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On Jacket Length - Page 2

post #16 of 34
Thread Starter 

Disclaimer: musings of an academic who got tired of reading a paper for a meeting but still wanted to do some theorizing.

 

I thought I would add a thought about the interaction of waist suppression and short jackets. When these are exaggerated, then you are closer to this effect:

 


Just focus on the waist and hip. That combination is appealing on women's blazers but on men's tailoring, it is less attractive. Note that current men's trends tend to flirt in this direction or go all out toward it. Not recommended. 

 

The shorter jacket serves to emphasize the hips which is why we speak of covering the ass. Add stark waist suppression and...

 

Contrast: The C&M suit above radiates strength and masculinity. 

 

If people want to give examples of what not to do in an otherwise tasteful and tailored individual, that's fine.

 

Challenge: find cases where people otherwise look good but where jacket length fails.

post #17 of 34
In reply to @TweedyProf's comment:

Quote:
Originally Posted by TweedyProf View Post

One note: your rule of thumb presupposes having a sense of the mean of one's ideal range which is what the OP is trying to help people learn to figure out for themselves. 

Unless you have a very disproportionate body shape (which needs to be addressed on a case by case basis) a good starting point with a classic jacket length hits your thumb knuckle. It can be shorter if you prefer a more fashionable look. Lets call this a rule of thumb.



post #18 of 34


post #19 of 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by TweedyProf View Post
 

Disclaimer: musings of an academic who got tired of reading a paper for a meeting but still wanted to do some theorizing.

 

This very factor is what has created some pretty dumb threads however yours is not one of them. Great insights and I agree with pretty much all of it. 

post #20 of 34
Thread Starter 

@GusW 

 

I don't think we disagree, btw.

 

Still, if there's a disagreement, it's regarding emphasis. As I noted in the OP, the rule of thumb statistically hits the right range, but that's just a correlation. Knowing that doesn't aid one in understanding why the fits above work wrt length.  

 

One could, and should, just as well use a different rule (advice!): that your jackets should hit the fork of the trousers. Ignore the thumb.

 

That rule is satisfied by all the pictures you posted (Lapo--that's him right?--has the look of someone who dressed in a drunken haze).

 

The advantage of the fork landmark is that it makes clear, once it's explained why, that it ensures that your ass is covered. The thumb can move up and down from that point, but the variation between the fork and covering your ass is constant in any normally cut trouser. In that respect, aiming for the fork as the starting point is a more informative rule and should be the starting point (as per Advice 1 and 2).

 

But as I say, this is choosing what to emphasize, not a real disagreement. 

post #21 of 34
Thread Starter 
One last thought on Gus's interjection:
 
I was once asked in an interview to define "style". Not worth even trying, so I changed the question. What is it to be stylish in CM?
 
One should think of style as practice (an activity). There are principles of classic menswear that define a space of possibilities. Practically, one's style is finding a place within that wide space (one can also flout the principles too, and exit that space, though beware, danger lurks). Being stylish, in one's own way, is moving in that space in your own way.
 
In that respect, the fork advice is the anchor point against which variation in jacket length should revolve.
 
Crompton's two pics give some indication of this, although one is SB and the other a DB, but the point is illustrated well there, consistent with Gus's earlier advice and Advice 4 above. Longer in the wedding fit; shorter in the linen jacket.
 
Ok, now back to what I get paid for...
post #22 of 34
My C&M suit looks very similar to the one posted above. That is the house cut (at least Joe Morgan's). My suit fits and is a perfectly fine suit, but it is longer than I prefer and the shoulder is stronger than I prefer.
post #23 of 34
@TweedyProf, this is a good addition to the discourse on jacket length. I'd add on a personal level that as a shorter guy (5ft7), I prefer jackets on the shorter end of the range and that this is a common (albeit not universal) preference among shorter guys. I end up having this preference for both suits and odd jackets. This gets to the unstated preference issue. If you prefer something on the shorter or longer end, I think you have a lesser margin of error in that direction and more in the other. If your preferences are middle of the road, you can probably get away with something that is around 0.75 inches shorter or longer (range of 1.5 inches or so). People who prefer a longer jacket are going to think a jacket on the shorter end of the range is too short and vice versa.

I very much share your views that it's very difficult to assess whether a jacket is too short based on a photo or two. Depending on camera angle / range, I've seen the exact same jacket look as much as two inches shorter or longer, more than enough to skew people's perceptions (plus if your sleeve gets caught or you are standing in an awkward position). I've also experienced the strange phenomenon of having people compliment one jacket of mine for being a perfect length while telling me another jacket (with identical length) is too short.
post #24 of 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by GusW View Post

So my rule of thumb is pretty easy:

- Formal dark suits (flap pockets, no "fun" socks, white or blue shirt, dark shoes) the length looks best on the longer side but not too long. This is not for travel jackets mixed with jeans. This is when you want a look of formality and authority. This will probably be dark navy.

- Classic sport coats, always cover your rear.

-Fashionable, travel and casual jackets- shorter looks best and looks "right". These will always have patch pockets, soft shoulder and worn mixed with sportswear, khakis, jeans, chinos, patterned shirts, distinctive shoes, etc. If you are middle-age you will look a bit younger going shorter. This is the jacket you want for travel, grabbing to head out to eat without a tie and to wear with more casual pants.

All this being said...length doesn't matter if the rest of the jacket isn't tailored properly.

Without a doubt, you consistently provide some of the best advice on this forum.
post #25 of 34

So,

 

I have a long torso and normal arms and thus the cover your back will look too long on me from the front. I decided however to give it a go when I found a great Raffaele Caruso Sartoria Parma suit in 50L. I normally wear 48-50 R in Raffaele Caruso but since the price was good I thought it a good opportunity to try a longer jacket than I usually wear.

 

After some serious thought and discussions with Tweedy I decided to have the jacket shortened since it looked too long and also felt too long.

 

I have a great tailor and albeit not cheap I like the results... The first thing was to see if the pockets could be removed and repositioned. Since they could my tailor shortened the sleeves, nipped the waist, hemmed the trousers and most importantly shortened the jacket. I decided to open the quarters and have them slightly more rounded.

 

Fresh out of the box. It covers the rear but is almost past my fingers. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And after the tailor had a go. It still covers my rear in an acceptable way and it looks a lot better from the front. The pockets were shortened one cm and ends just above the lower button which is slightly higher than before but not higher than several of my other patch pocket jackets. All and all the jacket was shortened about 4 cm. 

 

This light and airy suit in Loro Piana Zealander will be worn a lot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

post #26 of 34
Thread Starter 

@Anden 

 

Thanks for posting! The two sets of pictures nicely illustrate when something can feel just too long and when something is just right. Your tailor did a lovely job with the length and resetting the pockets. And, it looks like a lovely fabric for summer.

 

Please use it in a fit and post some pictures in the 10/5 thread!

 

@emptym 

@Murlsquirl 

@LA Guy 

 

Can we change the title of this thread to something that people searching for jacket length will find? Maybe something simple like "On Jacket Length". I think with Anden's post, the thread will actually be helpful to people, as this question is so often asked.

post #27 of 34

That suit looks great after the alterations.

 

Honestly, the original jacket length looks like it covered a lot more than just your ass. Could you possibly have an average torso and short arms? @Orgetorix has the same issue, it seems to me, although he has found a solution and always seems to look good.

post #28 of 34
Done
post #29 of 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by TweedyProf View Post
 

@Anden 

 

Thanks for posting! The two sets of pictures nicely illustrate when something can feel just too long and when something is just right. Your tailor did a lovely job with the length and resetting the pockets. And, it looks like a lovely fabric for summer.

 

I'm not 100% convinced. There's something not quite right about the altered jacket. I think it's that while the pockets have been moved successfully (being unable to do this is usually the main reason for not buying a jacket that is too long and having it shortened), the vents now look a little too short. I might be imagining things but it also looks like it's slightly longer in the front on the left than on the right - something, perhaps about Anden's shoulders or stance.

 

Overally, the tailor has done as good a job as is possible and it will look fine in use, but I would still still say, as a general rule, do not get a jacket shortened.


Edited by FlyingMonkey - 7/29/16 at 1:21pm
post #30 of 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingMonkey View Post
 

 

I might be imagining things but it also looks like it's slightling longer in the front on the left than on the right - something, perhaps about Anden's shoulders or stance.

 

I didn't notice that before but you're right, it does look off.

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