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post #15316 of 18457

I used (don't do it anymore) to wear my Burwoods with jeans, and believe it or not, it didn't looked bad... But i agree the derby type is less formal, but chunkier IMO.

Thought of cutting the leather patch of my Wrangler, but didn't do it yet...

post #15317 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Knightley View Post

With regard to semi-brogues, cerneabbas I really can't say.  There is perhaps one thing that comes to mind though.  Semi or half brogues are normally found in a Balmoral / Oxford style and this type of shoe was not at all popular in the late 60s / early 70s.  It was seen as too stuffy in fashionable circles.  My Diplomats, which I think look great with POW trousers just wouldn't have looked right in 1969. Our Italian and US inspired shoes then were all Derby style.




Saw some John Whites` Semi Brogues in TK Maxx.A slightly slimmer Toe than yours Mr.Knightley,but at £70 a pair(for all Leather Shoes)not a bad proposition.

I visited Debenhams` Men Section in Lakeside,and,their Brand of Clothing is leaning towards "American Ivy".Unstructured Sports Blazers(Herringbone) at £90 a throw.The only thing I did not like on it was Corduroy Arm Patches-but these could be easily changed.Baggy Chinos which I have always liked(in various Colours)and their version of a Harrington-not to my taste though.Colourful Jumpers and Polo Shirts also.smile.gif
post #15318 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouseau View Post
 

I used (don't do it anymore) to wear my Burwoods with jeans, and believe it or not, it didn't looked bad... But i agree the derby type is less formal, but chunkier IMO.

Thought of cutting the leather patch of my Wrangler, but didn't do it yet...

 

Yes those Churchs Grafton that Botolph bought are much chunkier..a nice heavy brogue.

Do you like the "Milanese" look that has been shown ?  I was thinking that a pair of nice brogues,plain coloured wool flat front trousers, a John Smedley cotton long sleeve shirt and a Crombie would look much simpler,as smart and keep more in the tradition of our look ?

post #15319 of 18457

Totally agree with you Cerneabbas. The "Milanese look" guys are stylish, but it's not my style either. i think their look goes with the Italy sun and the Italian way of life. I like Italy very much, and it's one of the place in Europe where i prefer to go (with UK). But it's not my style of clothing. Already said, i'm quite a classical type. When i was a skinhead for example, i never wore checked shirts (sorry folks). Always plain white BD, with black braces, black or dark blue crombie, and Black DM or brogues... Dark jeans, white sta-prest, or black and grey pinstripe trousers... Well, i'm more "coloured" now, but i could not dress like those mafia guys :D...

post #15320 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouseau View Post
 

Totally agree with you Cerneabbas. The "Milanese look" guys are stylish, but it's not my style either. i think their look goes with the Italy sun and the Italian way of life. I like Italy very much, and it's one of the place in Europe where i prefer to go (with UK). But it's not my style of clothing. Already said, i'm quite a classical type. When i was a skinhead for example, i never wore checked shirts (sorry folks). Always plain white BD, with black braces, black or dark blue crombie, and Black DM or brogues... Dark jeans, white sta-prest, or black and grey pinstripe trousers... Well, i'm more "coloured" now, but i could not dress like those mafia guys :D...

 

Yes, I think that its good to be able to look at a style and say that's great but not for me..i think that my ideal look is a bit less colourful...well maybe one item of clothing that is colourful...I think of the cover of the book Suedehead as the starting point and then "modernise" it...I am talking for a smarter look now not the dressed down monkey boots/jeans/Harrington look.

I had never heard of John Smedley before I found this thread but I had worn similar shirts by Hugo Boss for a while,with POW or hounds tooth check trousers and oxford semi brogues or Loake Kempton boots..

I do agree with a lot of what Gsvs5 said about freshening the look up,but  IMO the Milanese look is getting too far away from our look some how ? I do think it makes a good talking point though.

post #15321 of 18457

Those Italian fellas are stylish enough, but they're a bit 'oldest swinger in town' for my liking.

post #15322 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by cerneabbas View Post

I gave up wearing jeans at about 40 (maybe a year or two before)..I had my first pair of Levis in 69/70 when i was 11 or 12.
Truthfully I was never that impressed with Levis,they seemed to be saggy in the ass IMO.
I went on to Wranglers for a few years and then Lee which were my favourites.

I have one pair of 501s, and - yes - they're a bit saggy round the arse. I've been tempted to think it's my age, and my 'racing snake' figure isn't what it was in 1969. But what has really changed is that back before 1969 Levis were famously shrink-to-fit, and the last thing they were back then was saggy.

These days I usually knock around in a pair of black Levi 514s, which seem to be a better fit than 501s - there are too many old geezers in ill-fitting blue jeans around town.
Edited by Man-of-Mystery - 10/8/13 at 12:17am
post #15323 of 18457
I only wear "shrink to fit" 501", they are easy to find here, and they are not saggy round the arse... I dont know in UK, but in France you won't find the best Levi in their Flagship stores, but at small retailers. Maybe because there is less customers for the "shrink to fit" 501s.
post #15324 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post


I have one pair of 501s, and - yes - they're a bit saggy round the arse. I've been tempted to think it's my age, and my 'racing snake' figure isn't what it was in 1969. But what has really changed is that back before 1969 Levis were famously shrink-to-fit, and the last thing they were back then was saggy.

These days I usually knock around in a pair of black Levi 714s, which seem to be a better fit than 501s - there are too many old geezers in ill-fitting blue jeans around town.

 

Yes you are right the first Levis that I had were ok for shape,even though I was very skinny ( a lot were then,how things have changed),but I thought that after that Levis went down in quality,maybe it was just the ones in the high street shops,i don't know but I thought that Lee had a better shape/fit.

post #15325 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouseau View Post

I only wear "shrink to fit" 501", they are easy to find here, and they are not saggy round the arse... I dont know in UK, but in France you won't find the best Levi in their Flagship stores, but at small retailers. Maybe because there is less customers for the "shrink to fit" 501s.

 

Some of the worst Levis I have seen are in Levi shops in outlet centres in England,i think that you would have to go to a proper jeans shop to find good ones.

I looked at pictures of those 606 jeans that you mentioned,are they a bit more tapered than the old Levis were ? I liked the copper rivets I thought that they were an essential look on Levis.


Edited by cerneabbas - 10/7/13 at 10:49pm
post #15326 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by cerneabbas View Post

 

I cannot argue with the quality of the Wranglers that my girlfriend bought me,only the comfort.

Churchs Burwood is a nice shaped English brogue,but of the oxford /balmoral type which as Mr Knightley says is seen as very formal,a derby/blucher type ( like the Loake Royal for instance ) is less formal and so could be worn with jeans or trousers.

BTW,i always used to cut the leather patches off of the Wranglers and the Lee jeans,i thought that they looked crap and they got hard after washing the jeans.

 



Over on the main board there are some purists who argue that derbies / bluchers should not be worn with suits and I have heard it said that an Oxford is too formal to pair with odd trousers. I think this is more of an American thing where their approach to dressing can be like painting by numbers... Here we prefer to experiment with different combinations - but back in 1969 / 70 it was pretty well fixed.
post #15327 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by browniecj View Post



Saw some John Whites` Semi Brogues in TK Maxx.A slightly slimmer Toe than yours Mr.Knightley,but at £70 a pair(for all Leather Shoes)not a bad proposition.



I visited Debenhams` Men Section in Lakeside,and,their Brand of Clothing is leaning towards "American Ivy".Unstructured Sports Blazers(Herringbone) at £90 a throw.The only thing I did not like on it was Corduroy Arm Patches-but these could be easily changed.Baggy Chinos which I have always liked(in various Colours)and their version of a Harrington-not to my taste though.Colourful Jumpers and Polo Shirts also.smile.gif

 



http://www.styleforum.net/content/type/61/id/738766/

John White 'Midhurst' full Oxford brogue from 1987-ish. This pic taken in March 2013. Showing the slightly slimmer toe, so perhaps the last has not changed? Got these from now defunct? Sam Walker in Covent Gdn.
post #15328 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Knightley View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cerneabbas View Post
 

 

I cannot argue with the quality of the Wranglers that my girlfriend bought me,only the comfort.

Churchs Burwood is a nice shaped English brogue,but of the oxford /balmoral type which as Mr Knightley says is seen as very formal,a derby/blucher type ( like the Loake Royal for instance ) is less formal and so could be worn with jeans or trousers.

BTW,i always used to cut the leather patches off of the Wranglers and the Lee jeans,i thought that they looked crap and they got hard after washing the jeans.

 



Over on the main board there are some purists who argue that derbies / bluchers should not be worn with suits and I have heard it said that an Oxford is too formal to pair with odd trousers. I think this is more of an American thing where their approach to dressing can be like painting by numbers... Here we prefer to experiment with different combinations - but back in 1969 / 70 it was pretty well fixed.

 

I have read that,as you say an American thing,all the blokes wearing suits with  Royals or plain toes back in the day thought that it looked fine and i think so too.

post #15329 of 18457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inks View Post
 

Those Italian fellas are stylish enough, but they're a bit 'oldest swinger in town' for my liking.

 

I was thinking about this and i was wondering if English styles and colours are traditionally a bit conservative and sober ? maybe this was something that Mod was reacting against ?

Maybe we just arent used to seeing older blokes dressing in a stylish way ? ( definitely the case here in Bristol ).

As i said before I like a simpler look ,but i am not knocking their look it is smart,but a bit too many colours and a bit too much for me.

post #15330 of 18457
I have also been wondering how to respond to the Pitti Uomo debate.

My mind, for some reason went back to Brideshead Revisited and a meeting in the mid 1930s between the exotic Anthony Blanche and the English painter Charles Ryder where Anthony ‘explains’ Charles’ own pictures to him!

Anthony says ‘….My dear, it is what you have been up to that we are here to talk about. I’ve been watching you, my dear. I’m a faithful old body and I’ve kept my eye on you. As he spoke the bar and the bar-tender, the blue wicker furniture, the gambling-machines, the gramophone, the couple of youths dancing on the oilcloth, the youths sniggering round the slots, the purple-veined, stiffly-dressed elderly man drinking in the corner opposite us, the whole drab and furtive joint seemed to fade, and I was back in Oxford looking out over Christ Church meadow through a window of Ruskin-Gothic.

I went to your first exhibition, said Anthony; I found it - charming. There was an interior of Marchmain House, very English, very correct, but quite delicious. Charles has done something, I said; not all he will do, not all he can do, but something.

Even then, my dear, I wondered a little. It seemed to me that there was something a little gentlemanly about your painting. You must remember I am not English; I cannot understand this keen zest to be well-bred. English snobbery is more macabre to me even than English morals. However, I said, Charles has done something delicious. What will he do next?

The next thing I saw was your very handsome volume Village and Provincial Architecture, was it called? And what did I find? Charm again. Not quite my cup of tea, I thought; this is too English. I have the fancy for rather spicy things, you know, not for the shade of the cedar tree, the cucumber sandwich, the silver cream-jug, the English girl dressed in whatever English girls do wear for tennis - not that, not Jane Austen, not M-m-miss M-m-mitford. Then, to be frank, dear Charles, I despaired of you. I am a degenerate old d-d-dago, I said and Charles - I speak of your art, my dear - is a dean’s daughter in flowered muslin…..’

I am certain if Anthony were with us today that he would sport the more flamboyant Pitti Uomo look. He is described in the book as having a cosmopolitan upbringing and being ‘wholly exotic’. He just doesn’t get English charm and English reserve. As he says, he has a taste for more spicy things.

OK, not many of us on here (I assume) studied at Oxford in the 1920s and the way of life depicted by Evelyn Waugh has sadly gone for ever. But the fact remains we are tied to the past through our clothes and in the case of the Englishman this gives him a built-in reserve. (That is the Englishman who retains a sense of style not the shorts-wearing-in-January tattooed twat).

So for those of us in these damp islands, while we can readily appreciate that Italian flash, it is something we admire rather than desire. Just my two penn’orth.
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