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Enzo Bonafe Handmade Shoes. - Page 181

post #2701 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevenmee View Post

Hey Mbaltazar, haven't really kept up but was this something you were still interested in?
Hey Kevenmee, yes I'm still interested in this make up, but no one else seemed interested on keep going...
post #2702 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by T4phage View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaves View Post

Enzo Bonafé Reverse Split Toe now Live

You asked for it, and we deliver. Enzo Bonafé's brand new style #3964 - a reverse Split Toe Derby. Pre-order is now live and will close February 26 (before the price increase).

Pre-order by following this link.
  • Style 3964 - Reverse Split Toe
  • 363 MOD last as pictured - please e-mail us for fitting advice
  • Bolet Calf (as pictured)
  • Single leather sole
  • Total price ex VAT: 4640 SEK * US price: $550
  • Deposit: 25% deposit, 75% before delivery

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)



The reason this style is slightly more expensive then regular shoes is the extra hand work involved in making the reverse split toe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThunderMarch View Post


.......Since EB only had that ONE guy doing the skin stitch, they restricted that style of split toe to the SkoaB EB "Dover" design they did a GMTO for some months ago.
In future, however, it might be able to happen. I sure hope so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThunderMarch View Post

I believe Patrik was actually referring to the stitching of the "reverse" split toe seam.....

all this talk of bonafe;s 'dover'
with reverse split toe seam
made me curious...

@Leaves do you
have a better pix of
teh toe
specifically of
teh stitching...
cause it is
not clear in
your announcement
poast

i found a pix
from one of
your collegue;s insta
of teh bonafe
reverse split toe:

2nlb5vq.jpg
sauce from patlof;s insta

from this pix
it seems to
be a different kind
of stitch from
eg's dover...
so if you would have
a clearer photo..

also teh apron
stitch is quite different
from what eg makes..
it is very similar
to crispins and not
as difficult as eg

thank you for
providing an
indirect answer to
my question poasted
above
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaves View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mockingboy View Post

Love the split toe; trying to hol doff but don't know if i can....

Main differences between the EG Dover and it are the stitching on the top of the shoe (not sure what you call it)?

The toe stitch appears to be the same, correct?

This version of Carmina Split Toe does not have a reverse split toe, which the Dover has. This version was actually developed especially for us, as we liked the visible stitch, like the Italians usually makes 'em.

EDIT: if you are referring to the Enzo Bonafé version, then, yes it's produced in a similar way as the Dover.

nao....
not to be
pedantic
but i want
to discuss
semantics......

what does..
"produced in a similar way"
mean
??

here is a photo
from a famed
japanese maker
(clicky linky
always in blue)
showing teh components
(excluding the heel counter)
of a dover shoe
and teh final
product:

zvvkew.jpg

note that the
prepwork for preparing
teh handstitching
for the difficult
apron stitch
and split to
has been done


and here is
a pix from
your salespage
Enzo_Bonafe_3964_Vitello_Bolet_363_mod_Last_4_1024x1024.jpg?v=1471337861

and a new one
from patlof's insta
of the incoming
preordered shoes:
14279089_1670930989902758_505615458_n.jpg?ig_cache_key=MTM0MzQ5MjM2MDE2NDAxNTk4MA%3D%3D.2


there has been no
clear photo of
teh toe so
far until now..
when teh owner
of the above shoe
poasted on instag:

1563ac9.jpg

now.....
this does
not appear
to be a real split toe....
(one that is made
of two separate pieces
and joined with
a very difficult
method of stitching
liek teh dover)
this looks like decorative
understitching
giving a
superficial illusion
of a split toe.

in addition
the apron stitch
is vastly different
from the difficult
method of teh
dover and its ilk..

the eb apron stitch is
like those found
in some of
tod;s loafers
eg:

14x30k6.jpg


and in some
meermin mto
such as this:

qodfye.jpg
to be fair
meermin does
have a true split toe



now back to
pendantry
and semantics
in what way
is teh eb
"produced in a similar way"
mean?

if the toe
is not two separate pieces
it changes drastically
the pattern of the shoe
upper

if the toe seam
is only decoration
it is of a much
lower magnitude of
difficulty in stitching
compared to
teh tunnel stitch
which is functional

the apron
stitch is evidently
different from
the much moar difficult
pie crust

i cannot see
where the
similarity of production
lies..

different pattern
different stitching
the only similiarity is
at a quick glance
for there
is none of teh technical
difficulties present...
(unless of course
eb is producing one
for your store
made exactly like
teh dover
but as yet no photos
exist)

shoemakers on
this forum who have
experience with these
kind of work
such as @ntempleman
who has just been making several
superb norwegian split toes
and @DWFII
and @shoefan
could maybe expand
on the type of stitching
Edited by T4phage - 9/23/16 at 6:13am
post #2703 of 2840
^^^^^spot on & well said T4phage this does not look any thing like Dover stitching
post #2704 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by T4phage View Post

?

here is a photo
from a famed
japanese maker
(clicky linky
always in blue)
showing teh components
(excluding the heel counter)
of a dover shoe
and teh final
product:

zvvkew.jpg



shoemakers on
this forum who have
experience with these
kind of work
such as @ntempleman
who has just been making several
superb norwegian split toes
and @DWFII
and [@shoefan[/@]
could maybe expand
on the type of stitching

The Japanese maker seems to be doing a true "split and lift" stitch on the apron and true "round closing" on a true split toe. Both techniques require considerable skill, specialized tools and a better grade of leather than more common techniques.

As for the "produced in a similar way" meme...I've been railing against deceptive advertising and pretense since I came on SF. It's not new...in a very real sense, it's actually the default in the Industry. And in all honesty, the prevalence of it is probably the only thing that makes contributions such as mine (and other bona fide shoemakers on the forum) worthwhile. Of course, curious, energetic minds and a willing-to-learn audience are critical. Otherwise it's all fools gold...fancy boxes and magpie glitter...and who cares? If the price is right.

edited for punctuation and clarity
Edited by DWFII - 9/23/16 at 6:26am
post #2705 of 2840

Here is a clear drawing made by member shoemaker Nicholas Templeman wich shows different techniques for stitching the apron.

 

From the pic T4 posted (patlof Inst EB) it seems to me uses a Split Raised Lake rather than a Pie Crust technique (Dover) for the apron, not stitching different pieces of the upper.

 

Furtheremore, the toe stitching of patlof  at Insta seems to me  to be fake (maybe some kind of interior reinforcement simulating kind of interior stitching during lasting).  They do not joint pieces of leather either and there is no skin stitch or round closing stitch at all.,

 

 

 

Just my thoughts from those pics.

 

PD.-DW I think the Japanese maker was using Pie Crust stitching technique for the apron and round closing for the toe, just like the Dover.

post #2706 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapasman View Post

.

PD.-DW I think the Japanese maker was using Pie Crust stitching technique for the apron and round closing for the toe, just like the Dover.

I may be wrong but I believe "split and lift" is the older, more Traditional, term for "pie crust" stitching.
post #2707 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapasman View Post



.....From the pic T4 posted (patlof Inst EB) it seems to me uses a Split Raised Lake rather than a Pie Crust technique (Dover) for the apron, not stitching different pieces of the upper.....
look again
teh bonafe apron is a separate piece
look carefully
if you don't see it
look again
and again

wanna clue
?
look under teh laces

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapasman View Post


.....Furtheremore, the toe stitching of patlof at Insta seems to me to be fake (maybe some kind of interior reinforcement simulating kind of interior stitching during lasting). They do not joint pieces of leather either and there is no skin stitch or round closing stitch at all.....
good to know
that you learnt
something...
since your poast
below:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapasman View Post

Ît seems to me that shoe has a "skin stiched toe" exactly like the Dover. The aprons are executed differently: The lake of the Dover has is a "pie crust stitching" whereas the lake of the EB has a "split raised stitching".
was in reply
to my previous
post
which already
showed
the lack of
a split toe....
post #2708 of 2840
^ See this link if you want a more detailed and more authoritative perspective.
Quote:
As the name implies, this seam "splits" the hold on the edge of one piece, and actually digs into the surface, then up and out on the other, hence "lift".

(from one of the world's foremost shoe historians and a certified Master Shoemaker)

edited for punctuation and clarity
post #2709 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


I may be wrong but I believe "split and lift" is the older, more Traditional, term for "pie crust" stitching.

Well, I am afraid I have no enough knowledge to discuss that with you.:)

post #2710 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

......Of course, curious, energetic minds and a willing-to-learn audience are critical......
ahhh..
and where
may they be
in teh land
of
multi kopterism

Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

.....Otherwise it's all fools gold...fancy boxes and magpie glitter...and who cares? If the price is right.
=D
teh lifeblood
of many....
suckers
post #2711 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapasman View Post

Well, I am afraid I have no enough knowledge to discuss that with you.smile.gif

See post #2708 if you want more knowledge.
post #2712 of 2840
Wow, what a great discussion!

I will edit my previous post, I have confess that I am a bit confused myself about the construction. Bonafè has been experimenting with different ways to make a split toe, and I've seen many different versions, hence my confusion. My post was not intended to mislead anyone, feel free to call me stupid or ignorant or whatever, but it was not intentional.

Have a great weekend!
post #2713 of 2840
I have a pair incoming today. Look forward to wearing them.

What would accurately describe the style? Apron toe with a mock split?
post #2714 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by yanagi View Post

I have a pair incoming today. Look forward to wearing them.

What would accurately describe the style? Apron toe with a mock split?

Congrats. They are a gorgeous pair.
post #2715 of 2840
Quote:
Originally Posted by T4phage View Post


look again
teh bonafe apron is a separate piece
look carefully
if you don't see it
look again
and again

wanna clue
?
look under teh laces
good to know
that you learnt
something...
since your poast
below:
was in reply
to my previous
post
which already
showed
the lack of
a split toe....

Firt of all, you should calm down;  it seems like pretencious guy for trivial things is triying to teach others. I might have been wrong in my responses to you due to the fact of bad pics of the EB that were shown before/here, that is why I posted and frequently post "It seems to me" (I m not at all an expert like you claim to be). Pics are pics and everyone has the right to give an opinion and still be wrong.  

 

Second when somebody ask any question and gets answered, I always thank the action taken, even if the answer could be wrong. 

 

 You should improve your education and be just a bit humble to improve your "learning classes". 

 

Hope

tha

teacher

learnt

something

too.

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