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post #12886 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post


Buttons, it's just that it's too 'posed'... To me it has the air of a later photo, not one from the 'original' era. I think it has been pointed out that in 69/70 MA1 jackets did not have orange linings.

 

"In later models (J-8279D, about 1960), the MA-1 jacket was made reversible and added a bright Indian Orange lining."

 

this was from the History of the MA-1.

 

http://www.thirdlooks.com/2013/03/history-of-the-ma-1/

post #12887 of 18913
Blimey, you're up early, Will!
post #12888 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gsvs5 View Post

"In later models (J-8279D, about 1960), the MA-1 jacket was made reversible and added a bright Indian Orange lining."

this was from the History of the MA-1.

http://www.thirdlooks.com/2013/03/history-of-the-ma-1/

Hmmmm.... (frowns). Still a bit puzzled.
post #12889 of 18913
I'm worried about these photos for a number of reasons. They could be from early 1970, as captioned, which was roughly when a supply of MA1 jackets came into surplus stores round our way (though not with orange linings, not in that batch anyway). On the other hand, they're too 'posed', too much "Now lads, stick on some skinhead 'attitude' for me!"

Look at these two...





... there have been some clothes swapped round for effect, and a crombie has appeared and disappeared. That's just too damned contrived for my liking. I can see that the car at the side of the road (in the photo I haven't copied into this post) is roughly the right era, but again that might have been contrived.

As far as the book is concerned, we'll look silly if we include anything that isn't from the era and claim that it is, so I think we always have to err on the side of caution.

Nice shades, though.
post #12890 of 18913
Thanks MoM. Ray Bans aren't insanely priced but at around $100 (give or take)...still way more than I'll pay for sunglasses. I lose em too often. I'll stick with my cheapy roundish lenses for now til I can find something suitable.
post #12891 of 18913

Just out of interest the previous image (Numerically) is this one:

The wine shop is showing Gilbeys Gin at 49'3 .So it puts it pre Decimalisation (Feb '71) if that's any help?

post #12892 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spirit of 89 View Post

Thanks MoM. Ray Bans aren't insanely priced but at around $100 (give or take)...still way more than I'll pay for sunglasses. I lose em too often. I'll stick with my cheapy roundish lenses for now til I can find something suitable.

These look like a decent alternative to Ray Bans.

 

 

 

http://www.amazon.com/GENUINE-GOVERNMENT-PILOTS-SUNGLASSES-AMERICAN/dp/B000XXV7Q0/ref=pd_sbs_shoe_1

post #12893 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post

Fries with that?
I still stand firm about what I said.
Its 'posed' because its taken by a 'proper photographer', who'll set up a few poses, probably take a couple of films worth and release the best ones.
The clarity is also there because its taken on a decent expensive camera and not on a Brownie or a Kodak Instamatic like most pics from the time.

I'm sure if you google a few things about MA1 jackets, there'll be loads of historical sites telling you what details came out when. I haven't got time to look at the minute. My one's '66 I think and has an orange liner, as is Roy's. The US and British army often put issue dates in garments so they could keep a track of stock etc, so unlike almost any other piece of clothing, you get a tag inside that tells you the age, without having to figure it out for yourself. But as mine and Roy's doesn't prove anything, maybe these will help ....






The top picture is from the Man Alivedocumentary in '69.
They had orange liners in early Vietnam and Korea and they're the ones the skinheads would have been buying in the Army Navy stores.

There's no way those pictures are from '79, 80 or '90s or nowadays.

Hat still on the menu.
post #12894 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post

Blimey, you're up early, Will!
I like to catch the worm.
post #12895 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post

I'm worried about these photos for a number of reasons. They could be from early 1970, as captioned, which was roughly when a supply of MA1 jackets came into surplus stores round our way (though not with orange linings, not in that batch anyway). On the other hand, they're too 'posed', too much "Now lads, stick on some skinhead 'attitude' for me!"

Look at these two...





... there have been some clothes swapped round for effect, and a crombie has appeared and disappeared. That's just too damned contrived for my liking. I can see that the car at the side of the road (in the photo I haven't copied into this post) is roughly the right era, but again that might have been contrived.

As far as the book is concerned, we'll look silly if we include anything that isn't from the era and claim that it is, so I think we always have to err on the side of caution.

Nice shades, though.

Of course its contrived - its a photo shoot. Its not a bunch of lads, just hanging around.
Different jackets for different effects - why not? Its a photo shoot.
Not one piece of un-original clothing in sight.
You'd be unlikely to see that lad's longer hair cut in the revival, or that bird's suit or various other items / combinations.
Original oxford weave Benny, rip off Smedley, fly fronted Mac, zip fly Levi's 502, 60s sta press etc etc.
Now, I know, you'll find all that and more round my house, having been a skinhead for the last 30-odd years, I can't think of a time when you'd get a group that big, all dressed completely original and without them all being in the expected cliche skinhead look. If there are any pics, I'd love to see them.

Fuck it, I'll eat two hats!

If you're worried about them looking too good for the book, use this one - it looks grainy and shit so must be original.
post #12896 of 18913
Quote:


If you're worried about them looking too good for the book, use this one - it looks grainy and shit so must be original.

biggrin.gif

 

Sorry folks...with Will on this one, I think its a original also.

post #12897 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by buttons View Post


I still stand firm about what I said.
Its 'posed' because its taken by a 'proper photographer', who'll set up a few poses, probably take a couple of films worth and release the best ones.
The clarity is also there because its taken on a decent expensive camera and not on a Brownie or a Kodak Instamatic like most pics from the time.

I'm sure if you google a few things about MA1 jackets, there'll be loads of historical sites telling you what details came out when. I haven't got time to look at the minute. My one's '66 I think and has an orange liner, as is Roy's. The US and British army often put issue dates in garments so they could keep a track of stock etc, so unlike almost any other piece of clothing, you get a tag inside that tells you the age, without having to figure it out for yourself. But as mine and Roy's doesn't prove anything, maybe these will help ....

The top picture is from the Man Alivedocumentary in '69.
They had orange liners in early Vietnam and Korea and they're the ones the skinheads would have been buying in the Army Navy stores.

There's no way those pictures are from '79, 80 or '90s or nowadays.

Hat still on the menu.

 

I have just looked at 'Icons of Men's Style' by Josh Sims and it states that 'Further revisions were introduced in 1963 [to the MA-1] : for flight crews the sage green lining was replaced by one in bright orange - known as Indian or rescue orange...'

post #12898 of 18913

Like MoM my first thoughts were the pics were 1979 / 80 but I can see nothing in the clothing or in the backgrounds that actually supports that view.

 

The knitted top is very much like one I had in 1966 (mine was red with silver grey stripes on one side only) and the one in the pic is getting longish in the tooth - collar points show some colour loss and wrinkled placket.  So this suggests late 60s.

 

The reddish checked shirt is pure 1969.  I had one just like it.  Buttons will know of the make I'm sure.

 

The (looser) cut of the clothing also suggests 1960s.

 

I thought the British Rail logo may have helped but, having checked, it was introduced from 1965....

post #12899 of 18913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Man-of-Mystery View Post

A caption's just a caption!

so just check the link of other pix from the same photographer with the same caption if you still dont believe it...
what else do we need to prove that these pix are original???? wink.gif

http://www.gettyimages.de/Search/Search.aspx?contractUrl=2&assetType=image&family=Editorial&p=youth-in-england-in-the-seventies

post #12900 of 18913
btw, this one was missing above.... maybe the cars in the background will clear it now..

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