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Thoughts on the Sartorialist - Page 8

post #106 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by wojt View Post

well there are some universal behaviours and values across all cultures and it would be a good starting point to look at them if you want to make some general statements about human sexuality, i guess you could draw some conlusions from that.

This is a very strong statement. Unfortunately, too strong.  The only universal behavior is that human beings across all cultures engage in sexual activity.  What is valued varies greatly between cultures, even with "global culture", and definitely have varied with time, even in the past few decades.  Looking at the changing body types and sexual behaviors in both mainstream media and various forms of pornography illustrates this very clearly. It's also unclear the actual relationship between the hierarchy of values and the "needs" of a society.

 

Re those studies: there are so many potential problems with them.

post #107 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by LA Guy View Post
 

Re those studies: there are so many potential problems with them.

 

Eyup.

post #108 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by LA Guy View Post

This is a very strong statement. Unfortunately, too strong.  The only universal behavior is that human beings across all cultures engage in sexual activity.  What is valued varies greatly between cultures, even with "global culture", and definitely have varied with time, even in the past few decades.  Looking at the changing body types and sexual behaviors in both mainstream media and various forms of pornography illustrates this very clearly. It's also unclear the actual relationship between the hierarchy of values and the "needs" of a society.

There are some constants.Like social status, height, intelligence, self-confidence and sense of humour are universally attractive to women across cultures.
Edited by wojt - 8/5/16 at 4:02pm
post #109 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by wojt View Post


So social status, height, intelligence, self-confidence and sense of humour are not universally attractive to women across cultures?


Hahaha, no. With the possible exception of intelligence being that it is a survival advantage, but you could even make strong arguments against that.

post #110 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by wojt View Post

So social status, height, intelligence, self-confidence and sense of humour are not universally attractive to women across cultures?

"Sense of humor" is especially culturally dependent.  The idea of a mate as also a companion is VERY culturally based.

post #111 of 142

Even height being an attractive feature is probably culturally dependent. Desmond Morris made a good argument that people generally tend to find physical averages attractive, with either men or women who tend toward physical extremes being considered somewhat undesirable, to include the very tall or very muscular among men, the very large breasted or wide hipped among women.

post #112 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caustic Man View Post

Hahaha, no. With the possible exception of intelligence being that it is a survival advantage, but you could even make strong arguments against that.

That's why crappy harlequin novels sell across cultures, because the male archetype is not so much diffrent wheter it is Japan, India, Europe or USA. I think it's reasonable to atribute it to evolved female desire. Male desire evolved diffrently than females and men mostly focus on attractiveness, there's a lot of proof for both these claims if you ever would like to look it up. And ofc these are only 2 of universals that are ingrained in us by hundred of thousands of years of evolution.
post #113 of 142

Again, what do you think could be wrong with those studies?

post #114 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caustic Man View Post
 

Even height being an attractive feature is probably culturally dependent. Desmond Morris made a good argument that people generally tend to find physical averages attractive, with either men or women who tend toward physical extremes being considered somewhat undesirable, to include the very tall or very muscular among men, the very large breasted or wide hipped among women.

I think that what one factor that one must be considered very carefully is the social pressure to be seen to subscribe to specific, cultural values that correlate with specific physical characteristics.  Just as an example, in our culture, athleticism, including in women, is one of those values.  However, even in our culture, that was a perceptible shift.  I need to find the reference, but a fairly prominent writer in the 19th century wrote disparagingly that one woman had "legs that could have been on an 8 minute cycler." (I am paraphrasing here.)  Compare that to the #fitspiration pics all over instagram today.

post #115 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caustic Man View Post

Again, what do you think could be wrong with those studies?

i think only thing that is wrong with them is that you haven't read them


the guy is Prof in evolutionary psychology

if you ever get round to reading books, papers on the subject you will find that there is a lot of evidence for innate diffrences in male and female sexuality, i'd recommend it if you're a geek or vulcan because it's fascinating
post #116 of 142

Another anecdote that illustrates it is that of an American linguist who lived with a primitive South American group for decades with his family. His children grew up with them as well. When a South American of European descent commented on how ugly the natives were the the children of the American linguist couldn't understand why he said that. They thought the natives, whose standards they grew up emerged in, were beautiful. Detailed in the book "Don't Sleep, There Are Snakes". Recommended.

post #117 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by wojt View Post


i think only thing that is wrong with them is that you haven't read them

 

I'm sorry to say that this answer is evidence to me that you either have not thought deeply about this subject, or are unwilling to discuss it honestly. No disrespect intended, but thinking critically about evidence that supports your assumptions is of the highest importance. Even I may admit that the evidence that supports my claims isn't perfect.

post #118 of 142
okay fair enough, if you can please watch the video and tell me what was wrong with that study/claims in the video
post #119 of 142

Why don't you send me a link to the actual study? Academic papers are full of things like methodology, citations, and detailed claims that a 6 minute video cannot substitute for. Even the links you provided didn't link to actual studies, but rather exceedingly brief articles on the subject. I'm being serious, if you want me to review evidence, send me real evidence (i.e.: the actual studies), preferably that you have read yourself so that we can discuss it intelligently. 

post #120 of 142

I'm not just saying that as a bluff btw. Academics is my deal.

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