctly,Leather Levi Jackets also came out in Dark Oxblood,Dark Brown and a beautiful Bottle Green(same as the Suede Trucker Jacket with a Leather Collar).Cannot remember stories about Greasers trying to the Leather Levi Jackets off you though.Mind you,we captured a Hells Angel Leather Jacket(complete with Colours).Hung up in the Den for ages !!!!biggrin.gif
post #18606 of 18946
See, the term 'skinhead' being first applied as a term of abuse (in S E London anyhow) by longer-haired greaser/prog types, it never implied that you had a shaved head. It was a taunt flung at blokes with college-boy and peanut haircuts, simply because those styles were short compared to the cool-and-trendy or downright-scruffy long styles. Thus anyone with Danny Eccles' or my hair length (in roytonboy's post above) would have been called a 'skinhead'. I can remember going to my barber in Brockley and asking for my usual 'skinhead cut' (the college boy style), and he would say "you mean shorter than skinhead". I kid you not.
post #18607 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by browniecj View Post


Cannot remember stories about Greasers trying to nick the Leather Levi Jackets off you though.

I can tell you it was not an uncommon happening in t'North!
post #18608 of 18946
[I'm beginning to feel like I have multi-personality disorder, having spent half of the era in the North and half in the South!]
post #18609 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by roytonboy View Post
 

 

Wow! To think we are from less than 10 miles apart as the stone flies and spent our Saturday afternoons at exactly the same place at the same time!!! (I'm presuming that you stood on the North Stand season 1971/72 - exactly the period we're talking about)

 

WHAT'S IN A NAME? - here's my take on it......

 

We first started hearing the word 'Suedehead' in the spring of 1971. At that time it merely referred to the length of someone's hair. "Is he a skinhead?", "Well, it's more suedehead now" meaning the individual had grown his hair a little. This is what it alluded to:

 

 

 

The first time I ever saw the following photo (About a dozen years ago) it was attached to an article about skinheads. I immediate thought "Yes. but actually he is a suedehead"

 

 

 

Needless to say, this was 30 years after the event with decades of hindsight.

 

At the same time we also used the word "Smoothie" or "Smoovie". (both were used) A  smoothie was a lad with all the up to date skinhead styles whose hair was longer - usually collar length. The hair, however was styled, cut short at the front and top. It indicated a smooth dresser and had nothing to do with the style of shoes.I'm pretty sure we were using the term 'Smoothie' before the word 'suedehead'.  Incidentally I put the popularity of "Saturday Night At The Movies" by the Drifters down to the fact that from early 1971, when it was played people (mostly the girls) would sing "Saturday night with the Smoovies" (Yes, a bit naff, I know.......)

 

As the year progressed the tag suedehead also included hair up to about this length and style:

 

 

 

In reality a number of people started to grow their hair as 1971 went by and by that summer it was possible to see gangs of lads with this style (a sort of college boy?), skinhead cops , crops just growing out and collar length hair. This was certainly the case in Royton at that time. So Skinheads, suedeheads and smoothies together, all wearing the same types of clothes, only the hair styles different. What happened was, during 1971 most people started to grow their hair and the true 'skinhead' look faded out - a crop was not a common sight by that autumn. It was not unusual for someone to have been a skinhead in January 1971, to be suedehead by that autumn and a smoothie by Christmas! To be honest, many kept their hair at about the length and style of the lads in the centre of this photo. Late summer/early autumn, first red socks then crombie overcoats started to be worn. They became VERY popular and indicated a slight change in style -"Suedehead". As Elwood has said the front cover of the book "Suedehead" was familiar to us all by this stage and the clothes worn pretty accurate - our hair, though, generally was a bit shorter at that time. 

 

This is what I have always thought of as 'suedehead' During this period (Late 1971 - early 1972) my hair would have been like the lad with the scarf tucked in his jumper when just cut, obviously growing a bit longer until cut again about 4 weeks later. As the winter went on the style was worn a bit longer.

 

I have to say on reading some of your responses I have re-evaluated my thoughts on the subject. On reflection, I don't think I ever referred to myself as a Suedehead, though there is no doubt that I would have been recognised and described as such by my age group. I'm not sure either that girls were ever referred to as suedeheads or suedehead girls, though we would have recognised that definition.

 

 

 

The girl at the front certainly ticks that box (Preston - 1971)

 

Certainly girls were never referred to as smoothies by us.

 

Mr. Knightly - thanks in particular for your input on this one, those links were very informative. In terms of your difficulty in getting your head around the time/place continuum, I always think of it like this - if you throw a stone into a pond there is a big impact at that point and immediately around it then ripples widen out from it. it takes time for the ripples to reach the edge of the pond and as they do so they loose some of their impetus. By the time they have reached the edge, the point where the stone originally hit is probably calm again. Thus by the time of your photograph (which to me is post suedehead ) I was still out in a crombie, two-tone parallels and long wing brogues.

 

As we got into 1972 hair was getting longer and by that summer the whole thing was pretty much over as people started to wear penny round (beagle) collars, tank tops, stack heeled shoes, bags, glam rock inspired clothes (particularly Slade) - stuff all sorts of kids wore. In 1970 we all had pretty much the same hair style and were easily identifiable as skinheads by that and our clothes - this could not be said by mid '72 as all sorts of people wore all sorts of clothes.

 

Funny thing is 'Suedehead' should have been the pinnacle for me, I was 17, had the clothes, the whole look and could get out and about more than that 15 year old skinhead. Suedehead was a great look for school - you could wear the whole lot! There were certainly some advantages to this - for a start I appeared to be more attractive to a certain type of girl, "Get out with Barbara, you. You know she fancies you" and, from one of the West Indian girls I sat next to in one class, "Hey, Bryan, my sister got her eye on you, she tink you a reel tasty geeza" - these things never happened to me as a young skinhead! The truth was though, suedehead never quite had the edge to it that I had enjoyed as a skinhead. There was something about it, you felt part of something. By suedehead. I had realised it was all just an ever changing fashion.


 Another great post , roytonboy.Fantastic pictures there too , liked the girl in the sheepskin jacket and the guys standing outside a football ground would have looked like young Mods if you were only able to see their heads. .

post #18610 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post

I can tell you it was not an uncommon happening in t'North!

Not dis-believing you M-o-M.It just did not happen where I was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post

[I'm beginning to feel like I have multi-personality disorder, having spent half of the era in the North and half in the South!]


You saw the difference between the two halves,occasionally I read about them or watched Films like "Room At The Top" etc. smile.gif
post #18611 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post


Point of information, that's me, early 69.

 Yes, I know!

post #18612 of 18946
post #18613 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by kicksinstyle View Post

I'll leave this here without comment:
http://www.dazeddigital.com/fashion/article/21347/1/the-skinhead-revolution-is-coming


Good God.
post #18614 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by kicksinstyle View Post

I'll leave this here without comment:
http://www.dazeddigital.com/fashion/article/21347/1/the-skinhead-revolution-is-coming

History viewed through multicultural-tinged glasses. Don't like the silent mixing of old and new footage at all. It is dishonest.
post #18615 of 18946
Quote:
Originally Posted by kicksinstyle View Post

I'll leave this here without comment:
http://www.dazeddigital.com/fashion/article/21347/1/the-skinhead-revolution-is-coming

Oy Gevalt!
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