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Trad 3-button

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
This came up in a recent thread: how the Italians and the Americans do 3-button coats differently.  I couldn't find a great picture, however.  JohnMS has found one for me, though he posted it for a different purpose.  (Still: thanks, John.). http://www.bensilver.com/fs_stor....ize=ALL You can clearly see that this is a 2-button suit, with an extra buttonhole and button added.  The top buttonhole is basically folded in half because of the lapel roll.  Back in the day, the Brooks or Chipp tailor would finish both sides of the top buttonhole, since you could see the "underside" most of the time.  You can't see the top button at all.  The prep school/East Side tradition -- passed down from father to son -- was to cut the top button off once you bought the suit. edited to correct the attribution of the original link
post #2 of 15
link didn't work
post #3 of 15
For my second Chan suit, I had the suit made as a true 3-roll-2 button. On the suit, you can clearly see the top button hole, which indeed is just about folded in half. I also had it done with a ticket pocket, but unlike American trad is has a very nipped waist and slightly shorter in length (32.25", whereas most coats in 40R are 32.5"), and is also double vented. Some my see my styling choice as a gaffe, but I thought it unique and I like the suit very much.
post #4 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
link didn't work
Curious. Doesn't work for me, either, but it did a few minutes ago. Maybe there's something wrong with the Ben Silver site.
post #5 of 15
The link seems to be working now. As per Manton's statement on buttonhole finishing, both the vintage 3-button Southwick suit I recently acquired and my newer model J Press 3-button sport coat have the buttonhole finished with the roll, ie, the opposite side of the other two buttonholes, so that the finished side shows. I checked my Oxxford 3-button suit--the top button isn't sack-suit roll, but it works better unbottoned, and is slightly within the roll--and both sides of all three buttonholes look pretty much the same. And that's why I wanted an Oxxford.
post #6 of 15
What I found humorous is this: "Original price $1,025.00. Now significantly reduced." Sale price: $715.00 If that's "˜significant' what's greatly? I mean its only 30% off retail. Jon.
post #7 of 15
Same cut is found on my dark gray blue label RL suit.
post #8 of 15
Interesting, I was wondering why my 3-button Brooks Bros suit looks like a 2-button with an extra button/buttonhole at the top. Now I know
post #9 of 15
Quote:
What I found humorous is this: "Original price $1,025.00. Now significantly reduced." Sale price: $715.00 If that's "˜significant' what's greatly? I mean its only 30% off retail.
They say that on all the stuff in their "Outlet" section no matter how big the reduction. Some things really do get a big markdown.
post #10 of 15
Might as well just post the image here... Manton, is there anything deliberate about the way lapel edges are fashioned into either a sharp "V" outline or a curved "U"?  You can see the latter sort of curvature in this picture, although it might just be an issue of the wearer pulling on the suit in this case.  Canali's DB suits are a bona fide example; the edges of the lapels are explicitly convex. I always find this detail off-putting; I'd much rather see a sharp V, unless the jacket actually has shawl lapels.
post #11 of 15
Very interesting. I actually prefer the 'U' shaped lapels over the 'V'.  Here are a couple of cases in point: Though, there's nothing wrong with a 'V' like this one: Here's a pic of a suit with concave lapels.
post #12 of 15
That 'bellied' shape helps the lapel to lay flat better, if that is the look one is going for. As shown in the pics above, the 'U' shaped lapels are flatter, while the V or concave lapels roll far more gradually. It also creates a visual illusion of a bigger chest, which may tend to minimize one's waist. A pronounced and deep shawl shape always looks to me to emphasize the waist/belly, as there the convex portion is lower.
post #13 of 15
Quote:
It also creates a visual illusion of a bigger chest, which may tend to minimize one's waist.
...not that any of us here needs that. Good analysis.  I like the gradual lapel roll in R78L's last 2 photos.  And as for my waistline, let's just say it doesn't need any "help".  I feel the same about those formal vests that have a "bib" or U-shaped shirt reveal...much prefer the V there too. Although, I actually like the navy DB Renault posted. The curvature is subtle, and I like a high gorge.  The Canalis that turn me off are much more pronounced in this regard; maybe I can dig up a photo or two... Yup: Wait... This is a "trad" thread-- am I even allowed to discuss DB?  
post #14 of 15
Thread Starter 
I don't mind a rounded lapel on a single-breasted suit. On a two-button, it can look rather nice. On a 2 1/2, I think a concave lapel looks better. And I positively hate convex lapels on DB suits. This is why I never get DB suits made in Savile Row, since that is they way they all make them. Give me a nice, angular, pointy DB made in Italy or New York any day.
post #15 of 15
Here's one, on Thomas Mahon's website: http://www.thomasmahon.co.uk/page1.htm
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