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Ghosts? - Page 15

post #211 of 312
Are they real?

Ghost Photographs.
post #212 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enzo View Post
There are two kinds of hauntings, one is when a house is haunted and another kind of haunting is when spirits are attracted to a certain person because they have the ability to sense them. I believe I fall into that second category.

You've got me thinking. Is there a pattern to who gets haunted?

Among those who've experienced definitive hauntings:

(1) Is there a (reverse?) correlation between ghost-experiences and educational attainment (at the time of the experience)?

(2) Is there a correlation between ghost-experiences and religious upbringing?

(3) Is there a correlation between ghost-experiences and having a parent/older family member who had ghost-experiences?

(4) Is there a (reverse?) correlation between ghost-experiences and age?

What do you think? Can anyone suggest any other possibilities?
post #213 of 312
There is a lovely book by Morris Berman titled THE REENCHANTMENT OF THE WORLD. I believe in the pursuit of truth, no matter how painfull the results may be to the inquirer. Mankind has Occam's razor, organised skeptics who explain phenomenon or debunk frauds and the ever greater revelations of science. We know the feeling of Deja Vu can be explained, our brain a largely uncharted world of it's own with wonders and poweres yet discovered. It's right and proper to be curios about the seeming supernatural and bring it into the natural. But, there is fortuitously for humanity still a wonderland of magic and mystery to play in. It may very well be merely a former orange grove in Anahiem. But it still has no lack of E ticket holders.The naysayers would have us sitting in traffic.
post #214 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. J View Post
You've got me thinking. Is there a pattern to who gets haunted?

Among those who've experienced definitive hauntings:

(1) Is there a (reverse?) correlation between ghost-experiences and educational attainment (at the time of the experience)?

(2) Is there a correlation between ghost-experiences and religious upbringing?

(3) Is there a correlation between ghost-experiences and having a parent/older family member who had ghost-experiences?

(4) Is there a (reverse?) correlation between ghost-experiences and age?

What do you think? Can anyone suggest any other possibilities?

Dr. J I'll answer your questions the best that I can, and anyone else can feel free to jump in too.

(1) I honestly have no clue about that. I consider myself a pretty smart guy, and I have always done well in school. While I've always put stock in science I've never denied the possibility that there may be another dimension of existence out there that we haven't found yet. I think educational attainment only affects your experiences in this context if you let it narrow your mind.

(2) In some cases I think there is a definite correlation. Some religions believe that there are spirits and evil entities that we cannot see. In Catholicism we are taught about demons and demonic possession and spirits that roam around. In some religions, I can't remember the names unfortunately, they believe that once you die your spirit is gone and that it's impossible for a human spirits to continue to exist without a body. Through those teachings your perceptions of the world around you could be affected. Like I said, some hauntings are caused by the person and not by the environment. If you're not open to the messages they are sending then the ghosts around you won't even try and make contact.

(3) There is a definite correlation. For example, my mother has had prophetic dreams before. She's had dreams about people and have then met that person a week or so later. I believe the ability to sense these things run in families. And also, like I said, if parents believe these things are possible then they teach they're children that they are possible. Parents help shape us, and some of what they believe takes hold in us. They can either open our minds to these things or close them off. My mother never told me about the dreams she has until I started experiencing all these things. She never discouraged my belief, but she never encouraged it either and I still experienced these things.

(4) From my personal experience I'd say absolutely. My grandfather died when I was 8. He wasn't ready to die. We were always close and he wanted to be around to see me make my first communion and grow up. One night I woke up and I saw him in my doorway and he was glowing like a rainbow. The next morning I wrote it off as a dream, but after I was haunted those times I started to consider that I actually saw my grandfather's spirit because he wanted to see me that one last time.

It's also documented that children are more innocent, trusting and open minded, which allows them to perceive things adults cannot. Spirits and demons alike (if you believe in demons) will always try and corrupt the young because they are easier to contact/control.

Hope I answered your questions.
post #215 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. J View Post
You've got me thinking. Is there a pattern to who gets haunted?

Among those who've experienced definitive hauntings:

(1) Is there a (reverse?) correlation between ghost-experiences and educational attainment (at the time of the experience)?

In the US, according to raw data from the 2004 General Social Survey, those with graduate degrees were the least likely to believe in the afterlife or the Bible as the word of God, suggesting a link between religious belief and lower educational attainment. I suppose ghosts would be considered "afterlife".
post #216 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by rxcats View Post
In the US, according to raw data from the 2004 General Social Survey, those with graduate degrees were the least likely to believe in the afterlife or the Bible as the word of God, suggesting a link between religious belief and lower educational attainment. I suppose ghosts would be considered "afterlife".

oh...so, you've chosen to use questionable data from a thoroughly unscientific study to conclude that a group (which includes yourself, of course) is more educated and presumably more intelligent...well, congratulations...

but, in the interest of good science, if you'd ever like to go head-to-head with me in an iq test showdown, i'd be more than willing to see if the results support your hypotheses
post #217 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyc_gaucho View Post
oh...so, you've chosen to use questionable data from a thoroughly unscientific study to conclude that a group (which includes yourself, of course) is more educated and presumably more intelligent...well, congratulations...

but, in the interest of good science, if you'd ever like to go head-to-head with me in an iq test showdown, i'd be more than willing to see if the results support your hypotheses

+1

I only finished undergrad studies and my IQ has been tested at over 140, so the suppostion must be that all the non-believers/non-experienced who attended or finished grad studies are of a higher qotient. Woe is me...
post #218 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyc_gaucho View Post
oh...so, you've chosen to use questionable data from a thoroughly unscientific study to conclude that a group (which includes yourself, of course) is more educated and presumably more intelligent...well, congratulations... but, in the interest of good science, if you'd ever like to go head-to-head with me in an iq test showdown, i'd be more than willing to see if the results support your hypotheses
I just knew I would get this reaction. The sarcasm is really not necessary or warranted. I was just trying to answer the question asked: "You've got me thinking. Is there a pattern to who gets haunted? (1) Is there a (reverse?) correlation between ghost-experiences and educational attainment (at the time of the experience)" I suppose if I said there was no correlation, not citing any references or studies, it would have been gladly accepted. Are you suggesting that people with higher educational levels/IQ are more likely to believe in the supernatural; do you know of any studies supporting this? If my IQ is higher or lower than yours it wouldn't really prove a point; it's not a large enough sample I'm afraid. Most people believe in God no matter what their educational level or IQ is; there is really no question about that. I do believe that there is a increasing number of atheist in people with higher levels of education. You will probably find far fewer atheist in a trailer park than at a university, however the number of believers relative to non-believers is still much higher in both. Part of the reason may be the "culture" of a university and not just the education itself. I know the OP's question was regarding ghosts, but I think there is probably some correlation between people who believe in God/afterlife and ghosts. Both require some degree of faith and a belief in the supernatural. I am NOT suggesting that I am smarter or have a higher IQ than you; I don't know you and you don't know me. I am reasonably intelligent. My IQ was tested when I was a kid and was somewhere in the 120's. That is better than average, but many people, some of whom are believers, have higher IQs than I do. I personally know someone with MUCH higher IQ than mine and she is a devout Catholic.
post #219 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Deacon View Post
+1

I only finished undergrad studies and my IQ has been tested at over 140, so the suppostion must be that all the non-believers/non-experienced who attended or finished grad studies are of a higher qotient. Woe is me...

Congratulations on your high IQ! It is higher than mine, so non-believers MUST be the dumber ones.

I will assume your post was entirely sarcasm too. If not, you aren't as bright as you claim to be. No were in my post did I say or imply that ALL non-believers were smarter than ALL believers. That would be absolutely ridiculous. If I said smoking increases your risk of lung cancer relative to not smoking, I would not be stating that all smokers get lung cancer and non-smokers never get lung cancer; is it easier for you to understand the concept when put in that way?
post #220 of 312
let's talk about ghosts now.
post #221 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by rxcats View Post
I just knew I would get this reaction. The sarcasm is really not necessary or warranted. I was just trying to answer the question asked:

"You've got me thinking. Is there a pattern to who gets haunted? (1) Is there a (reverse?) correlation between ghost-experiences and educational attainment (at the time of the experience)"

I suppose if I said there was no correlation, not citing any references or studies, it would have been gladly accepted. Are you suggesting that people with higher educational levels/IQ are more likely to believe in the supernatural; do you know of any studies supporting this?

If my IQ is higher or lower than yours it wouldn't really prove a point; it's not a large enough sample I'm afraid. Most people believe in God no matter what their educational level or IQ is; there is really no question about that. I do believe that there is a increasing number of atheist in people with higher levels of education. You will probably find far fewer atheist in a trailer park than at a university, however the number of believers relative to non-believers is still much higher in both. Part of the reason may be the "culture" of a university and not just the education itself. I know the OP's question was regarding ghosts, but I think there is probably some correlation between people who believe in God/afterlife and ghosts. Both require some degree of faith and a belief in the supernatural.

I am NOT suggesting that I am smarter or have a higher IQ than you; I don't know you and you don't know me. I am reasonably intelligent. My IQ was tested when I was a kid and was somewhere in the 120's. That is better than average, but many people, some of whom are believers, have higher IQs than I do. I personally know someone with MUCH higher IQ than mine and she is a devout Catholic.

your signature makes it plain...you are of a mind that people with spiritual beliefs affirming a belief in god or of an afterlife are creepy, insane, delusional folks...and, you come into a thread where people would like to share experiences of a spiritual nature to espouse these extremely offensive ideas...this makes you a dick...

then you shit on us some more by suggesting that those who believe in things not in line with your brand of atheism are less educated and more stupid...so fuck you...

but, now you are backtracking by pretending to be even-handed and just fairly answering a question...there was no sarcasm in my response...your logic is flawed and unsupported...your approach is unappreciated and insincere...if you're gonna be a dick, be a dick all the way...it's more respectable...

or, maybe you should give up being a dick, stand back, open your mind and allow for the possiblity that there is something greater out there than your narrow point of view can catch sight of
post #222 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by shoe View Post
let's talk about ghosts now.

not quite yet
post #223 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by rxcats View Post
In the US, according to raw data from the 2004 General Social Survey, those with graduate degrees were the least likely to believe in the afterlife or the Bible as the word of God, suggesting a link between religious belief and lower educational attainment. I suppose ghosts would be considered "afterlife".
Rxcats, your response was in no way an answer to the question you quoted except for the extremely small cross section of people who believe solely because of paranormal experience (and even that's a stretch). Any further correlation between ghost sightings and educational level is just conjecture on your part. This makes me suspicious that you just really wanted to quote that stat in this discussion.
post #224 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyc_gaucho View Post
your signature makes it plain...you are of a mind that people with spiritual beliefs affirming a belief in god or of an afterlife are creepy, insane, delusional folks...and, you come into a thread where people would like to share experiences of a spiritual nature to espouse these extremely offensive ideas...this makes you a dick...

then you shit on us some more by suggesting that those who believe in things not in line with your brand of atheism are less educated and more stupid...so fuck you...

but, now you are backtracking by pretending to be even-handed and just fairly answering a question...there was no sarcasm in my response...your logic is flawed and unsupported...your approach is unappreciated and insincere...if you're gonna be a dick, be a dick all the way...it's more respectable...

or, maybe you should give up being a dick, stand back, open your mind and allow for the possiblity that there is something greater out there than your narrow point of view can catch sight of

You are not sarcastic, just nasty and rude. I have seen many signature lines that I assume should not be taken literally; mine is one of them. I wasn't back tracking from anything. My original post was very short and you read far more into it than intended; that is not my problem. I am sorry I posted here; I didn't realize it was open to only those with one particular point of view. You are a jerk!
post #225 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by rxcats View Post
You are not sarcastic, just nasty and rude. I have seen many signature lines that I assume should not be taken literally; mine is one of them. I wasn't back tracking from anything. My original post was very short and you read far more into it than intended; that is not my problem. I am sorry I posted here; I didn't realize it was open to only those with one particular point of view. You are a jerk!

ok...so, you're a dick, and i'm a jerk...but, the thing is, if you really don't understand the openly hostile and arrogant nature of your signature (and statements in this thread) then i think you have more to ponder than the existence of god
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