Should Asians wear tweeds, browns, and bold patterns?

Originally Posted by academe

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I can't express how much I disagree with you.

Do you happen to be American?

academe, I'll tell you what look I do like. It looks good on Asians and White Guys alike.

It's the clean sharp look that the 'Mad Men' tv show seems to have accelerated. There is a bit of this going on in the WAYWNT thread. Grays, blacks, white, close but not too close, silhouettes on fit bodies; this is a great look to me, so long as you don't look like you walked out of the studio wardrobe.

OK I googled. I hope it's not the St. Louis Billikens because the billiken was invented by an occidental.

Absolutely why not? -"European" is the lead-culture, still- so everyone on the globe should aspire to wear it and live it...

Originally Posted by Viktri

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Academe: I think the only way you would be able to convince me that tweed is not old manish is to point to a group of youth in China or HK that wear tweed and have not been influenced by the British (ie: living in Scotland). /

I'm not trying to convince you. I just disagree with and am not really concerned if you agree with me or not.

Originally Posted by Viktri

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How old were you guys again?

j/k but, seriously, leaving the internet-ego argument behind, sometimes you guys seem so disconnected from reality. Tweed in among Asians in Asia? It gets pretty hot there. That might be a reason it would be considered costumey or old. In HK, the only ones who are in the "know" about tweed are those old enough to have been influenced by the British. The costumes are the ones wearing tweed in 30-40 degrees celcius.

Mustapha: Agreed - Tweed is a British thing and does look off. Those who can "get away with it" could probably get away with a lot of things.

I'd agree that even wearing a linen suits in the tropics would seem unbearable. I don't disagree with you that Chinese with the context of mainland China or HK might not identify with tweed, for whatever reason that may be. Part of it, from my experience (having family in Singapore, Hong Kong, etc.), is that East and Southeast Asian Chinese are very enamooured of heavily branded Italian designers, etc. and tend to prefer that aesthetic.

However, what I do disagree with is the sentiment that tweeds, patterns, etc. are generally unsuitable for East Asians. The cultural reference argument (i.e. tweed=British) is very thin in my mind. As I said, you might as well then say that everyone should wear their national costume, rather than a suit... God forbid that women should wear trousers, because skirts are traditional, etc. Where does this line of reasoning end?

Originally Posted by Viktri

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Academe: I think the only way you would be able to convince me that tweed is not old manish is to point to a group of youth in China or HK that wear tweed and have not been influenced by the British (ie: living in Scotland).

Vox: I have not seen anyone in China or HK with what I could recognize as a Saville Row suit. I have been to the Row and seen their bespoke clothing.

I can tell you that if I did see someone wearing such a suit anywhere outside of the row, I would not recognize it. This may be heresy but I cannot differentiate between a Saville Row suit and a well fitting OTR or MTM suit. I am not in the "know". The only thing I noticed was SR suits use very interesting fabrics.

RE: Fit; SR is not the only way to get a well fitting garment. There are elements to fit here than would go unnoticed in the real world. There are also elements of fit here that would be noticed in the real world but are praised here.


How old were you guys again?

j/k but, seriously, leaving the internet-ego argument behind, sometimes you guys seem so disconnected from reality. Tweed in among Asians in Asia? It gets pretty hot there. That might be a reason it would be considered costumey or old. In HK, the only ones who are in the "know" about tweed are those old enough to have been influenced by the British. The costumes are the ones wearing tweed in 30-40 degrees celcius.

Mustapha: Agreed - Tweed is a British thing and does look off. Those who can "get away with it" could probably get away with a lot of things.

Lots of youths in Japan wearing Vivienne Westwood plaid and other assorted punkish style. Only indirectly influenced by Scotland or what have you in that case...

Originally Posted by Douglas

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Duh. I thought Indians and Indians were the same thing.

Seriously though, I am stumped. I thought maybe it was a trick question and animals could be included, e.g. Bengal Tigers. But there are no Mongols or Ghurkas at any D-1 colleges I can name, though both would make fearsome mascots.

Owls are wise and so are old Chinese men, but I don't think that's what Temple had in mind.

Texas Tech's Raiders are Red and not Yellow.

I'm joking again, but resisting google.

Since no one else seems to want to play the game, the answer is the USC Trojans, Troy being a city of Asia Minor. Everybody is so attuned to using "Asians" as a synonym for "East Asians" that they overlook the Trojans. I pulled this on a professor of classics who was teaching a course in Homer at that time, and even he missed it. It's rather ironic, since the area around Troy was the original "Asia," and the term came to be applied to all points east of that!

Originally Posted by academe

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Part of it, from my experience (having family in Singapore, Hong Kong, etc.), is that East and Southeast Asian Chinese are very enamooured of heavily branded Italian designers, etc. and tend to prefer that aesthetic. However, what I do disagree with is the sentiment that tweeds, patterns, etc. are generally unsuitable for East Asians. The cultural reference argument (i.e. tweed=British) is very thin in my mind. As I said, you might as well then say that everyone should wear their national costume, rather than a suit... God forbid that women should wear trousers, because skirts are traditional, etc. Where does this line of reasoning end?
Italian? I stand by my statement of an age differential . Japanese style is more prevalent among youth (18-25) in China and HK than Italian style. Japanese stuff is the **** (less expensive, looks sweet). Italian stuff is cool but that has more to do with an obsession over luxury products. Cultural argument is stronger than you give credit. No rational person living in a very hot climate would come up with the idea of wearing a heavy suit without being influenced by the British style. While it is true the AC in HK is always set high, a heavy suit is still overkill.

Originally Posted by Fuuma

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Lots of youths in Japan wearing Vivienne Westwood plaid and other assorted punkish style. Only indirectly influenced by Scotland or what have you in that case...
I can only say a bit here because I did not grow up in Japan. That said, I have never been to Japan as a tourist (I’m not into that stuff). When I was in Japan, I did the normal things Japanese people (well, college students) do, minus the schooling and work. However, I want to clear up a misconception I see all over the internetz. The "punks" in Japan are not as prominent as the internetz make them out to be. Even in Harujuku, it is not common to see the “weirdos” (that’s what my very conservative buddy calls the Goths). Many people get their clothing from GAP or second hand stores. Most Japanese people in the “big city” are fashionable without wearing those items promoted in Japanese streetwear magazines. Basically what I am saying is that there are not "lots" of youth wearing those things and that they were heavily influenced by the Japanese magazines (they are great). And Japanese people are greatly influenced by idols (note: they always refer to stars as idols, as people they look up to rather than simply famous people).

Originally Posted by JLibourel

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I have never understood why "Oriental" became non-PC all of a sudden. I had to reprimand my former dentist for using the term.

If you don't understand the problem with the word 'oriental' then why on earth would you reprimand someone for using it?

Personally I don't let the crazy PC crowd tell me what words I can and cannot use.

Originally Posted by Viktri

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I can only say a bit here because I did not grow up in Japan. That said, I have never been to Japan as a tourist (I'm not into that stuff). When I was in Japan, I did the normal things Japanese people (well, college students) do, minus the schooling and work.

However, I want to clear up a misconception I see all over the internetz. The "punks" in Japan are not as prominent as the internetz make them out to be. Even in Harujuku, it is not common to see the "weirdos" (that's what my very conservative buddy calls the Goths). Many people get their clothing from GAP or second hand stores. Most Japanese people in the "big city" are fashionable without wearing those items promoted in Japanese streetwear magazines.

Basically what I am saying is that there are not "lots" of youth wearing those things and that they were heavily influenced by the Japanese magazines (they are great). And Japanese people are greatly influenced by idols (note: they always refer to stars as idols, as people they look up to rather than simply famous people).

I agree with what you're saying. What drives the Japanese youth consumption market is definitely the : I saw Idol x wearing it + I saw the gear in one of the clothing bibles, the proportions of freaks is still staggering when compared to anywhere else. I mean designers like Bernard Wilhelm, Bless and Jeremy Scott make most of their business over there and by a wide margin. Westwood still sells very well and so do Paul Smith and more "domesticated" english designers.

Originally Posted by JLibourel

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Since no one else seems to want to play the game, the answer is the USC Trojans, Troy being a city of Asia Minor. Everybody is so attuned to using "Asians" as a synonym for "East Asians" that they overlook the Trojans. I pulled this on a professor of classics who was teaching a course in Homer at that time, and even he missed it. It's rather ironic, since the area around Troy was the original "Asia," and the term came to be applied to all points east of that!

While you raise many valid classical points, let me remind you that when we refer to USC, the politically correct term is Trojan-Americans.

Technically, Troy predates Herodotus, and 'twas it not he who mused first about the word?

- B

Originally Posted by Fuuma

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I agree with what you're saying. What drives the Japanese youth consumption market is definitely the : I saw Idol x wearing it + I saw the gear in one of the clothing bibles, the proportions of freaks is still staggering when compared to anywhere else. I mean designers like Bernard Wilhelm, Bless and Jeremy Scott make most of their business over there and by a wide margin. Westwood still sells very well and so do Paul Smith and more "domesticated" english designers.

The Japanese are also a significant market for Savile Row, quality shoes, and I think even some of the Italians bespoke makers travel there or at least have RTW presence there.


- B

Yup, the proportion of “weirdos” in Japan is still higher than all the other countries I’ve visited. I just want to caution people not to have their hopes too high. It seems like Japan is full of these super-dressers because one guy in Japan goes to the equivalent of a fashion show in NYC and takes all these pictures and everyone thinks that is how Japanese people dress.

I am not familiar with Bernard Wilhelm, Bless and Jeremy Scott so I’m not entirely sure what you are getting at. Unless you believed my argument was against the English style. Personally, I love PS and English style and most of my formalwear is British influenced. That said, tweed is not something I would wear.

Note: So that I don't look like I'm running around in circles, Japan is significantly cooler than HK and China. It is about Vancouver temperature. Even then, don’t expect Japanese youth in tweed jackets. Reading the internet is the worst way to learn about another culture. Otherwise you'd end up thinking that by heading to Tokyo that you'd see someone in a tweed SR suit and expensive Japanese shoes. Odds are you won't.

I saw a caucasian with a tweed looking jacket on, with leather elbow patches the other day and was thinking Proffesor. I wonder if that look would look good on a south east asian, japanese, oriental or whatever way you want to put it type skin?

The man was wearing jeans, and i was thinking that didnt seem right in pulling off the proffesor look though. He was looking too stylish. I was thinking he needed some cord type jeans or coudroy type trousers. I think coudroy is the word im after.

Originally Posted by JLibourel

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Since no one else seems to want to play the game, the answer is the USC Trojans

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Originally Posted by JibranKhan

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Why do people incessantly use the word Asian to refer exclusively to East Asians?

because indian people aren't asian?