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Australian Members - Page 1678

post #25156 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Journeyman View Post

(See bolder section above.)

This is where we start to veer into the realm of philosophy, perhaps.

Certainly, whilst there is no one, true way that is globally applicable in terms of music, art and so on, it's clear that there are norms (or rules, at the risk of starting a fight!) in regard to such things.

Sure, there are people who push the boundaries - John Cage in music, Damien Hirst in art, to name just a couple - but whilst you'll find some people who will laud them (some because they think that they are genuinely talented, others because they appreciate the iconoclasm) most will think that they are a bit silly.

Sure, some iconoclastic artists/composers/fashion designers and so on were truly talented and groundbreaking but, as apropos pointed out when he referred to Picasso, most of them were well-versed in their field and so knew that they were deliberately traducing traditions in doing what they were doing. If you go to art school, you have to learn about fashion and colour. If you learn an instrument, you have to learn the notes, how to read music, understand rhythm and so on. There are rules that you must learn, before you can then decide to break them.

Fashion, just like art and music, has far fewer rules now than it used to - for the better part of the last century, all of those fields have experienced a softening of formality, the adoption of a more laissez faire approach.

However, whilst most rules about dressing have been softened or disappeared (no brown in town, for example - you'd be hard pressed to find anyone outside SF who knew anything about that) it is a fact that our clothing developed in a particular cultural milieu and it useful to know a bit about those things before you decide to start throwing things on with abandon.

Admittedly, clothing is less of a signifier here than it appears to be in London or in the NE United States, for example, but people still pick up on a well-fitting suit and a well co-ordinated outfit and therefore I think that it does make sense to educate oneself a bit about past and current practices.

I was lucky, in a way, as my father had some "off-the-row" suits that he'd had made for himself in the 1950s or 1960s, and my mother had a good collection of tailored garments from Australian places like Sportscraft from back when they actually made good stuff. They took the time to talk to me about colour combinations, about formal outfits and more outfits and other such things and so by the time I started reading fora like SF and Ask Andy I at least knew a bit already but I guess that there are probably some people around whose parents either did not know or did not care about tailored clothing and so they didn't have that sort of knowledge imparted to them.

BTW JM, my 'here we go again' bit of snark was not directed at you, but appropos.

Apologies for the misunderstanding.
post #25157 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by charliechan View Post

Can anyone recommend a good iron and steamer? I've been using sunbeam irons which seem to do the job but they keep breaking down on me.
I've also been using the steam feature on my iron to get rid of creases in jackets / ties so far, but now that I'm buying more expensive clothing I figure I should probably get a proper steamer? Thanks in advance!

Charles Nakhle swears by his Tefal.

Whatever you buy, make sure the KWatt rating is high enough, among other things.
post #25158 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdEyedPugilist View Post


Charles Nakhle swears by his Tefal.

Whatever you buy, make sure the KWatt rating is high enough, among other things.


Anybody own a press, like the Elnapress? 

post #25159 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by jobro View Post


They played 100 tracks and 'Thrift Shop' was only played once making it better than any other offering. Putting it at #1 though, really?

Everyone wants to be a thrift master like Fxh.

post #25160 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by charliechan View Post

Can anyone recommend a good iron and steamer? I've been using sunbeam irons which seem to do the job but they keep breaking down on me.

 

Are you filling the iron up from the tap?

 

You must use distilled water from Sunbeam, boiled water or water from your Brita jug. Otherwise, the iron will die.

post #25161 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdEyedPugilist View Post

Take the white shirt kerfuffle for example: I'm with Foo on this one. Tried white poplin with a wool tie once upon a time and the effect was unpleasantly jarring. I had my suspicions, but after reading Vox's coherence Essay, I realized why it didn't work. Digested the lesson - white shirts are highly citified while wool ties are primarily rustic - and added the new knowledge to my decision filters. Never did it again.

I can see what you're saying, but I like to pull at these rules a little bit. I like a knit or wool tie with a white poplin shirt and a mid grey suit, so long as the tie is quite dark (say, black or navy) and if wool, it is smooth-textured. I think that is still balanced. The formality which is subtracted by the texture of the tie is added back by its sombre tone.

In the example of the burgundy silk knit with the sports coat didn't think it was that egregious. I wear a burgundy knit with a white shirt - no that I am any kind of master. But I do agree that the knit tie and odd, checked jacket are projecting country/casual and a white poplin shirt is strongly signifying business. I reckon if you want to wear a white shirt with that combo - an oxford cloth would bring it back into balance.
post #25162 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Sy View Post

Are you filling the iron up from the tap?

 

You must use distilled water from Sunbeam, boiled water or water from your Brita jug. Otherwise, the iron will die.

 

I find that using distilled water and / or using a saline solution to clean the thing helps very little.. I've gone through more than a few of these things! (thank Straya for good warranty policies)

post #25163 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selvaggio View Post

I can see what you're saying, but I like to pull at these rules a little bit. I like a knit or wool tie with a white poplin shirt and a mid grey suit, so long as the tie is quite dark (say, black or navy) and if wool, it is smooth-textured. I think that is still balanced. The formality which is subtracted by the texture of the tie is added back by its sombre tone.

In the example of the burgundy silk knit with the sports coat didn't think it was that egregious. I wear a burgundy knit with a white shirt - no that I am any kind of master. But I do agree that the knit tie and odd, checked jacket are projecting country/casual and a white poplin shirt is strongly signifying business. I reckon if you want to wear a white shirt with that combo - an oxford cloth would bring it back into balance.

Hey man, how's it going?

See, this is where it gets tricky. We can yammer on about rules all day long, but sometimes, you have to see it to believe it. Sometimes, it's a gut-level thing.

Obviously, you looked in the mirror and liked the look of your chosen ensemble. And imo, that counts for something. So much of dressing well is an artistic endeavor, a question of having 'the eye' for good visual aesthetics. That's why I believe that for beginners, mimicry is not a bad route to take.

Personally, the only knit I'll wear with a white shirt is my black knit. Most versatile tie I have. And one of those odd accessories that even Manton agrees, goes well with virtually anything. Of course, the rules of #menswear would have one running for the hills at the thought of a black tie away from the standard formal-event context.
post #25164 of 52281
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post #25165 of 52281
772 posts to catch up on....

On that note, in case anyone isn't doing it already, do yourself a favour and hit "Preferences" at the bottom of the page and change the max posts per page to 100, or anything more than the default 15 which is an absolute pain...
post #25166 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdEyedPugilist View Post

...

The rules exist. And it's good that they do.

What I object to is this: the premise that wearing nice clothes or knowing how you should imbibe alcohol somehow makes you better than some one who does neither; that when someone asks a question or posts something, someone else has the right to call him an idiot and get away without any consequence whatsoever.

It' s not the rules that I despise, that I pour absolute contempt on; it's rude behaviour, the kind that would likely get you stomped in real life.

That is what I object to.

That said, it's good to remember that we're taking what is, in my opinion, largely an expression of visual art and trying to make it a predictable, measurable science. This can be a mistake. Sometimes, as in all forms of artistic expression, either one has, or can develop 'the eye', or they don't.

Very well said. It's entirely possible - and indeed preferable - to put forward one's view without being abrupt, insulting or patronising.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdEyedPugilist View Post

BTW JM, my 'here we go again' bit of snark was not directed at you, but appropos.

Apologies for the misunderstanding.

Not a problem at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selvaggio View Post

But I do agree that the knit tie and odd, checked jacket are projecting country/casual and a white poplin shirt is strongly signifying business. I reckon if you want to wear a white shirt with that combo - an oxford cloth would bring it back into balance.

I tend to agree. With the exception of the black knit tie, which I wear occasionally with a white, poplin shirt (like CEP and, of course, many others), I otherwise wear my knit ties and more casual ties with a white OCBD shirt.
post #25167 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdEyedPugilist View Post

Hey man, how's it going?

Sometimes, it's a gut-level thing.

So true. You've just got to be happy with how you present yourself as you walk through out the door in them morning. Knowing you are in perfect comliance with the rules is not going to achieve that by itself. I beleive knowing the 'rules' really helps as a starting point. Then you know how many 'rules' you are breaking and how badly. If your gut is saying 'no' the rules can help explain what's not working. My philosophy is the rules give you a framework, but then you've gotta be yourself.

Rules that I frequently break...

I like chunky full brogue, double soled shoes - even with a suit. There are days when I need the full CBD suit-of-armour. But mostly I don't. So I often like to pull-back or undermine the formality of what I am wearing just a little. Psychologically it is my little protest that I have to be in an office all day. Practically, this footwear suits my t-bone steak-like feet.

I like a textured tie - including wool ones. Sometimes even 'fuzzy' cashmere ones. Eg, I have one in a purple and navy herringbone which I wear with a navy woarted suit. In a warm tone it would be way out of wack, but the citified colour combo pulls it back enough.

If it is hot and I am out at lunch, I will sometimes wear a panama hat. SOme might say it looks a little odd with a suit, not being felt - and truthfully I feel more inclined to do this in a plain navy or lighter grey. But, hey, it stops my bald patch from getting burnt and keeps me cool, so I can live with it.

I have a roundish face and not very long neck, but I wear lots of spread collars (though I do avoid the extreme cut-away look).

I have some french cuff shirts which I sometimes wear tie-less with a navy blazer. I realise its not quite done, but I think the crispness of a navy blazer makes it work out okay. And I would only do so with grey trousers, not chinos.
post #25168 of 52281

I just got back from Paris, and one of the things I observed there is that the mensfolk's clothing are generally well-fitted, and they tend to coordinate their colours and textures very well. 

 

The key-word is well-fitted, and having good posture helped immensely.

 

Now I am back in Sydney, and the glaring things I noticed (apart from perennial bad shoes) are bad fitting suits/jackets, and/or bad posture.

 

As for Hong Kong, my big disappointment was my failure to get any Bontonis at all from Tassels.  The popular sizes were all gone, and Bontoni is not known to supply regularly. IMO, dollar for dollar, the Bontoni's are extremely good value for what you are getting. $1000 per pair on average, but I reckon you will love them forever. Purely subjective of course, so please refrain from throwing daggers at me. 

post #25169 of 52281
Quote:
Originally Posted by charliechan View Post

Can anyone recommend a good iron and steamer? I've been using sunbeam irons which seem to do the job but they keep breaking down on me.
I've also been using the steam feature on my iron to get rid of creases in jackets / ties so far, but now that I'm buying more expensive clothing I figure I should probably get a proper steamer? Thanks in advance!

I'd be careful using an iron to get creases out of ties. Maybe holding it an inch or two away while the tie /jacket is hanging up is ok. There are tales of steam "blowing" the seams on jackets, and in theory good jackets and pants the wool is stretched, shrunk and shaped by ironing by the tailors/makers and you run the risk of changing the shape. That said a bit of judicious touching up won't kill anything.

I've found most irons to be ok - possibly the best I had was a Telfal, but they can all stop working after a while. Nice if you can get a bit of weight in them. Stay way from teflon/non stick coating - it scratches and flakes off after a while. Stainless steel is best. Just give them a good internal clean every now and then, you can use special iron cleaning stuff or coffee machine cleaning stuff but white vinegar in water works just as well. In theory the distilled water is the right thing but it becomes inconvenient and in practice doesn't seem to make that much difference. A cheap plastic spare bottle for water and an cotton ironing cloth is worthwhile.
post #25170 of 52281
Nice article here on dressing better (ie continual improvement) and dressing for yourself - http://fromsqualortoballer.tumblr.com/post/41704293685/personalstyle2#notes.

Quote - "Although there is indeed value in knowledge, true understanding of any subject comes from experience. Don’t let your imperfect wardrobe or .jpeg library of #menswear keep you from putting things on with confidence in the morning. Try things, learn from your mistakes, and have fun.

Practice is the key to improving; money is not."

I agree with CEP about trusting your gut and like Selvaggio often wear items the rules would suggest do not work together as I like the combination and feel good in them (suede boots with suits, white shirts with knit ties, french cuffs with no tie and/or jacket to name a few). If these things make me ignorant or perceived as badly dressed so be it, but I am (mostly) happy with my clothing choices and dress for the enjoyment of it (among other things such as respect for others and looking the best I can).

Also, harking back a little, as a Scotsman I thought whiskey (spelt with an "e") was meant to be drunk with coke...(yes, I am just stirring....).
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