THE ESEF Skys

Originally Posted by poly800rock

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nudies weren't $285 until 2005 or so. They were still under 200. I got mine for $165ish back in 04. Nudie was also already an established swedish brand. Only when they signed a distro deal for North America did the price jack up like that
I thought nudies were only 285 because it was the japan selvedge kind and that their overall prices gotten higher because the US dollar has gotten weaker year after year.

ESEF didn't jack up the price, because all their jeans they sold were "promotions" at 100 dollars. that promotion lasted three cuts and people seem to expect them to stay at that price when they are actually 285. ESEFs downfall is that he done the promotion so much that people feel like it is the regular price.

i do agree with not having a proven product as well that ESEF doesn't know who is his market.

nudies (RRDS) were $165 for me at famous friends in nyc in 2004. This was before they had real North American distro. The US distro (2005) jacked the price which has remained at $285 for some time now. At least from what I remember.

oh, i stand correct because i was going post-2005 and not 2004.

and DAMN!

Originally Posted by whodini

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I still can't believe Nudie US retail for their selvage stuff. There's no way that their denim should be price competing with 5EP and many repro brands. So yeah, perhaps your sale analogy isn't far off.

Exactly. I've been saying it for awhile now that for the quality of denim and indigo, Nudie is absolutely not worth the price.

.... or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe brands like The Flat Head, 5ep, Sugar Cane, Ironheart, etc are all just UNDERpriced.

Originally Posted by onion

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Maybe brands like The Flat Head, 5ep, Sugar Cane, Ironheart, etc are all just UNDERpriced.

Hold that thought for a minute...

Originally Posted by Steven of ESEF

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]Also our denim mill
strongly suggests that we sell all of our denims for 220 +. They have
Iron heart as a client and they use a lower grade cotton than us and
they sell for 260 at least.

I think the cheap initial offering price was a good idea to get jeans into people's hands, particularly given the need for denim fans to see fit pictures and learn how denim breaks in before most people will spend lots of money on a pair.

But it sounds like they need to up their production numbers to try to produce them at a cheaper per unit cost. There is nothing about those jeans that bump them above the level of Iron Heart (the most obvious comparison) to make up for the lack of name recognition and question customer service. I am not saying they need to go into Naked and Famous territory or anything, but if they could offer a 21oz denim in a good cut at the same price as the 14.5oz models of other brands ($245ish) then they'd have some sort of reason for people to choose them over establish brands.

I just don't get what the selling point of these is at the new price.

Originally Posted by chris902

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I think the cheap initial offering price was a good idea to get jeans into people's hands, particularly given the need for denim fans to see fit pictures and learn how denim breaks in before most people will spend lots of money on a pair.

But it sounds like they need to up their production numbers to try to produce them at a cheaper per unit cost. There is nothing about those jeans that bump them above the level of Iron Heart (the most obvious comparison) to make up for the lack of name recognition and question customer service. I am not saying they need to go into Naked and Famous territory or anything, but if they could offer a 21oz denim in a good cut at the same price as the 14.5oz models of other brands ($245ish) then they'd have some sort of reason for people to choose them over establish brands.

I just don't get what the selling point of these is at the new price.

YOU'RE MlSSING THE BIG PICTURE!

Originally Posted by onion

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Exactly. I've been saying it for awhile now that for the quality of denim and indigo, Nudie is absolutely not worth the price. .... or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe brands like The Flat Head, 5ep, Sugar Cane, Ironheart, etc are all just UNDERpriced.

Yeah..."underpriced." Nudie selvage should not be running more than $200. It's an arbitrary number but to me it seems like the gateway number between great cuts/average denim and great cuts/great denim/great details. Nudie's a fine brand and I enjoy the pairs I own including the SSDS that I happened to purchase on sale for $120 which is clearly not a legit retail price for something like that. But if I pick up that SSDS and compare it to my 5EPs while saying that they both retail $270, just how much do you think I'm going to laugh? Back on to ESEF, even while the people that own pairs have nothing but great things to say, I can't be the only one with a Nudie-like example in the back of my mind.

I know this thread is about the skys, but anybody get any nice wear out of their Oris? I think I'll just wash mine. They're kind of sticky and feel gross. Anyways, pics of progress would be nice.

Originally Posted by Arethusa

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I'm just pissed that there's no way I'll ever get the straight leg cut at the preorder price. Wasn't ever interested in the Oris and Skys because of the cut, though they seemed solid if that's the kind of cut you like (these were pretty much made for GS). I have to say I am finding the backlash against esef pretty amusing and mostly ridiculous.

Wait, so they've changed the cut from the Ori/Sky measurements? Can someone confirm?

Also, I seem to recall part of the deal being people who preordered the Oris getting 30% on every subsequent pair...anyone else remember this?

Originally Posted by padronlover

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I kinda got my self into a jam, Since I was selling the jeans for
lower than it costs to make + shipping, people that didnt know that
are posting about how crazy it is that I raised my prices. The prices
are to be competitive to the brands I compare to. Also our denim mill
strongly suggests that we sell all of our denims for 220 +. They have
Iron heart as a client and they use a lower grade cotton than us and
they sell for 260 at least.

I won't cite a source, so feel free to ignore me here, but:

This statement (cut from the ESEF letter) is a blatant lie. It's not a sorta-kinda-iffy-statement, it's completely false.

For IH money, using inferior denim, they could at least chainstitch the hems.

Originally Posted by Bona Drag

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Wait, so they've changed the cut from the Ori/Sky measurements? Can someone confirm?

Also, I seem to recall part of the deal being people who preordered the Oris getting 30% on every subsequent pair...anyone else remember this?
Depends on which version of the cut you're talking about. In the SuFu thread, I remember reading how people had ordered a size 31, for example, thinking that they'd size down 1 from a 32 based on the given measurements and for stretching. ESEF then changed the model of the cut so that the 31 was more like a 30 so that stretching would be accounted for. Basically, if you didn't get your "regular" waist then you were screwed. Maybe I have some of the specifics wrong but that was the main idea.

i thought they gave people the wrong size

whodini is right, I read that thread not too long ago and originally the jeans were going to be cut with one set of measurements that guys preordered off (something like size down 2), then the actual jeans turned out to be different so that they ended up being too small when the jeans were delivered.

Originally Posted by Get Smart

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whodini is right
Dear , Next time you're going to start a post like that, feel free to stop right after that sentence. People will automatically catch your drift.