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Multi-sourcing bespoke - Page 2

post #16 of 26
let me suggest something else, entirly. think about how many shirts you need over the next few years. how much are they worth to you. find a good shirtmaker someplace else (and my first choice would be bankok). fly over, get the shirts made, have a few days to enjoy the city, and go home. you can order future orders by mail. if you want to have better quality, at a higher price, do the same but fly to italy. you'll pay $20 in most of asia for a bespoke handmade shirt of pretty good quality. figure in $1000 for the week trip (but you get a little vacation out of it. you get 20 shirts for $1400.
post #17 of 26
I have seen the shirts made in some of those third world countires. Not always very nice. they also do not have great fabric or trimmings. You would have to show up with your own fabric buttons and interlinings.
post #18 of 26
I would agree that the fabric selection is not always that great, although it isn't always to bad, either. the quality can be very good, if you have the right person. I am not going to argue that they are as good as the best you can get in the UK or Italy (I have no real experience with US bespoke shirtmakers but lets put them in with the brits and italians here) but if you are looking for a way to save money on bespoke clothing that it what I would suggest.
post #19 of 26
The various members, especially the shirtmakers, gave some excellent arguments against this proposal. From my own vantage point as a clothing enthusiast who is not in the business, do you really want to become your own shirtmaker and deal with the hassles of working with different factories and craftsmen, shipping, customs, misunderstood instructions, damages, etc.? I have worked with a bespoke clothier who has others make the shirts and suits that he sells. The clothier takes the measurements and is involved in the pattern and fitting process. He doesn't have one factory cut the cloth, another sew the shirt, and a third do the finishing. He hands-off the entire job to one shirtmaker who does the works.
post #20 of 26
Thread Starter 
Thanks everybody for the replies. I am surprised that virtually no one sees this as a reasonable idea. Oh well. Also, no one commented on the portion of my post about the benefits of hand-sewing the shoulder. Are these justifications flimsy, or do they have some weight? Shirtmaven: I apologized because my post "disgust[ed]" you and because you found my attitude "dispicable". Do you think $500 is what I will be looking at for a pattern? If it really costs that much, shirtmakers must have to sell quite a few shirts per customer to recover that cost. I would have assumed that after, say, five shirts the pattern cost would be recouped, but this cannot be correct. Minimal: I am sure that many companies liscense their intellectual property, but this is presumptively inefficient. Why? Marginal cost pricing. Now companies can do this licensing despite the inefficiency because they have a monopoly -- Carl and Alex do not. I am hopeful that some pattern maker will agree to work with me, should I decide to follow this plan (increasingly unlikely, given the general sentiment of the board).
post #21 of 26
Another problem in hiring a pattern maker to make a pattern is that you wont' know if the pattern acheives what you want until the first shirts are produced. After the initial shirts you would have to return and have the pattern changed to reflect that changes that you agree on. You'll have to hope that the pattern maker makes the changes to your liking. Then you'll have to pray that the manufacturer follows the new pattern. If you do "one stop shopping" with a reputable shirtmaker, you save all of this hassle and trial and error. Most of the mistakes will be on the shirtmaker's nickel. Furthermore, you'll save money by not experimenting in the shirt manufacturing business.
post #22 of 26
My first (paying) job in the needle trades was as the manager of Long Island's largest fabric store. We had, courtesy of Brother Sewing Machine, a 20 machine teaching studio in one corner of the store. There, I and a few members of my staff taught people how to sew. After not a long learning curve, many of them became quite good, albeit slow. The suggestion made by Minimal is actually a rather good one if you have the time and interest.
Now, as to the question of hand-sewing the armholes. I have read that this is superior to machine work for two reasons. First, hand stitching is less tight than machine stitching, and so the sleeve and shirt body are more disconnected. The result is that the shirt front moves less in response to arm movement. Second, it allows for a wider sleeve to be fit into a narrower shoulder hole, as the Napoli tailors do. This is ostensibly more comfortable, affording greater freedom of movement. Can our resident shirtmakers opine on whether there is any merit to these two points?
There is no merit. Read my other posts and Carls similar answer. I am tired of reattaching formerly hand-sewn sleeves on shirts my clients have received as gifts.
post #23 of 26
Thread Starter 
Alex: Do you know why the puckered Napoli shoulder came into being? What was its original purpose, and why that purpose has faded? By the way, doe that shoulder construction have a name? I am always frustrated at having to describe it by the region in which one sees it produced most often. Two pictures of the particular method of attachment I speak of are in post five of this thread: http://www.styleforum.net/cgi-bin....010&st=
post #24 of 26
It is not against the law to copy a garment in the United States. To my knowledge this is only a crime in France. Several years ago Ralph Lauren copied an old YSL gown. They could not sue RL in the U.S. so they sued him and won in France. J has the best idea. Purchase a ready made or custom made shirt that you like, take it apart, and make a paper copy of the patten. If you decide to go to Thailand by all means get your fabric here, as the labor is about 20% of the cost of a custom garment there.
post #25 of 26
JDMcDaniel Maybe I have confused you. It does not cost $500 to make a pattern. That cost would also include a first sample garment. Again the needlework might not be as fine as what a shirtmaker turns out. I make my money by selling shirts. The cost of making patterns is worked into the shirt cost.  Also the cost of Rent, electric, advertising, the cost to carry inventory, so on and so forth. Hence the reason for minimum orders. The Pattern maker makes money by selling the patterns. Today most pattern work is done on computer. First patterns must still be made by hand, they are then scaned into the computer, and then graded by computer. Then printed by computer. There is a great book by David Coffin on shirtmaking.
post #26 of 26
Thread Starter 
Shirtmaking: Developing Skills for Fine Sewing, by David Coffin Reviews are excellent at Amazon, and it is still in print: http://www.amazon.com/exec....=507846 Carl, thank you for the reference. I may try to purchase it for holiday reading.
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